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Toppan
25-09-2006, 05:02
i hope the mods dont kick me lol...

ok so here it is. the official unofficial mordheim discussion. here we can talk about our favorite mordheim related doohickies. i particularly love people talking about their warbands...and mordheim battle reports are awesome when done right.

so yeah...random happenings...totally awesome. my leader, a maneater-kin (because i use the unofficial ogre warband rules), took down the itsy bitsy spider with 1 wound left...twas insane...oh wait i forgot my butcher helped...and i think he got the exp too :(. then one of my runts died from screaming walls...s2...t4...with armor saves...just sad

anyone have any experience in any of the other campaign settings? like empire in flames, lustria, or khemri? im thinking of starting a campaign based in one of those.

so what about yall? do you have anything mordheimy to talk about? an experimental warband perhaps? or a new scenario? i would LOVE to see one of those.

otherwise...see you in the city of the damned ;)

Imperial Stormtrooper
26-09-2006, 04:40
I dont play YET, but i am going to get a Possessed Warband. I am starting because of a few guys at my GW are starting Mordheim on sundays, and i think it will be fun. Are possessed any good? I dont exactly know, but i would like your opinion of the warband.

Wargamejunkie
26-09-2006, 14:43
I too want to start playing, but I will wait till I get back to the U.S.A.

bob syko
26-09-2006, 17:59
In one of the few games of mordheim I played when I was in school my witch hunters took out 3 guys in the first turn and then my opponent ran away, it was quite annoying since in stead of just quitting the game he moved all of his warriors to the end of the table away from my mainly CC warband He did it twice on the run, I never played against him again.

Toppan
26-09-2006, 22:40
i cant reccomend or consider any warband. you cannot powergame in mordheim...and if you find a way to...shame on you

i started out with orks just to get a feel for the game, am trying out an experimental ogre warband right now, and am probably going to try out pirates too.

i think everyone should play mordheim. its the most fun game ever, better than 40k at least

Dark Apostle197
26-09-2006, 23:29
i cant reccomend or consider any warband. you cannot powergame in mordheim...and if you find a way to...shame on you




Lol now I HAVE to find a way

Radical Inquisitor
27-09-2006, 00:32
I have recently started Mordheim and have been playing Undead with some success (hurray Vampires). I want to play a more complex army though and I was thinking Dark Elves as we already have a Shadow Hunters Player. I was thinking of a list something like this...

High Born-Sea Dragon Cloak, Dark Elf Blade
2xFellblades- Swords
Sorceress- Repeater Crossbow, Dark Elf Sword
1xShade-Sword
2xShade-Repeater Crossbows

Comments would be appreciated

Morathi's Darkest Sin
27-09-2006, 02:21
Eris and I have an on off campaign running at the mo.. my Undead and Sisters, v's her Rieklanders and Beastmen... (not fighting together of course, just running two bands so it doesn't get stale.)

Its been quite good so far, with Riktor von Struka my Vampire just getting to that point no one wants to end up in close combat against him (well, if he hits) even the Beastman's Minotaur... and Eris' Rieklanders are just getting to that point shooting wise I ponder if would be better just to bottle off before a dice is rolled (not that I would even if I could.. but the thought is there.) :)

Love the game though and have done since it first came out, and I'm slowly getting our new Mordheim terrain done as well... (I sold off most of our original set before we moved in 04') our centre piece is going to be a shattered church and its about 50% compleate - basically it's shell is there, just need detailing.

Quin 242
27-09-2006, 03:00
i cant reccomend or consider any warband. you cannot powergame in mordheim...and if you find a way to...shame on you
One of the warbands that comes in the game is seriously overpowered for the cost. Skaven are Uber everthing for limited points. Compare the stats of skaven to the equivalent heros from any other warband and you will see that they get bonus stats for less cost. They also start with up to the full 6 heros instead of the 4-5 of every other warband.
They have MULTIPLE ways to get extra attacks on the first upgrade. (attacks being CRUCIAL to HtH success)
They have massive movement and Initiative so they can't be shot before hiding into charge range. (i.e. moving while hiding) and then add to this that they have slings which, when grouped en-mass, are a hail of death.
They have the M to get into double shot sling range (9") and fire. then when you fail to be able to charge them (M avg being 4), they can back up another 5-6" and do it again. If they start slinging you at 18" then it's a long day to get into combat with them. I figure with them moving back as they fire, the average warband is going to take something like 5-6 volleys as the skaven withdraw and shoot each time.
Soo.. yeah for cheese... look to the rat men (kinda funny huh?)



i think everyone should play mordheim. its the most fun game ever, better than 40k at least

And I agree that it's fun and fast. It's nifty to watch your warband increase in stats and skills and it's fun to model your warband as it grows up. I don't know that it's better than 40K but it has a different feel and style. It could almost be played as a role playing game with the right people involved.

RedShirt
27-09-2006, 04:33
I've always enjoyed Mordheim (when it came out I was known as having the unkillable warband....over some 20+ games I only lost 2 hirlings when rolling on the injury charts. Final game I lost 12 of my 15 members during the fight...not a single one died and my Captain 'Survived against the odds')

It's something you can pick up and play quickly and each warband has it's own style and character.

Toppan
28-09-2006, 04:59
oh trust me...my ogre bull was felled by slings...so...very...sad
i didnt know skaven were cheesy...i sort of thought them kind of cruddy...

anywho...im starting a pirate warband. i know im going to use the free company sprue...but to strive for uniqueness...thats only 4 pirates (4 torsos).

let me give you a rundown of my starter list, everyone has free daggers by the way
captain: brace of duelling pistols, 2 cutlasses, tough leather
mate: pistol, cutlass, dagger, leather
mate: pistol, 2 cat o' nine tails, leather
cabin boy: 2 handed sword, leather
cabin boy: axe, mace, leather
2x crew: belaying pins, cutlasses, leather
gunner: handgun, dagger, leather
499gc

i was considering giving everyone a ranged weapon in the army...but i think i went overboard on the captain. 145gc right there, but the pistols...rock...so...much. plus theyre fluffy.

anyway, onto the models. the crew, and the cabin boys will be made from the free company sprue. the sword dagger mate will be one of vespero's vendetta.

as for the others, i need help. i cannot find a captain with 2 swords/pistols. i suppose i could buy a soldiers of the empire sprue, but some of the poofy pants bother me. the command sprue has some cool legs and stuff though, but the heads... as for the whip-mate...any suggestions? i know i need to convert, but from who?

Dark Apostle197
28-09-2006, 05:06
Maybe take http://store.us.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.us?do=Individual&code=99061102024&orignav=300816&ParentID=9884&GameNav=300808&ItemNav=303938 for the captain. The second one. Cut off the torch and swap for a sword? then green stuff a pirate hat? :) hope it helped, if not... Good luck.

Quin 242
28-09-2006, 06:17
let me give you a rundown of my starter list, everyone has free daggers by the way
captain: brace of duelling pistols, 2 cutlasses, tough leather
mate: pistol, cutlass, dagger, leather
mate: pistol, 2 cat o' nine tails, leather
cabin boy: 2 handed sword, leather
cabin boy: axe, mace, leather
2x crew: belaying pins, cutlasses, leather
gunner: handgun, dagger, leather
499gc

Only problem is that Toughened leathers are not available til your first trading session. Or is this some homegrown list?
What the heck is a cabin BOY doing with a 2 handed sword? he should have the belaying pins or the deadly two-handed MOP :)

Toppan
28-09-2006, 23:52
no...its not homegrown. the only armor pirates get is toughened leather, and the list is on the mordheim site. i updated my stuff by the way
captain: duelling pistol(or brace of pistols...hmm), 2 cutlasses, tough leather
mate: pistol, cutlass, dagger, leather
mate: 2 cat o' nine tails, leather
cabin boy: hammer, dagger, leather
cabin boy: axe, mace, leather
2x crew: belaying pins, cutlasses, daggers, leather
gunner: handgun, dagger, leather
boatswain: 2 handed weapon, leather
500gc

my first idea for this list was to have a ton of gunpowder crazed loonies, but then the idea evolved into a band of buccaneers...not the crazy ruffian type however...the honorable type.

now...after a couple battles im probably going to buy everyone pistols...hehe
what do yall think about the duelling pistol v. brace of pistols? 2 shots at 6...1 shot at 10 with +1 to hit? i think the duelling pistol is honestly better...plus i dont have to roll for rarity. and its fluffy!
i know i want a parrot too...

and now onto the subject of models. help me out here...free company torsos...thats only 4 pirates! the empire command sprue has some nice legs, so thats about 2-3 more pirates, with the captain and the sw/dg mate in metal, and the handgunner covered by the command sprue stuff...will it work out?

also, i dont want to use that model, my friend has a witchhunter warband and that is his captain i believe. that other captain model, however...looks awesome.

Dark Apostle197
28-09-2006, 23:59
Yeah, but it doesn't have a pistol. So, are your pirates the type that leave women alone, just take money and don't kill unless needed? If so I would say dueling pistols. If they are the "rape, plunder, kill" type, I think the prace is more fluffy. Pirates usually had more than one pistol, so they wouldn't have to reload.

Cerberus
29-09-2006, 04:24
High Born-Sea Dragon Cloak, Dark Elf Blade
2xFellblades- Swords
Sorceress- Repeater Crossbow, Dark Elf Sword
1xShade-Sword
2xShade-Repeater Crossbows

Comments would be appreciated

A few general things first. Only 7 models starting off is a bad idea. Especially seeing as the dark elves are so expensive and if your opponent outnumbers you then they can gang up on one model and kill them off easily, and it's bad news if you have to be buying back warband members from the first game at on average 50gcs a pop. The fact that you have more heroes than henchmen means that they're more likely to be put out of action in a game, and therefore less money to buy stuff with (like dead outnumbered guys)!

I've played a few campaigns with my dark elf warband and i've found that shades are a big fat waste of space. 30gcs plus another 35 for a repeater crossbow is just stupid. 75gcs for an average henchman that hits maybe twice every game?!:wtf: (not to mention how long it would take to save up to buy a replacement if one gets killed!)

For 35 gcs you can get a corsair. Corsairs rock. Simple as that. Their stats are better than pretty much any starting henchman. Hitting mostly on 3s and with I6 you never have to worry about climbing or spotting or anything like that. 10gcs for a spear and you're gonna be striking first in combat no matter what. Bargain. I usually start with 5 or 6.

I tend to have two fellblades, one with two swords for easy killing, and one with a double-handed weapon in case your opponent has any big nasties like ogres or possessed. Put him behind two spear weilding corsairs so you can make sure he always gets the charge in.

Never tried giving my sorceress a crossbow. It could work I suppose but she'll still usually be hitting on 6's (firing twice) on a board with a decent amount of terrain on it. I'd be inclined to just give her a spear and let her follow behind the warband trying to cast spells every turn

Sea Dragon Cloaks rock and giving your highborn one to start off with will probably keep you alive, but consider 50gcs would get you another armed corsair with 5 left over, or even a beastmaster so you could start with your full complement of heroes.

Hope that helps!

Fastforward rlz
01-10-2006, 17:32
Gosh toppan you should've told me you made a mordheim thread!! I am the "commander" after all...lol ok so I'm going to make the mordheim board for our gameing group and I have some things I'd like yall to look over. Ok does textured wallpaper (cobble stone texture) sound good for the streets? And Foam core? Usefull for building buildings? I'm thinking nonmodular board but modular "footprints" for buildings so the streets will stay the same but the buildings can change location. or I could cover the entire board with the wallpaper and set up buildings normally. :D

TheHood
02-10-2006, 03:04
I haven't played Mordheim in a few years now. When my old gaming group started out I had a Skaven warband and it was very effective and remained unbeaten for nearly a year of campaigning. Certainly, it is one of the easiest and most effective of the rulebook warbands to use...

After a few years away from gaming as a whole, the old group are coming back together for a new Mordheim campaign. I'm thinking of starting an Undead band, but one that is led by a Strigoi Vampire rather than a Von Carstein, as I feel that the band list is more in character with the Strigoi background.

Should be a lot of fun. Certainly be good to get the dice rolling again after a few years.

Cheers

Hercco
02-10-2006, 07:05
Mordheim is a great game if you get a good campaign going on. For me good campaign means that there would be decent amount of active players with painted warbands and enough good looking terrain available.

Last time I was invited to join a Mordheim campaign, it failed most of my requirements. There was a lot of players, but they showed up really infrequently and they all had unpainted models in their warbands and really showed no interest in getting them painted. It's like 10 models, how hard can it be! I hauled my Mordheim ruins over there (come to think about it, should get them back...) and the terrain was decent, although little basing and painting wouldn't have hurt.

My point is, unless you got a good group of enthusiastic players, Mordheim isn't worth it. Otherwise, it's a brilliant game.

TKitch
03-10-2006, 17:49
*cracks knuckes*

Now we're gettin into my kinda discussion.

Afternoon folks, I'd like to introduce myself, and proclaim myself a Mordheim God. That shadowlord guy? Yeah, he ain't nothin.

I'm where it's at.

BTW: Powergaming in mordheim. Quite easily done.

1) Skaven Slings o Doom. 17 rats w Slings and second daggers.

2) Dark Elves. Start with awesome stats and slowly increase by firing heroes and ladding Corsairs with RXB's and master of poisons.

3) Shadow Warriors - Elven artillery. 12-14 BS4-5 models with Longbows to Elven bows and spears (Or two hand weapons and lightning reflexes).

4) Sisters of Sigmar. (Yes, Sisters.) All 5 heroes and 10 Sisters with daggers and slings or, trade some sisters to novices and get whips for the heroines.



Oomph. (Yes, I know this game inside and out.)

Toppan
04-10-2006, 03:22
so...what is the best building material to make mordheim buildings out of? and how big should they be? me and fastforward are planning on a table and need quite a quantity of multi level buildings.

as for me, what bits from whfb classic, necromunda, 40k, 40k classic, whfb or any other games could you reccomend that look piratey? and what could i make a rope and hook out of for my boatswain(s)?

so i have a warband coming in the mail, and im so happy. ive already decided on the names and everything. i dont have the colors, but i think reds, blues, whites, blacks...pretty much any color will go...no? and for hired swords...dwarf slayer pirate all the way.

lastly...swivel guns...i was thinking taking the empire great cannon and its brace, strapping it to a burly looking body and loading the model with bags and such for ammo.

Etienne de Beaugard
04-10-2006, 03:26
I found my old boxes of Mordheim minis while I was moving last week. Mordheim was likely the most fun I ever had with a GW game. It was fast, had great terrain, and you didn't have to sell body parts to get enough money for a warband.

The biggest problem we had was when campaigns went on too long. Our first campaign had a bunch of dominant players including a really tough Ork band with lots of crossbows, some mean witchhunters, and my skaven. The three players of these bands got tired of playing each other, but the bands were so developed, new players would get trounced within a couple of turns.

Even with the rules for 'evening up' games with extra warriors didn't help, as the stronger band would run amok within the ranks, getting XP for kills. Did anyone ever come up with functional rules for balancing out games between uneven warbands?

Toppan
04-10-2006, 05:01
me and fastforward have also come up with a conclusion. mordheim is THE game. it doesnt have the scifi like 40k or as many xenos, but it has the squads. it doesnt have the tight knit groups of warriors like fantasy but it does have a select few good men.

and lastly

HOUSE RULES

mordheim is THE game for house rules. make up whatever you want, get consent and run with it. the rulebook practically TELLS you to. you cant do such things in 40k or fantasy with ease.

so you need balance...well how much xp are we talking? near retirement? then i say the experienced warband sets up in reserves each game to show how grizzled and lonesome they have become. if we're talking middle game, just give the other warband an extra advance on each warrior and maybe some extra money. nothing too fancy, and if it doesnt work out, try again.

Fastforward rlz
04-10-2006, 22:08
That's a very good option i think...So what's a good way to end a campaign?? i was thinking wyrdstone or maby a big big fight!!! :evilgrin:

Urgok
04-10-2006, 23:45
Both mordheim and 40k kinda cheat off of real life though.:eyebrows:

Dark Apostle197
04-10-2006, 23:52
Yup, lots of 7 foot tall guys running around with semi auto 75 cal assault rifles... :P

Gen.Steiner
04-10-2006, 23:53
Urgok - what? Makes no sense.

My favourite Warband, and one that is currently being built using mostly other company's figures, is the Undead.

10 Zombies.
Tooled-up Vampire (shield, heavy armour, helmet, sword)
Necromancer with sword
3 Dregs with bows and axes

500gc exactly, IIRC. :D

Ten zombies! Meatshield extraordinaire...!

Urgok
05-10-2006, 00:24
What i mean is if you read the fluff of some of the warbands and armies they will have stuff that is real in real life.

Toppan
05-10-2006, 03:29
oh my god...they dont make everything up? WHAT???

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

get a grip urgok, this is a fantasy game. if everything tried to make up its own rules, then EVERYTHING WOULD SUCK.

in this game you can practically do whatever you want. and if you couldnt...where would the fun be?

Gen.Steiner
05-10-2006, 10:01
Um. Also, er, the concept of a 'sword' or 'helmet' is pretty universal... I mean, there are ratmen who use magically-radioactive lumps of a moon in their weapons, and elves, Orcs, Dwarves... what more do you want made up? :p

Anyway, here's an amusing tale for you ...

My Mordheim City Watch warband (Reiklander rules, for that +1 BS on the marksmen, yummy), is led by an 'ard nut - heavy armour, shield, helmet, sword, club (of office).

The only problem is, he's massively injury prone. :p Stupid, Injured Leg... the list goes on. If he remembers what he's supposed to be doing, and he catches you (-1 for heavy armour, -1 for his gammy leg, total movement 2"!), he'll kill you. I could've retired him, but he's too funny! :D

Fastforward rlz
05-10-2006, 23:04
Hahaha that's funny. Oh and dont mind Urgok...that's bylan....

Chiron
06-10-2006, 14:02
Even with the rules for 'evening up' games with extra warriors didn't help, as the stronger band would run amok within the ranks, getting XP for kills. Did anyone ever come up with functional rules for balancing out games between uneven warbands?

what about setting up more scenarios? A couple of the gang members go for a beer and wind up getting ambushed afterwards? or just limit the number of fighters. A good one from Necromunda is the gang ends up in the middle of nowhere surrounded by Zombies, there everywhere and the gang has to fight there way out... only someone forgot the map :D

I adore Mordheim, wish I could find someone to play it with though...

Fastforward rlz
10-10-2006, 02:46
that sounds really good. maby calculateing a warband ratting for thoes few guys and maby no exploration for them eigther cause they're not looking for any you know

TKitch
10-10-2006, 04:58
The underdeog rules aren't designed to Balance out a warband craziness rating issue.

The only band that has any saving grace for that is Sisters, as they can beg Bertha to come kick ass for them. (And believe me, if she shows, she REALLY does kick some ass for you.)

The underdog thing is a bonus after the fact for the crappy band, so they grow more advanced quickly. I've started a warband, and after 2 underdog games before, I had gone up something insane like 100+ rating points. (+3 underdog twice, plus normal XP). It was crazy, I had mad skills on my warriors after that.

Fastforward rlz
11-10-2006, 02:36
sounds awesome lol. I'd play like treasure hunt or something so that you dont have a mass slaughter hopefully lol atleast not occupy hahaha

Gen.Steiner
11-10-2006, 19:52
But mass slaughter is so fun...!

McMullet
11-10-2006, 23:12
Not to mention being inevitable. 90% of the MH games I've ever played consists of diligently reading the scenario specific rules and victory conditions, then running into the centor of the board for a big scrap until someone fails a bottle test and legs it. Voluntarily routing? No thanks, not while this youngblood's still on his feet! 5 Zombies and a Vampire? BRING IT!

I had a comedy injured leader too, though he was never any good. I gave him shooting skills (pretty much the only advances he ever got - many thereof - except the +1 Ld that got him the job of leader and +1 S which is wasted on a guy with a crossbow), but he ultimately got blinded in both eyes (we decided he was too much of a character to let him retire), a chest wound (T2 leader FTW!), a brain injury (stupidity, he always failed the test and blundered over the edges of high buildings), and finally a missing arm. I think he may have a had a gammy leg but I forget now. Good ol' Hacker Argyll.

snurl
12-10-2006, 07:08
I had a comedy injured leader too, though he was never any good. I gave him shooting skills (pretty much the only advances he ever got - many thereof - except the +1 Ld that got him the job of leader and +1 S which is wasted on a guy with a crossbow), but he ultimately got blinded in both eyes (we decided he was too much of a character to let him retire), a chest wound (T2 leader FTW!), a brain injury (stupidity, he always failed the test and blundered over the edges of high buildings), and finally a missing arm. I think he may have a had a gammy leg but I forget now. Good ol' Hacker Argyll.

Was his name "Lucky" ?

Quin 242
12-10-2006, 11:52
Sounds like my SOS matriarch.. first 3 games she got -1 Initiative, Head wound: frenzy and then head wound: stupid. She's on point to being totally worthless REAL quick.

Etienne de Beaugard
12-10-2006, 12:15
The underdog thing is a bonus after the fact for the crappy band, so they grow more advanced quickly. I've started a warband, and after 2 underdog games before, I had gone up something insane like 100+ rating points. (+3 underdog twice, plus normal XP). It was crazy, I had mad skills on my warriors after that.

I've never seen it work like that. Usually, the more experienced team got a ton of XP for the kills on the temporary band and won the game, thus getting any scenario specific goodies. The underdogs got XP, but not nearly as much as the experienced player, who then got "Mad, Mad Ninja Skillz!!!@!";) ;) for all his warriors

TKitch
12-10-2006, 18:46
the more experienced player can't get as much XP as the lesser one.

He's only getting 1 for surviving, plus heroes get XP for kills.


If you're at 100+ rating down, you're getting +1 for surviving, +3 for underdog, plus any extras you can wheedle out.

If you've got 12 warriors that's 48+XP in a single fight! What's the issue?

if the underdog player is dumb enough to stick around till the bitter end, well, yeah, you're going to lose. That's inevitable when taking on such a vastly superior band. However, when you play to snag a couple of objective XP if available, and possibly gang up on a couple opponents and route when able, then you're going to come out much better.

Fastforward rlz
12-10-2006, 22:27
yes statistically that's how it is but you cant always crunch the numbers. remember it's just a game!!!

Toppan
14-10-2006, 08:17
so, after reading the old warband rules for ogres...i realized a lot of it was dumb and made barely any sense. the gut magic...for example...incredibly broken. you could cast all day if you had the ingredients. plus, the meaning wasnt too clear.

so im making my own. since the warband itself is experimental, theres no problem i dont think.

things such as runt genepools and gnoblar breeds will appear, and so will ogre slings. stay tuned.

Foot_of_adhesive_tape
15-10-2006, 04:26
Seeing this is the mordheim discussion thing anyone know the rules for a rapier? or know where i would be able to find them?

-Foot

TKitch
15-10-2006, 04:37
www.mordheimer.com

good place to find a ton of useful gubbins.

Foot_of_adhesive_tape
15-10-2006, 06:57
Thanks. this is a great site might have to try out some of these warbands, the woodelves look like fun.

-Foot

Fastforward rlz
16-10-2006, 03:19
Yeah that site's really awesome lol At school it's not blocked so i always go there hahhaha yeah i can't wait to fight against the "new and improved" ogers haahha

Foot_of_adhesive_tape
16-10-2006, 10:58
haha ogers seem like a fun and differnt warband to play as.
lol i was playing my friends undead warband today and his vamp tryed a diving charge at one of my elves from two storys up and he failed all his rolls and took him completly OOA, then he got muliple injuries in the serious injuries chart, what he got was.. robbed(good bye to his Heavy armour and halberd), chest wound and a smashed leg and now can no longer run. unluckey(luckey for me;) ) roll's eh? lol.

-Foot

TKitch
16-10-2006, 15:08
I make no guarantees about any of their experimental bands on there. I've seen a couple posted up there in the past that were horribly not balanced at all, so take any of them with a grain of salt.

It's a great site, and the owner is all sorts of awesome, but just a warning!

Gen.Steiner
16-10-2006, 17:31
Sounds like my SOS matriarch.. first 3 games she got -1 Initiative, Head wound: frenzy and then head wound: stupid. She's on point to being totally worthless REAL quick.

Stupid... frenzied... slow... and funny! :D

Toppan
17-10-2006, 05:51
see, my second mate crovax went OOA in my last battle...first time for him. what got me pissed was his amputated arm. well, seeing as he has...what 2 more experience or so higher than base and not very good gear on...i rehired him. a pirate without an arm is of no use to the captain.

anyway, has anyone came up with some kickass fluff for their warband? im really working on mine...the captain is obsessed with gold...and goes to find wyrdstone to convert him some more.

model wise, all the metallic weapons in my army are painted bronzey gold, captains orders. they also all have different poses, accessories, heads and the like. nothing pisses me off more than twin models...gah.

my friends CoC army has so many duplicates i cry a little when i play against him, but i think hes about to change...which is good.

what about yall?

Foot_of_adhesive_tape
17-10-2006, 06:53
That pirate warband sounds coolI haven't got any fluff or anything but i might think about trying to make something up.



my friends CoC army has so many duplicates i cry a little when i play against him, but i think hes about to change...which is good.


duplicates suck. i love having all my models look totally different from one another.

-Foot

Dark Apostle197
19-10-2006, 22:01
Bump(can't let the post die)

TKitch
19-10-2006, 22:03
I've got some inclinations of getting some work done this weekend on my CoC warband.

Slaanesh Styled!

*grins* it's gonna be good!

Dark Apostle197
19-10-2006, 22:11
Ooo... sounds dirty :)

TKitch
19-10-2006, 22:13
heh, go into my gallery (check my sig.)

you have no idea how right you are. *grins*

Disclaimer: I take no responsibility to any mental or physical trauma you suffer by finding the pics I'm refering to.

Dark Apostle197
19-10-2006, 22:15
I think I already have looked at it now that I think about it, i'll check though(closes eyes)

Dark Apostle197
19-10-2006, 22:17
Yup....*huddles in corner*

TKitch
19-10-2006, 22:18
can't blame me!

I not only warned you, I even had a disclaimer!

Dark Apostle197
19-10-2006, 22:25
Nah, the first time was a surpise, expecially the chick with a (insert rhyming word here) lol.

Fastforward rlz
22-10-2006, 02:50
hahaha so yeah I'm we're going to change some things for our next campaign. Fist for all everyone has to write like atleast half a page of storyline for their warband and second of all we're going to have store only warbands. also we'll use the emcampments optional rules and blazing sadels. I think battle reports will be optional cause they're fun and we'll post them on the myspace :-) any other sugestions?

Gen.Steiner
22-10-2006, 11:49
If you have a GM, I insist that you make his warband the Mordheim City Watch. :p

"Oi! You're nicked!"
"But... but... the city's a blazing, warped ruin!"
"An' the law is the law. You're nicked for trespass, breach of the peace, insulting the Emperor, driving on the wrong side of the road, brawling, murder, mayhem, alcoholism, etc etc"

TKitch
22-10-2006, 17:42
declare someone to be the rules god. Preferably 2 people. That way if one is in the game, the other can rule. It's very useful to have around.

Otherwise, just have fun with it. Toning down skaven can't hurt, they're an overpowered band.

Dark Apostle197
23-10-2006, 02:42
Played my first game today in the league we have! It was a mega battle type thing with about 10 people playing. The middle table was full of wyrd stone with tree that attack. I got 21 wyrdstone by the end of the game lol. My captain is str 4(pistols are a waste now.. or close atleast) My priest has unstopable charge. One of my witch hunters has the one that give +1 to injury rolls(strike to injure i think?), and another has pistolier. My zealots are now str 4 too(wish I had more)

TKitch
23-10-2006, 04:19
you can buy more zealots :)

just 2GC per XP to hire new ones into that group! :)

21 Wyrdstone? WTF?!?!?!

Toppan
23-10-2006, 05:04
seriously...what the hell
the chart doesnt even go up that far

did you mean 21 exp?

and could you be more specific about the scenario? was it "a stroll through the garden" or some such?

anyway, the ogre warband is complete. ive yet to playtest it, and i will post it up here if yall want, for critique of course.

TKitch
23-10-2006, 05:05
Wyrdstone hunt most likely.

D3 warpstone shards PER WARBAND on the table, but that's still insane.

Dark Apostle197
23-10-2006, 05:14
Yeah I know. it was the most rediculous one there was, totally unfair IMHO. i had the highest war band rating, got to send up in a good position, while everyone was fighting I took 15 wyrdstone. Got 3 more from finishing the mission, then 3 from exploration. It wasn't 21 XP. 5 was the max I got and that was on my WH captain who got 4 wyrdstone(which in the mission you got XP for). I didn't like the mission too much(too hot out, i was too ungry) and after getting 15 of the 30 on the table, I sent my dogs to die so I could voluntarily route and get it over with. the winner of the game only got 5 wyrds lol. I didn't like it because, for a league, it could easilly make it one sided. in coming battles. Like if I play this kid who got wiped out and got no wyrdstone, he would really be fighting with almost the same one as he started, when I have a decent one, from just one battle. I have 126 gp(gotta pay for where you stay in the league) and 13 wyrd stone to sell, thats 2-3 game worth of not needing to really worry... at all. While he has like no gp at all...

Dark Apostle197
23-10-2006, 05:15
Oh, and I got the cookbook I needed, the halfling also gave me a map(he was using the merchant rule thing and it is a random event..) I am probabaly going to get the halfling(didn't use, no model at the time) and 2 more zealots, then a ranger for exploration. then eventually, a pit fighting(that's legal right? i can have that many hired swords, or did I miss something?)

Toppan
23-10-2006, 05:44
nope, one hired sword per warband i think.
so yall want the ogre warband or what lol...im itchin for criticism
and would you want it posted word for word (10 pages lol) or in a zip?

Dark Apostle197
23-10-2006, 05:45
send it via e-mail? jhoogenstryd@yahoo.com

Dark Apostle197
23-10-2006, 05:48
Just read up, it is one of EACH hired swords, so I can have a ranger, cook, and pit fighter. Just realized that would mean loosing lots of money do to upkeep... i want a ranger though lol... Maybe I'll be able to do it.

TKitch
23-10-2006, 10:14
Bzzzzt! Nope!

You can have as many hired swords as you can pay for floating around. Limit of 1 of any kind at a time, though.

Hey, post the warband, why not>?

Gen.Steiner
23-10-2006, 10:28
Sounds like quite good fun, but I always thought that in campaigns, mega battles of more than three players were reserved for the last battle...?

Or is that just me?

Dark Apostle197
23-10-2006, 21:59
It is the first, maybe he hoped the Xp would be more evenly distributed and make the league games more interesting... My warband was the same one in the "witch hunter army list" post minus the halfling. My favorite is the witch hunter with a blind eye, but extra acurracy in combat :)...(strike to injure)

Dark Apostle197
23-10-2006, 22:17
Question. With the hiring of new henchmen to existing experienced groups, it is 2 points for each XP they need to catch up? I.E if the group has 5 Xp, it will be 10 points each to join?

TKitch
23-10-2006, 23:29
That is correct.

And don't forget about the "2D6 available experience" roll either.

Toppan
23-10-2006, 23:33
ok guys. it was too big to post so i put it in a rapidshare.
also, the fluff needs help, and i would love to see some ;)

http://rapidshare.com/files/422223/Butcher_Warband.doc

Dark Apostle197
23-10-2006, 23:57
Sorry Tkitch, but what do you mean?

TKitch
24-10-2006, 02:03
After each battle, during one of the post game steps (The order is in the latest LRB or the Rules Review.)

One of the phases is "Look for Available Recruits" and you roll 2D6. The result represents the experience pool available to your warband. You can recruit up to that many XP worth of henchmen after the fight.

This is all covered in the "Campaign" section of the book. (Post Battle Sequence)

Fastforward rlz
24-10-2006, 02:42
Ahh the butcher warband...I'm going to look forward to playtesting them here in a little bit. Oh and In my campaigns every saturday we have large multiplayer battles :-) they're lots of fun

Dark Apostle197
24-10-2006, 05:34
Oo ok thanks

Fastforward rlz
30-10-2006, 23:27
so yeah playtested them and they seemed ok. some minor changes were made. ex. harpon xbow is move or fire since it's and oger and in wfb they can move or fire. also the spell collosol last d3 turns now

Dark Apostle197
30-10-2006, 23:42
Woohoo! I am not the highest warband anymore. We had another event and well, the highest warband "got" to set up in the middle of a table... with no cover. I had a non agression pact with a VC and skaven player which was amusing, and the only way I would not get ganged up on by 3 armies(lizardmen were around). On the middle table I allied with a dwarf player so we could pick up treasure and get out before the vampires and skaven came. We then said "hey, we just want to get off the table, if you move towards us, we will make sure we at the very least take half of your remaining warband out of action... They then moved away and we went on. 3 dogs killed a flying minotaur(random event when picking up the treasure)

Fastforward rlz
31-10-2006, 01:53
hahahhaha omg that's funny! was it ambush or wizards mansion??

Dark Apostle197
31-10-2006, 02:00
I dunno, there were three table, we were allowed to set up on one of the side ones, 2 feet away from the edge(they were 6x4s) we had to move to the middle table to pick up treasures. I just remembered, my dog also walked up to a skink chieftan and swatted him into the sky lol it was so funny.

Dark Apostle197
31-10-2006, 02:01
The game before I played a pirate warband. Killed a 2nd mate with a dog too... he routed cause his only hero left was his first mate... Surrounded by 2 witch hunters, 2 dogs, and a zealot :)

Foot_of_adhesive_tape
03-11-2006, 09:35
man i wish there were more people in new zealand that played mordheim, i wanna play massive campaigns:(.

-Foot

bantha_fodder
03-11-2006, 15:41
on the subject of random encounters, does anyone know if there is a random encounters list (or similar) tailored for the empire in flames rules?

iSHAKA
09-11-2006, 03:54
yer i say more people in NZ :(

devolutionary
09-11-2006, 04:02
*coughs* And where in New Zealand are you all? *points to Groups and Factions*

CY the monkey
09-11-2006, 06:03
I'm starting mordheim too and i'm in nz.

I live in auckland, we play warhammer etc, hoping to get people in to mordheim

devolutionary
09-11-2006, 07:53
Yah, well, there's a NZ opponent finder in the Groups and Faction area of the forums =P Visit! Introduce! I want opponents

teh_soldier
09-11-2006, 21:13
I played my first game tonight with my Reichlanders, and they kicked hell into my opponents. I played against Skaven, Possessed and Dwarven Warbands, and nailed all of them with my Marksmen. Because it was the Treasure Hunt scenario, my Marksmen went up to BS5 after one game, and now i have 5 of them :D
I love Mordheim so much, its such a great game.

TKitch
09-11-2006, 23:38
ahhh, you played a fun scenario :)

BS5 is the best way to make your marksmen terrors.

FYI: Give them a Longbow and a Crossbow. If they don't have to move, use the S4 shot. If they do, use the longbow :) (Expensive, but awesome!)

Dark Apostle197
09-11-2006, 23:47
My friend found two hand guns in exploration and is going to give a skink chieft both(he already has weapons training) and nimble so he can move and shoot every turn :)

TKitch
09-11-2006, 23:57
tell him to skip hunter and use a crossbow.

at least then it works with quickshot. Handguns suck, a lot.

Dark Apostle197
10-11-2006, 05:43
They were free. And he is giving him nimble not hunter. So he gets to move and shoot each turn.

TKitch
10-11-2006, 05:48
handguns have to be reloaded (Prepare Shot Rule)

and you can't give one guy two of the same ranged weapons. (Up to two DIFFERENT ranged combat weapons.)

So, to fire every turn you need hunter, and that's a waste of a skill.

Toppan
10-11-2006, 06:00
i say, handgun and crossbow, or something of that combo. nowhere does it say you need to be idle while reloading :)

anyway, the butcher warband is finally in final draft stage, and i havent got any critique from you guys. of course, i havent posted the newest version, but that doesnt matter. its the basic principal.

ive noticed they either do really well, or really badly. they can get swarmed easily, can be shot easily, but do mad damage and never die in CC. like ogres should. but im worried that since 3 models are base W3...is that too much? the leader and 2 heroes are them...so...

also, has anyone tried any of the obscure warbands, like assassins or clan pestilens...or even the incredibly obscure, halfling warband?

CY the monkey
10-11-2006, 09:14
Where do you get all these rules and warbands any way?

I'm going to by my Skaven warband soon, i need some help before i buy it

Assassin A with Sword, sling, dagger
2 black skaven w Sword, sling, dagger
Eshin S. w 2 daggers and sling
2 night ruuners w club, dagger and sling
9 verminkins w club, dagger and sling
500gc

Anything i should change before i buy the models?

TKitch
10-11-2006, 15:14
www.mordheimer.com is a good site for a ton of 'interesting' rules. A Lot of warbands have been made by players over the years.

Ummm, as for your warband? It's quite effective, but very cookie cutter.

I don't like the 15+ skaven of doom warband, as it's rather unfair to other players in a campaign. Skaven are the single most overpowered warband out there.

corben_da
10-11-2006, 18:49
i just have to say one thing, beasts of chaos ROCKS, i have unbeatable beasts of chaos warband, they are just so ********ng awesome :D

CY the monkey
12-11-2006, 07:44
Should i make it "fair" then?how? it doesn't seem skaven to be fair.

Thanks for the link.

devolutionary
12-11-2006, 08:08
That many slings is just pure pain, that's the issue. It's incredibly powerful. Fast rate of fire, solid damage, and in such vast quantities it rips any other warband apart.

Though I gotta admit, my Vampire would enjoy it :D

Gen.Steiner
12-11-2006, 14:32
To be honest I still think the most powerful list is:

Vampire with heavy armour, sword, shield, helmet
Necromancer with sword
3 Dregs with bows and axes
10 Zombies
500GC

Shambling horde of zombies to distract the enemy while the Dregs and Necromancer provide fire support. Meanwhile, the Vampire butchers its way through the enemy...!

TKitch
12-11-2006, 15:36
Steiner, sorry, but quite not.

Firstly: you're hampering one of your vampies best attributes: Movement. He starts with M6, with the HA/S combo he becomes M5. Making him only slightly faster than humans.

Secondly: Shambling horde distraction? Feel free, a smart player knows that zombies aren't going to do a damned thing unless they corner him. I'd happily ignore them (or shoot them, to slow them down even more.)

Shooty dregs are bordeline uselss. BS2 = 5+ to hit close range & no modifiers. And since there is no 7+ to hit rule in mordheim, until I make close range I can fairly easily make it impossible to hit me. (Long Range + Cover = 7 to hit for a dreg.)

Also, a lone vampire? That's asking to get him killed. Seriously. He's got the single best starting statline in the game, yes, but he's still gonig to go down. Sure, he'll get the charge, I'll even let him. Then I'll follow that up with no less than 5 counter charges. 1-3 will fail the fear test, and the rest will statistically hurt him very, VERY badly.

I'd personally ditch the armor and 3 zombies and then buy 2 dire wolves. A Vampire + 2 wolves is a REALLY brutal combo.


Skaven would decimate your combo. Yes, Skaven.
1) Slings will still hurt your vampire. His 16 skaven up there will make your life a nightmare. 16 slings hitting on a 6 = 3 hits, and wounding on a 5 = 1 wound. That with him moving and long range. Once they or you close, you're getting hit on a 5+ or (possibly) a 4+, Then you're suffering multiple wounds a turn, and even critting.

If he takes them against the shambling horde, you're still in trouble, as he can hurt zombies easier than the vampie, and once he drops 4, you're taking route tests. you're likely to pass, but you will fail eventually.

2) He can charge your vampire. Many will fail, but given enough, he will still fall.


Skaven are the single most powerful warband in the game starting out. period.

16x S3 BS3 attacks from 18" is insane. There will be casualties to it, regardless of your warband.

As for balancing skaven, there's a few small tweaks to make:

1) change the Sorcer so that it takes the place of one black skaven. They have no reason to start with 6 heroes, when nobody else does.

2) Raise vermkin to 25GC. Same as a human warrior.

3) Make Vermkin 0-10 (Force them to take some giant rats in the long run.)

That knocks them down plenty enough to make them not suck entirely to play against.

Dark Apostle197
12-11-2006, 19:18
Vampires are very mean though. Actually, the alliance that won every event except for the one me and a dwarf player forced a tie after fighting through five troll, is Vampire and skaven... They are mean together. His vampire was only taken out once and that was when as many sisters of sigmar heroes that could make the charge did...

teh_soldier
12-11-2006, 21:25
Well, my Reiklanders are pretty much undfeatable after just 4 games. I won all four, my Marksmen have BS5 and one was upgraded to a Hero, one of my Youngbloods causes Fear, has Strike To Injure and WS 3 with a Spear. I've just been incredably, incredably lucky with my rolling in my games, to the point one guy wont play me any more because i'm "too lucky".

I love Mordheim :D

Gen.Steiner
12-11-2006, 21:47
Who sez my Vampire's alone? Those Zombies help, a lot. :) I've used that combo for a good few starting campaigns and I've rarely had bad luck with it.

TKitch
12-11-2006, 22:27
ok, your first post gave the impression of your vampie being alone.

Well, if you're limiting your ENTIRE warband to moving 4" a turn, I'll HAPPILY snipe the @#%%##@ out of your warband before you get to me.

That's the issue with zombies, they're horribly slow. I'll have no less than 4 turns of almost uninterrupted shooting to wear down your warband before charging an issue at all.

After that much shooting with a medium shooty warband, you'll still be taking route tests before you get into CC.

CY the monkey
13-11-2006, 05:33
So should i change anything with my warband?

My friend thinks it's too overpowered, starting outlaw of stirwood to "counter" it.

Others just tells me to start somethng else

iSHAKA
13-11-2006, 05:51
CY the monkey i think your friends are right play some thing elss.

TKitch
13-11-2006, 15:09
I posted it before, but here it is again.

Rewrite your warband with these in mind:





Skaven are the single most powerful warband in the game starting out. period.

16x S3 BS3 attacks from 18" is insane. There will be casualties to it, regardless of your warband.

As for balancing skaven, there's a few small tweaks to make:

1) change the Sorcer so that it takes the place of one black skaven. They have no reason to start with 6 heroes, when nobody else does.

2) Raise vermkin to 25GC. Same as a human warrior.

3) Make Vermkin 0-10 (Force them to take some giant rats in the long run.)

That knocks them down plenty enough to make them not suck entirely to play against.

Mr Zephy
13-11-2006, 16:33
Hmm seems fair, but our group's skaven player needs all the heroes he can get...

TKitch
13-11-2006, 16:39
not out the door.

he can still get ladded and get a 6th hero.

Gen.Steiner
13-11-2006, 20:30
ok, your first post gave the impression of your vampie being alone.

Well, if you're limiting your ENTIRE warband to moving 4" a turn, I'll HAPPILY snipe the @#%%##@ out of your warband before you get to me.

That's the issue with zombies, they're horribly slow. I'll have no less than 4 turns of almost uninterrupted shooting to wear down your warband before charging an issue at all.

After that much shooting with a medium shooty warband, you'll still be taking route tests before you get into CC.

True, but that assumes that you can draw LOS. :)

TKitch
13-11-2006, 21:15
well, when you can't run and only move 4" at a time?

you won't be hiding much. (And you've got 11? 12? guys in the group? I'll be getting some shots at a minimum ;))

Dark Apostle197
13-11-2006, 22:22
killing five zombie to start checks isn't that hard (I say 5 to take into account that the necro will be re-raising some)

devolutionary
13-11-2006, 22:28
Righto, let's test teh list waters then. Since Undead seem the flavour of the day, I'm gonna post what was (prior to the time I stopped playing) my basic Undead band. Let's see if this can bolster some discussion :D

Vampire - Light Armour, Shield, Sword
Necromancer - Dagger
3 Dregs - 2 with Short Bows, 1 with Spear
4 Zombies
2 Ghouls
2 Dire Wolves

The joyous thing with Undead is the ability to make zombies out of half the treasures you get (hurrah for hostages!). It really makes things quite super. Dregs get really useful really fast, and Ghouls have that wonderful chance to get some skills, which can make them all in all fairly nasty in battle. The Vamprie is a points sink really, but I can't pass up that Blood Dragon model, since most von Carsteins are hideous.

Gen.Steiner
13-11-2006, 22:29
killing five zombie to start checks isn't that hard (I say 5 to take into account that the necro will be re-raising some)

Off the top of my head, don't you have to kill or put down 50% of my force? :confused: with 15 figures that's 7 or 8 zeds you have to rekill. :p

Dark Apostle197
13-11-2006, 23:31
It is 25 percent OOA, which would would be 3. i believe

Gen.Steiner
13-11-2006, 23:51
25% OOA is 4. (3.75 actually)

Dark Apostle197
14-11-2006, 00:58
you won't be hiding much. (And you've got 11? 12? guys in the group? I'll be getting some shots at a minimum ;))

I was going off this assumption, which would have been three guys.

Gen.Steiner
14-11-2006, 01:00
I was going off this assumption, which would have been three guys.

Vampire + Necromancer + 3 Dregs + 10 Zombies = 15 :p

TKitch was going on about my Zombie Assault Force of 10 Zombies + Vampire.

TKitch
14-11-2006, 01:36
aye. I was following his assault group.

I'd still love to play you with any of the following bands:

Reiklanders, Marienbergers, Averlanders, or even Kistlevites. I'd have fun with it!

(Oh, Outlaws, too :))

jp22102000
14-11-2006, 02:40
aye. I was following his assault group.

I'd still love to play you with any of the following bands:

Reiklanders, Marienbergers, Averlanders, or even Kistlevites. I'd have fun with it!

(Oh, Outlaws, too :))

no shadow elves?
lol just kidding but i bet the sea guard could take them

TKitch
14-11-2006, 02:44
Oh, if I wanted to make elven artillery work again, I'd let him skip the rout tests!

The Sea Guard would do ok, but they aren't that heavily shooting oriented, so there would be CC most likely :)

Melchor
17-11-2006, 10:54
For Witch Hunters, how many heroes should I have from the start? I was thinking about one captain, two witch hunters and a priest. Too many? Too few?

WarbossKurgan
17-11-2006, 11:09
For Witch Hunters, how many heroes should I have from the start? I was thinking about one captain, two witch hunters and a priest. Too many? Too few?
For any warband, always take as many heroes as you can - in a campaign they are they key to getting more money and they are too expensive to buy later without that money!

Melchor
17-11-2006, 11:12
So 4 would be? Too few?

TKitch
17-11-2006, 11:47
what he said about it.

Melchor
17-11-2006, 12:21
I came up with the following:

HEROES

Captain (60)
Brace of Pistols (30)
Sword (10)
Buckler (5)
- 105

Priest (40)
Hammer (3)
Shield (5)
Light Armour (20
- 68

Witch Hunter (25)
Double Handed Weapon (15)
- 40

Witch Hunter (25)
Double Handed Weapon (15)
- 40


HENCHMEN

2 Flagellants (80)
Flails (45)
- 125

2 Zealots (40)
Hammer/maces (6)
- 46

2 Zealots (40)
Hammer/maces (6)
- 46

2 Warhounds (30)
- 30

500 GC exactly
Rating: 168 (you do include the starting experience of your warband in it's rating right?)

I know this probably isn't the most competitive warband, but I think it's fluffy and I like the look of it model-wise. I just want to make sure this warband won't get completely trashed.

TKitch
17-11-2006, 12:33
You want all 5 starting heroes.

Suggestions:

1) Ditch light armor. It's useless, as a 5GC weapon can negate it. Or S4.

2) Don't use double handed weapons (yet). Once you get 'Strongman' they're aweome. But without it, losing the attack and striking last is a huge penalty.

3) Get the 3rd witch hunter.

Melchor
17-11-2006, 12:40
What do you suggest instead of the double handed weapons? Swords and bucklers? The parry rule seems quite powerful, so that looks attactive.

What to arm the third witch hunter with? And better yet, what should I ditch to get him?

Also, can I increase the size of the warband beyond 12 after the campaign has started?

McMullet
17-11-2006, 15:23
A couple of double handed weapons are OK I think - they're OK for models who you intend to use as charge-takers (i.e., who will be striking last anyway) and to have the odd one around to "finish off" guys on the ground.

Swords and bucklers are OK, but (unfortunately, because it's not so realistic) the best weapon combo in Mordheim is 2 weapons. The extra attack is very useful and there's no penalty, really, since bucklers aren't great and shields are pointless. A sword and a hammer/mace is probably the optimum kit, the mace is a very good buy and the parry is always handy.

I'd lose the light armour and shield, because both are a waste of time. That's enough for a nekkid with hunter, and it won't take much to fit in some equipment for him.

And no, you can't ever go above 12 models, I'm afraid, other than by hiring mercenaries (who don't count to the limit) or by special abilities. A halfling cook would be a good bet, add that to a halfling cookbook and you can have 14 normal guys + whatever hired swords you want.

Dark Apostle197
17-11-2006, 21:57
I would suggest giving your witch hunters crossbows instead. You may want to see my warband thread, there were some helpful suggestions from people there too.

Melchor
17-11-2006, 23:04
I'd like to stick to mostly existing models. The idea of a crossbow wielding hunter is nice though, but I figure a lone archer isn't going to have much impact on the game right?
Maybe a couple of zealots with bows, and hope they get a BS increase? It's probably a waste though.

Dark Apostle197
17-11-2006, 23:14
Adding x bows to models is easy. Put it on their base, or attach it too their back or something. One probably will do nothing. 3 Wh(one being a captain) with quickshot, and an elf with quickshot will :)

Zealots(even with BS increase) kinda suck at shooting. the thing with BS 3 base guys, are they can get to 4, which is decent, zealots cannot.

Melchor
17-11-2006, 23:20
It's a nice idea, but I get the feeling that if I wanted to play a shooty warband I should have taken a regular mercenary one.

I'll look into it. It's not meant to be a very powerful warband anyway. I chose witchhunters because they give me the opportunity to accuse random people of witchcraft. That's saying enough I think. :)

Dark Apostle197
17-11-2006, 23:26
True that is fun :) But you will eventually notice that if you have no counter shots, enemy shooting will really hurt, and maybe even ruin your fun :)

Melchor
17-11-2006, 23:34
So how about giving a crossbow to a Witchhunter, and then equipping a pair of
Zealots with bows and putting my faith in Sigmar to actually hit something or get a BS advance.
Maybe look for an Elf to boost my shooting later on.

Dark Apostle197
17-11-2006, 23:55
My first few games had no shooting and when I took shooting, it got much easier to play. It can get kind of expesive but in the long run I think it is worth it. Up to you. The elf isn't really for shooting, he is more for the +/- to the roll. He is either the only one killing with shooting, or not killing anything untill the enemy's warband leader is a clear shot, then he is usually hit in the neck and the enemy leader goes down. Amusing to say the least.

TKitch
18-11-2006, 15:29
WHs can be one of the most shooty warbands out there!!!

They start with 4!! models with access to XBows and Shooting skills, quit trying to say they're not shooty! :)

So their henchies suck at shooting, they're still really good at it!

Dark Apostle197
18-11-2006, 21:36
Is that towards me? Because I am trying to persuade him to use shooting... Or is that to Melchor?

TKitch
20-11-2006, 03:27
too many people on here are saying that hunters aren't shooty, and I'm completely disagreeing!

Toppan
20-11-2006, 20:40
my pirates are really shooty, 3 handgunners, 3 crossbowmen, and 3 swabbies with bows, not to mention the brace of duelling pistol+eagle eyes captain...i dont know why im so shooty either.

anyway, im editing the adventurer warband, you know, the one with the elf dwarf barbarian and stuff, to make it mordheim and not karak azgal. any thoughts?

and does anyone even care about my ogre warband? :((

Dark Apostle197
11-12-2006, 06:03
Bump! Can't let this thread die! Good times... Good times...

Stormbringer
11-12-2006, 07:41
too many people on here are saying that hunters aren't shooty, and I'm completely disagreeing!

I depends on how you arm them. Crossbows aren't that cheap and starting out with shooty hunters cuts down on gc for henchmen. Plus people tend to focus on the flagellants for power and less on the hunters themselves. I did that when i used them in one campaign about a year ago. I stood up pretty well till five games in when my captain got puked on by a troll and melted. Then it all went down hill from there.

Dark Apostle197
11-12-2006, 16:08
My WH started out shooty and I was at the max on henchmen when I started lol...

TKitch
11-12-2006, 19:42
you can get 4 heroes with crossbows, a pair (i think) of flaggies, and then dogs to max in a starting warband.

(Mind you, I'm trying to remember what I did, cuz I kinda ferget. Been a while.)

Melchor
11-12-2006, 20:40
I think doggies might be useful for a starting warband. Later on in the campaign, they might be a liability because they don't gain experience but they're a nice and cheap addition to your warband.

I also like the fact that they're movement 6...

Thoughts?

Dark Apostle197
11-12-2006, 22:26
ANother very useful use for dogs is to send em into positions where you know they will die(maybe do some damage) then voluntarily rout when you are going against a warband with twice your rating :)

Melchor
11-12-2006, 22:31
Sneaky... ;)

I think I'd rather use them to tie up/take down some of the enemy's missile troops or killer troops.

TKitch
12-12-2006, 04:34
dogs are awesome for both tactics mentioned.

Team up 3 or 4 of them on a single model (as they are M6, they can run a long ways!) And if they die and you rout, well, c'est la vie.

Dark Apostle197
12-12-2006, 05:55
Trust me, when you start playing a few games, you will want to use them to rout :)

Dyrnwyn
13-12-2006, 21:42
Hey, I'm looking to start playing a Mordhiem camapign with a couple of more experienced folks in my area. Figured I'd start with Reiklanders and go all Blackpowder weapons, using some of the Cygnar Warmachine figs. I came up with a couple of 500gc lists, and I'm wondering which is better. (for reference, I have zero suitable models right now, so I'm not looking to buy more than 6-7 models for the start of this game):

List one; original list based on what I could buy for cheap:
Captain - 110
-brace of dueling pistols

Youngblood - 30
-pistol

3 Marksmen - 180
-handguns

3 Marksmen - 180
-handguns

Figured this list would be pretty good, could advance with one set of Marksmen moving and the other firing alternately, Captain supporting between them. But after I read the thread, it looks like Heroes are alot more important than I thought; Do I really need all 5 from the start? Came up with this list afterward:

List 2:
Captain - 120
-brace of dueling pistols, Lucky Charm

2 Youngbloods - 130
-braces of dueling pistols

2 Champions - 190
-Braces of dueling pistols, Lucky Charms

1 Marksman - 60
-Handgun

TKitch
13-12-2006, 23:39
neither.

you're falling into a hole of the rules, which is painful for many players. Blackpowder weapons SUCK HARD in mordheim. :(

Crossbows are all around better than handguns by a lot. :(


One thing you can do, and still be entirely within the rules is do a 'counts as' and make Crossbows 'count as' light handguns. This makes you a lot better off.

Also, you want all 5 heroes to start for exploration. (Unless you're in 1 off games.)

Dark Apostle197
14-12-2006, 02:20
i agree with tkitch... definitely 5 heroes.

Dyrnwyn
15-12-2006, 01:28
Ah. Rereading the Campaign rulebook, I can see why having as many heroes as possible is good. However, are blackpowder weapons really that bad? I thought they'd be good at taking on opponents at range and shredding heavy armor. Is it just the optional blackpowder misfire thing that makes them suck that much or is it something else too?

TKitch
15-12-2006, 02:27
has nothing to do with misfire. (Well, that doesn't help, but that IS optional.)

Crossbow: Move or Fire, S4 (And works with quickshot, and can be poisoned)

Handgun: Move or Fire, S4, Armor Piercing, Prepared Shot

You'll get twice as many sniper shots with a crossbow when compared with a handgun. The additional point of AP is nice, but useless, honestly. Nobody uses armor when the crits ignopre it most of the time.

Quin 242
15-12-2006, 04:43
Am I the only one who thinks that the armor piercingness of crits needs to be toned down?
I think it should only by-pass armor on a crit roll of 6 instead of 3-6. Would still give two opportunities to wound...

As you say.. no one buys armor... and that's just sad.

Dark Apostle197
15-12-2006, 05:47
truthfully, I am not a fan of armour even without crits, it is so fare to make the save, or to expensive to get the ones worth it, that I just don't see it's worth. Plus its always fun to say "Oh no! You ignored my dog's armor save" :)

TKitch
15-12-2006, 05:49
It's a mixed bag, honestly.

Out of the gate, a 50GC suit of Heavy Armor is the same cost as 2 naked human warriors.

So I can have 1 guy in heavy armor, or the same guy naked, and 2 additional naked warriors. Who's going to win that fight?

Even if HA was a 4+ save, he'd still lose :(

mark.
15-12-2006, 08:46
Yes, I think to be worth it, light armor should be 4gc and heavy armor 10gc, shield is giving up a extra weapon and should be totally free (in everyone's starting pack just as free dagger), this is still not worth it on henchmen but now it's worth it on heroes, now opponent uses axes or other armor piercing and criticals, still not worth it.

Too improve usage of armor, most warriors should get it in starting pack, most heroes should get automatic light armor (except skaven and elfs) dwarfs should get automatic heavy and their heroes gromril to make them real dwarves again (ofcourse their cost should be increased by 5gc, 20gc for the hero)

This are ideas to make armor better, they should be included to make it more balanced because armor sucks now, now mordeim is a game not like warhammer where you have to choose your things but the choices are very obvious here, and it should be more variation.

Anyway thats my opinion, but no experience.

Stormbringer
15-12-2006, 09:13
Yes, I think to be worth it, light armor should be 4gc and heavy armor 10gc

I wouldn't mind seeing a price drop myself but that would be way too low. At the present price i can see why so many people shy away from using it. I would say it should be 25gc for heavy armor and 10 or 15 for light.

mark.
15-12-2006, 11:33
No dont think so, even if it's dropped so low, it's still just a 6+/5+ save, for example if you have henchmen people who cost ~30gc with weapons, a 10gc addition increases his defence, only 2/3 chance to wound so 3/2 defence, is 15gc, but still hurtful for criticals and high strenght and axe (or other armor decreasing blows) and if you have no point in going for extra defence for your men, only offence armor still isnt worth it.

Even if armor was decreased to 4/10gc would you still but it? I wouldnt buy it on my henchmen, only on my heroes, light armor totally isnt worth anything, 6+ save is crap and most attack negate it.

And by the way armor should be a good choice rather then buying more troops in most cases, so that small elite groups are a little better.

Even if armor was decreased to 4/10 it wouldnt be on much lists still, and armor is very cool and its very irritating its not a viable option.

TKitch
15-12-2006, 12:18
you could try out the Experimental Rules for armor and dual weapon combat.

Over in the Specialist Games forum, Mordheim Experimental Rules section.

Shuya
16-12-2006, 06:07
Im starting a Night Goblin warband and im wondering, is filling up all 20 models with nightgoblins and all 6 hero slots wise or should i throw in some squigs or a troll



EDIT: Also, 19 shortbows? Is that going to have the same effect as 17 slings in a skaven warband? because if so ill just take 9

TKitch
16-12-2006, 06:32
Well, you ALWAYS want to max heroes, unless you're playing an odd warband build. Getting 6 out the gate is very useful.

As for 20 starting? Do they all have 2 weapons? If not, drop a few and get more weapons for em.

Shortbows do NOT gain the hatred that slings do, due to the fact they can't fire twice (except for quickshot.) Getting a lot isn't gonna hurt, nor will it make you hated.

Shuya
16-12-2006, 15:39
I Was thinking of somthing along the lines of

Big Boss with Sword, Club and Shortbow
4 Bosses with 2 Clubs and Shortbows
1 Shaman with 2 Daggers
and 14 Goblins with 2 Daggers and Shortbows

Dark Apostle197
16-12-2006, 18:04
Too improve usage of armor, most warriors should get it in starting pack, most heroes should get automatic light armor (except skaven and elfs) .


Why wouldn't elves get armour too? I mean if you think about it, they are a dying race, if they sent in spec ops elves to kill chaos, I think they would ATLEAST be as equiped as a human... This may be the bitter wood elf player(WFB) in me where the best non hero/giant tree save is a 5+...

mark.
16-12-2006, 18:15
I dont think elves dont use armor, in combination with their agility light armor and ithilmar (mithril?) is much used among elves and some powerful knight or warrior elves use heavy armor or maybe even full armor.

But only no standard armor for them because their overpowered, just as skaven.

Quin 242
17-12-2006, 02:01
You can get Hardened Leather for heros at 5 gc's andf it counts as light armor.

Worth a look... I just think it's plain stupid that a HELMET can save tyour life better than a whole suit of armor :(

Dyrnwyn
17-12-2006, 20:31
has nothing to do with misfire. (Well, that doesn't help, but that IS optional.)

Crossbow: Move or Fire, S4 (And works with quickshot, and can be poisoned)

Handgun: Move or Fire, S4, Armor Piercing, Prepared Shot

You'll get twice as many sniper shots with a crossbow when compared with a handgun. The additional point of AP is nice, but useless, honestly. Nobody uses armor when the crits ignopre it most of the time.

Okay, played a one-off game with a friend of mine yesterday so we could start familiarizing ourselves with the game. You're right, handguns suck. Pistols on the otherhand, have done pretty well. I think I may swap my intended warband from Reiklanders to Pirates. One list of each here:
Reiklanders:
Captain - 120
- Dagger, Sword, Brace of Dueling Pistols

2 Champions - 134
- 2 daggers, Braces of pistols

2 Youngbloods - 90
- Daggers, Braces of pistols

3 Marksmen - 156
- 2 Daggers, Crossbows
Total: 500

Pirates:
Captain - 132
- Daggers, Sword, Brace of Dueling Pistols, Toughened Leathers, Hardtack Biscuits

2 Mates - 148
- 2 daggers, Braces of pistols, Toughened Leathers

2 Cabin Boys - 94
- Daggers, Swords, Pistols, Toughened Leathers

3 Crew - 126
- Daggers, Swords, Toughened Leathers
Total: 500

Which one is better, d'you think?

TKitch
18-12-2006, 03:20
you can do both.

But, don't do a brace of pistols to start. Buy just 1, and get a second later. Get a few more bodies out the door (and make sure you have 2 weapons on each guy.)

Pistols are great first round work, but after that? meh.

Dyrnwyn
18-12-2006, 04:55
you can do both.

But, don't do a brace of pistols to start. Buy just 1, and get a second later. Get a few more bodies out the door (and make sure you have 2 weapons on each guy.)

Pistols are great first round work, but after that? meh.

Well, that's kinda the whole idea that made me decide to go for pistols; shoot'em in the face on the charge, knocking 'em down. Then shiv'em with a couple daggers to take them out of action. Thanks for the advice, between listening to you and playing the one-off, I think I've got things narrowed down alot.

Out of curiousity, what's your take on cave squigs? My friend ran an Orc warband and they seemed pretty good, but the vets told him he probably wouldn't do well with Orcs.

TKitch
18-12-2006, 05:04
Orcs can be a VERY trough warband.

A list with 21 T4 models? Yeouch. Animosity is kinda a pain, but it's still awesome :)

Stormbringer
18-12-2006, 19:03
O&G warbands can definately be tough. Those gobbos equiped with shrooms and the ball and chain can be brutal (I saw one kill a kroxigor before).

As for Cave Squigs their good if you have enough gobbos to keep'em in line (within 6 inches or they go wild). At 15gc a WS4 and S4 cave squig is a pretty good bargin.

Melchor
23-12-2006, 22:14
I received my Mordheim bits last thursday. I'll be building the following Witch Hunters warband.

HEROES

Captain (60)
Brace of Pistols (30)
Sword (10)
Buckler (5)
- 105

Priest (40)
Hammer (3)
Buckler (5)
- 48

Witch Hunter (25)
Sword (10)
Buckler (5)
- 40

Witch Hunter (25)
Crossbow (25)
Hammer (3)
- 53

Witch Hunter (25)
Crossbow (25)
Hammer (3)
- 53


HENCHMEN

2 Flagellants (80)
Flails (30)
- 120

2 Zealots (40)
Hammer/maces (6)
- 46

2 Warhounds (30)
- 30

495 GC

Any last minute remarks? React now! Before it's too late! ;)

Dark Apostle197
23-12-2006, 22:17
IMHO a second weapon is more important than the buckler. I would also like to see a crossbow on your captain instead of the pistols... Good luck!

TKitch
24-12-2006, 15:41
Actually pistols are awesome to start.

Most warriors will use them in CC, not shooting, and tthen they hit on no less than a 4+ normally!

This makes a S4 AP shot in combat. Which is quite good (and frequently a 3+ to wound!) And until you end up being S4 with multiple attacks, they're pretty much awesome.

Dark Apostle197
24-12-2006, 21:08
Maybe I am biased because they never did any good for me... But I do not like them. But then again I was wimpy with my heroes ever since I lost 6 out of 13 warriors in one game... 7 went out of action... 6 died... Come on! lol

Catferret
27-12-2006, 09:43
I'm gonna agree with pistols being great in h2h but duelling piostols are better! The erratas say you do get the +1 to hit in h2h as well so WS4 heroes hit on 2+ against most henchmen. Or 3+ vs heroes. Thems be good odds!
On the subject of armour, I only buy it for heroes and only coz it looks cool on the models. I know everything except helmets are useless but I like the look of a big shiny suit of armour...

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 09:49
That is true... Just don't roll that one :)

Catferret
27-12-2006, 09:55
That is true... Just don't roll that one :)

That comment is always true though! It's tempting fate. But it gives you a better chance than most weapons of putting your opponent down. Buy the brace early to save gold coz they are only 50 at creation but jump to 60 later. Multiple S4 attacks are not to be sneezed at.

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 10:58
Expecially with the very useful armour pen. :rolleyes:

Catferret
27-12-2006, 11:08
The pistol criticals are fun too as you ricochet in h2h and hit your opponent's mate...

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 11:09
Pistols count as shooting shots in CC? or are you talking about shots in the shooting phase?

Catferret
27-12-2006, 11:14
The critical hits table for pistols is the same in h2h and shooting so you can end up with the ricochet result and hit multiple people. This assumes you are using the advanced criticals charts from the back of the book.

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 11:17
Yeah, we were in my league... It ended though... I won 30 bucks too... w00t lol

Catferret
27-12-2006, 11:26
I don't have access to pistols at all in my Norse warband. A couple of guys are allowed bows. Or javelins... Throwing axes on the Heroes aren't really worth it because I can't get any shooting skills. I do get S4 multi attack heroes at the start tho so I shouldn't complain....

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 11:32
Yeah... I checked out the norse. I just can't see myself doing a warband without shooting. Cause I have played against some and they had a hard time when each of my characters besides a priest is pumping out 2 str 4 shots, and 2 str 3 from the elf chilling with them.

Catferret
27-12-2006, 11:42
I second that motion. I played Marienburg, Reikland and Pirates and had lots of shooting. I wanted to try something a little different this time round so went for the Norse. Box of plastic marauders, goliath Juves as youngbloods, Beorg Bearstruck as a wereguy and tons of green stuff to make my Jarl.

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 11:43
hehehe sounds fun. I think next I am going to do Averlanders because I like the bergenjaguers(I like scout type soldiers)

Catferret
27-12-2006, 11:49
Shame about the yellow clothing! I liked their list tho. I think it can outshoot Reiklanders but haven't tried it on the table yet.

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 11:51
lol I won't paint em yellow... they are an advanced scouting party with urban camo... Ya :) I like the mountain gaurd, you can have them WS 5 or WS 4 BS 4... not bad :)

Catferret
27-12-2006, 11:57
And don't forget the Halflings! Cheap BS4 guys!

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 12:00
That too! Dont they have shortbows though? Thats what put me off them.

Catferret
27-12-2006, 12:02
Yeah, I think you're right. Still, they are cheap and if one becomes a hero give him Weapons Training and a crossbow thats twice as big as him!

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 12:03
WHy not a hunting rifles just for fun :)

Catferret
27-12-2006, 12:09
Hunting Rifle and Huntsman for the fire every turn approach. The new plastic Hunting Rifle for Empire on a halfling would be sweet! Give him a big game hunter outfit and handlebar moustache!!!

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 12:11
Have him standing on a wall twice his size... just so the stand hodling the weapon can touch the ground without breaking :)

Catferret
27-12-2006, 12:16
Or on one of the plastic treasure chests converted to be full of pies instead of loot!

Dark Apostle197
27-12-2006, 12:18
That could work too