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Eternalknight
28-09-2006, 13:22
In a week I will be facing a Tomb Kings army with my Wood Elves. The game is only 1000 points. I have never faced Tomb Kings before and was looking for some army list advice and tactics. Thanks.

DarkAngel74
28-09-2006, 15:12
Aim for the hierophant (one of his priests. he's supposed to mention which is one). If you kill the hierophant, his entire army will crumble in a turn or two.

night2501
28-09-2006, 20:10
yep that`s a good idea, and as a WE you have several ways to husnt character even if they are inside a unit, a common thing under 7 edition

Moonstone
28-09-2006, 21:23
Take waywatchers, htne if ur oppenent is stupid enough to leave the general out of a unit shoot him, mmm killing blow.

Highborn
28-09-2006, 22:54
Sniper Noble? Hunter's Talon + Pageant of Shrikes is always a good thing.

Undead are arguably the worst bang for your buck in a straight fight. Throw them against a psy immune close combat unit with decent abilities, and it will be a massacre. Dryads and Wardancers are great choices vs Undead, and Wild Riders to take the fight to his (sort of) fast elements.

I wouldn't get Waywatchers - you're relying on your opponent's stupidity there, and if your opponent's any good then they'll be dead points. I'd take an eagle instead for hunting/blocking duties.

Alathir
29-09-2006, 12:55
My regular opponent is Tomb Kings and I play Wood Elves, so I can offer some advice.

First of all, I'd definitley recommend at least 2 lvl 2 mages... or at least a mage and a branchwraith with the cluster of radiants. He will almost definitely use two liches and a prince. Beware the Tomb Princes, they have one of the best hero stat lines in the game... 3 wounds and toughness 5. TK magic is confusing and can be very hard to control, just make sure you really think carefully about which spells to dispel and to let through. And ALWAYS anticipate that one of his liches will carry the Hieratic Jar, which gives them an extra spell to cast, this can catch alot of people off guard.

Compared to your troops in combat, his soldiers are just pathetic so you don't need to worry about him killing your soldiers too much, just watch out for autobreaking (which won't be a problem if you throw immune to psychology troops into combat with him, which fortunately, is almost all of your close combat troops.

Don't go into the battle with the one strategy of 'KILL TEH HEIROPHANT OMG' because that is a quick road to defeat, be versatile and if you can force his heirophant into a tricky spot, then the game is yours. However, he will anticipate your mage hunting and protect him well. Just remember the wood elf mantra 'only fight when it suits you'. Waywatchers are not effective against the undead, dont bother.

Hope that helps.

Morgrin
29-09-2006, 15:48
A few more pointers from a TK general now playing with Wood Elves.

- The Hierophant IS the weak link in the army. If he dies early in the game al is lost. T3 and W2 doesn't help either. Against an average player (or a good one that makes a single mistake) a single unit of Warhawks will possible win the game for you.

- Tomb Scorpions are tough, but will lose from crumbling against a single Dryad unit. Keep in mind tough that they charge 14" (even after tunneling), and are great character hunters.

- Tom Guard can take an item that makes them essentially a skirmisher unit, able to reform facing any direction before charging. Coupled with incantations this can break an army.

- War Dancers decimate skeletons like there was no tommorow. A unit of 7 on the charge causes on average 9 wounds (before saves, at best a 5+).

Good luck!

Eternalknight
30-09-2006, 07:56
Thanks for the advice! This is a preliminary army list I have created (baring in mind I have no models for mages):

Wood Elf Noble (hail of doom arrow)
10 Glade Guard (incl champ)
10 Glade Guard (incl champ)
8 Glade Riders (incl champ + mus)
12 Dryads (incl champ)
7 Wardancers (incl champ + mus)
3 Warhawk Riders

StormCrow
30-09-2006, 08:17
As a Tomb King player (i fight alathir) here's some tips for what we hate when playing wood elves:

Glade Riders: These are a nightmare unit for my heirophant (i've never faced warhawks). I'd recommend smaller units of 5-6 over a unit of 8. Once you go past 6 they become a bit unwieldy.

Wardancers: For undead they are a skirmishing tactical nuke. With a flank charge they will destroy any core undead unit in a turn. Dryads are like a toned down version of the same.

Mages: not so much their magic ability, but their elusiveness combined with the fact they stop me dominating a game through magic makes me a very angry tomb king. Hide one in the trees with a deepwood sphere for some laughs.

Fleeing Units: never underestimate the greatness of bait units in wood elf armies (yes i know all your units are expensive, but still...). Set them up against chariots and laugh as the chariots get stranded and gobbled up by dryads or other similar nasties.

Against TK's try and use their magic movement to your advantage so that whilst a prince might zoom off and kill a few glade riders or scouts, he is left stranded from nice liche magic and will soon find himself going up against an unholy amount of attacks. Crumbling is your friend.

A couple of closing comments: The list you have at the moment is good, but you really need magic defence or you will suffer the wrath of 24" charge chariots. On a lighter note, TK's suck in low level points games so you've got that advantage. And Fury of the forest doesnt require line of sight, so gallop a couple of mages up to the heirophant with it (if you're lucky enough) and zap him early game if you run with the KILL THE HEIROPHANT strategy. It's a pretty effective means of disposing of him/her.

Alathir
30-09-2006, 14:43
Another thing, your wardancers, with killing blow, can be a nasty way for an expensive tomb prince to die. My wardancers have been the death of Stormcrow's Tomb King on a few occasions. Charge his unit and direct all attacks against him.

But yes, Stormcrow is right about magic defense, you NEED it against Tomb Kings. Impact hits alone are enough to kill almost all of our precious and pansy elves. Your forest spirits should stand up alot better though... on top of being crushed embarssingly to their chariots, the last thing you need is for them to have a 24" inch charge. So magic charges from chariots should be near the top, if not the top, thing to stop. Don't worry so much about their reraising.. unless it's focused, its not too much of a worry and are going to get cut down just as quickly again.

DeathlessDraich
30-09-2006, 19:40
As a Tomb King player (i fight alathir) here's some tips for what we hate when playing wood elves:
1) Wardancers: For undead they are a skirmishing tactical nuke. With a flank charge they will destroy any core undead unit in a turn. Dryads are like a toned down version of the same.
2) Set them up against chariots and laugh as the chariots get stranded and gobbled up by dryads or other similar nasties.



Interesting,

As a Tomb King player, I've encountered (1) and (2) above several times and in addition two other problems of
3) wiping out whole units of dryads etc for fewer than 100 pts. and being tied down in combat
And
4) having to 'chase' after units which are trying to distract and divert my army into several directions or smaller units.

How do you cope with these problems (1),(2), (3) and (4)?

Von Wibble
30-09-2006, 19:58
I am both a wood elf and a tomb kings player.

Tomb kings are the only army that I am afraid of with WE. An army with Khalidah and 30 bowmen will take out 2 units per turn! Except Dryads - but Skellies have them nailed with a 4+ save and CR.

OK, thats a special character. But using the extra points to get lots more archers who get to double up as warriors also fill up that role. Also an army can quite reasonably have 3 force chanellers/ assassins in the form of Tomb Swarms/Scorpions (they are hard hitting enough and WE don't have the CR to kill them in a hurry if they are deployed into the flank of Glade Riders, Wild Riders, Warhawk Riders or Treekin)

A truly defensive TK force will have more effective shooting than, say, Dwarfs since they use template weaponry which hits less models, or suffer from at least -1 to hit through shooting skirmishers.

Chariots can be slowed, but they cost roughly the same as Dryads and can just be used to psych out Glade riders. And I think Skull Chukkas are flaming... Mwa ha ha

StormCrow
01-10-2006, 02:42
Interesting,

As a Tomb King player, I've encountered (1) and (2) above several times and in addition two other problems of
3) wiping out whole units of dryads etc for fewer than 100 pts. and being tied down in combat
And
4) having to 'chase' after units which are trying to distract and divert my army into several directions or smaller units.

How do you cope with these problems (1),(2), (3) and (4)?

For taking care of wardancers i find that the staff of ravening, lots of shooting, and chariots work best. Because they're immune to psychology they can't run from a chariot charge which is handy. a block of 20 archers with a couple of liche's nearby should deter wardancers as well.

For chariots, i try to line them up against whichever flank has the most immune to psychology units so that they can get a charge without having to worry about fleeing enemies.

I rarely fight dryads so i don't really have any sound strategies for beating them. My guess would be to whittle them down with shooting and magic and then beat them with combat resolution when they reach my lines. Or alternatively you can just use chariots.

As for having your forces splitting up, that is just an unfortunate side effect of fighting woodelves. It is a rare moment indeed when my battle line isn't facing 5 different directions by turn 4 against woodelves. My best advice would be to keep your defensive units tightly packed and try not to move them too much, only reform them as the elves ride up your flanks. Let the elves come to you cause you can handle the casualties alot better than they can.

Oh and on a side note, always try and get a prince or king in your chariot units. I say this because elves like to hang around woods and if you aren't able to restrain your pursuit (hard on ld 5) you are looking at a whole world of pain.



and for the record, My tomb king only recieved the killing blow once against wardancers....and once against waywatchers. Sad.

Alathir
01-10-2006, 15:35
What a glorious day that was... the waywatchers were then hunt down by 2 scorpions and a bone giant i believe...

Benji550
02-10-2006, 14:39
Sill you've got to watch outt because for 20 points a Heirophant takes a cloak of mists and shadows and he has fly ability. Also since Wood Elves can see enemies behind and through basicly any peice of terrain and most are skirmishers with 360 arc of sight he might use a Casket of Soles. Any unit with line of sight to the casket take a 2D6 + 2 leadership test suffering wounds for how many points the test is failedd by including some nasty special effects

Alathir
03-10-2006, 05:51
The casket isnt too much of a worry for wood elves.. just get a unicorn and put it so it can it. problem solved.

Benji550
05-10-2006, 21:39
How about a unit of Usabti or a Bone Giant that has enough move to charge through woods.