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Azazel
17-10-2006, 01:09
Yo! Beasts usually feature in my Mortals army, but I feel like a change from a small elite force to a massed one of rubbish little dudes. How would this list stand as an opponent friendly army while having some degree of effectiveness? What would you change?

CHAOS KHORNE BEASTS

LORD

1 x Beastlord (GENERAL)
Daemon Sword, Talisman of Protection, Mark of Khorne.

235

HEROS

1 x Wargor
Heavy Armour, Great Weapon, Pelt of the Dark Young, Mark of Khorne.

128

CORE

23 x Beast Herd (13 Gor + 10 Ungor) (FULL COMMAND)
Additional Hand Weapons, Spears.

166

23 x Beast Herd (13 Gor + 10 Ungor) (FULL COMMAND)
Additional Hand Weapons, Spears.

166

23 x Beast Herd (13 Gor + 10 Ungor) (FULL COMMAND)
Additional Hand Weapons, Spears.

166

23 x Beast Herd (13 Gor + 10 Ungor) (FULL COMMAND)
Additional Hand Weapons, Spears.

166

5 x Chaos Hounds

30

5 x Chaos Hounds

30

SPECIAL

15 x Warriors of Chaos (FULL COMMAND)
Sheilds, War Banner, Mark of Chaos Undivided.

280

15 x Warriors of Chaos (FULL COMMAND)
Sheilds, Mark of Chaos Undivided.

255

15 x Warriors of Chaos (FULL COMMAND)
Additional Hand Weapons, Mark of Chaos Undivided.

285

6 x Chaos Furies

90

TOTAL

1997

DISPEL - 4
CAST - 2

Shaitan
17-10-2006, 08:01
I think your army is too slow. You have seven units with M4 / M5. The faster units (Warhounds and Furies) are not able to deliver a punch to your opponent.

I would drop at least one Beast Herd and one unit Warriors. Then you would still have 5 infantry units wich is enough to make a big horde.

For the freed points I would take Marauders Horsemen and maybe a unit Chaos Knights. And what about Magic Protection?
If you like chariots you can drop another infantry unit and take 2 chariots.

I think that would be some good improvements to your list... and still be "opponent-friendly"

god octo
17-10-2006, 16:14
i think that Shaitan's idea is a good one. with some ambushing herds and fast moving cavlary, you will have a good fast army that isnt cheesy.

enyoss
17-10-2006, 17:43
Now, I'm not a Beasts player so you can take or leave my comments (although I do play against them from time to time... the Beasts that is, not my comments).

Considering you want to move away from a Mortals list you've got a lot of mortals there! Maybe you should get rid of some of the warriors and replace them with Bestigors or, if you want to take the above advice and go a bit faster, take some centigors or minotaurs. These troops would allow you some faster and harder hitting units without compromising the beastiness.

I would say a definite no to Chaos Knights for a similar reason. If you're going with Beasts it just seems a bit much like you're plugging a gap in their army composition to me.

I like the minimal approach to magic... no caddies, hoorah! :)

Cheers,

enyoss

kyussinchains
17-10-2006, 18:34
I'd drop the number of gors in the beastherds, usually 2:1 is a good ratio of ungors to gors (13-14 ungors to 7 gors usually works well)

I'm agreeing on the slowness aspect, if you replace the chaos warriors with a unit of bestigors (mark of khorne works well on these guys) with a hero carrying the dark heart, they become really hard hitting, and quick enough to be considered 'fast'

centigors are your friend, they actually hit slightly harder than chaos knights when they charge, they can move through woods, and they cost a mere 17 points each! they can also become frenzied, putting them firmly in the same hitting power category as chosen knights!

I'd take either 2 units of 6-8 centigors, or 1 unit, and 4 khornate minotaurs with great weapons.

Also, lose the daemon sword on your general, sure he gets a nice attacking profile, but he kills himself real easily, and when it's your general in a beast army, the rest of them crumble really quickly. It's better to give him the chaos runesword and gaze of the gods, or the black maul, gaze of the gods and an enchanted shield.

I'd also try to sneak a couple of chariots in there too, they're a pittance at 85 points, and they're among the hardest hitting chariots in the game (plus they draw cannon fire away from your other units)

hope that helps

The daemon sword works best on sorcerers as a very nasty surprise

Azazel
17-10-2006, 22:15
I think your army is too slow. You have seven units with M4 / M5. The faster units (Warhounds and Furies) are not able to deliver a punch to your opponent.


Most of the punching is done by the Chaos Warriors. Two of the Beast Herds will Ambush while the two units of Hounds sheild the Chaos Warriors and Flee from Charges. :p

Sure it's not as fast as an army that heavily features in mounted units, but I wouldn't go so far to say it was slow (like Dwarfs or Undead).

Thanks for the feedback. I got three unbuilt Beast Chariots around some where. I'll go get them now...

Shaitan
18-10-2006, 07:36
centigors are your friend, they actually hit slightly harder than chaos knights when they charge, they can move through woods, and they cost a mere 17 points each! they can also become frenzied, putting them firmly in the same hitting power category as chosen knights!


I doubt this! Centigors come nowhere near Chaos Knights. The Knights have better weapon skill, strength, leadership, armour save. This makes them far superior in CC. Remeber Chaos Knights can also become frenzied... AND chosen!:evilgrin:


Sure it's not as fast as an army that heavily features in mounted units, but I wouldn't go so far to say it was slow (like Dwarfs or Undead).
I think you're army is prety slow actually. What if you come across an opponent with flyers, marchblocking you from turn 1 or 2. Then you only move 4 inch a turn with your heavy hitters. This means it will take you 3 turns to come half across the board. It also makes it too easy for your opponent to avoid those units I think.

Anyway, if you like this army you should just give it a try. But I would really consider taking a chariot or two and some magic defense...

Azazel
18-10-2006, 13:37
Dude March Blocking is the very least of my worries. With almost one hundred Beastmen I'll be able to see everywhere.

enyoss
18-10-2006, 14:07
I doubt this! Centigors come nowhere near Chaos Knights. The Knights have better weapon skill, strength, leadership, armour save. This makes them far superior in CC. Remeber Chaos Knights can also become frenzied... AND chosen!:evilgrin:


Hey! I didn't say that, it was kyussinchains. He never stops going on about his precious Centigors :p

Still, they always surprise me with how effective they are. I never treat them as a serious HTH threat (I don't know why, I just... can't!) and always pay the price. Sure they're not as good as chosen Khorne chaos knights but then at 17pts who'd expect them to be! I'm a big believer of keeping lists as distinct as possible though so am opposed to large numbers of mortals in beasts force. It just smacks of the old 4th edition days when a Dwarf force would have it's 25% allies packed out with Empire knights :)

Cheers,

enyoss

enyoss
18-10-2006, 14:11
By the way, I agree with Shaitan... it's time to move to phase two and see how this list works in practice methinks.

Let us know how it goes...

Cheers,

enyoss

kyussinchains
18-10-2006, 17:32
I doubt this! Centigors come nowhere near Chaos Knights. The Knights have better weapon skill, strength, leadership, armour save. This makes them far superior in CC. Remeber Chaos Knights can also become frenzied... AND chosen!

I said that they hit slightly harder, not that they are 'as good as' chaos knights, there is obviously a distinct difference there.

I am both right and wrong about my statement, they have lower weapon skill, which means against WS4 stuff, they will score fewer hits than chaos knights, however against WS3 and below stuff, they will score more hits, as their 'steed' attacks will also hit on 3's

They are much cheaper than chaos knights, are faster, and can move through terrain. I'm not saying they are better in combat, obviously they are not, but on a charge, they are pretty much in the same league, especially when you stick an aspiring champion in there with the beast banner

chaos knights can indeed become chosen, at a cost more than double that of centigors, I personally would say that 2 units of 6-8 centigors presents much more of a threat (not to mention a bigger psychological effect) and gives more flexibility than a single unit of chosen knights.

I'm not against chaos knights, but I was trying to add some variety and purity to the list by making it centred much more around beasts.

enyoss
18-10-2006, 17:46
There he goes... on about his Centigors again. Why don't you go and live with your precious Centigors if you love them so much ;)

I think 2 units of six would be a good idea though.

Cheers,

enyoss

kyussinchains
18-10-2006, 18:10
There he goes... on about his Centigors again. Why don't you go and live with your precious Centigors if you love them so much ;)

I think 2 units of six would be a good idea though.

you know I would if I hadnt married that albatross of a wife...

and yes, 2 units of 6 would indeed be good

popisdead
14-11-2006, 20:36
So Armour of Damnation and Chaos armour should be bought for your list.

you never need more than 5-7 gors. The rest are just ungors for padding.

No chariots will hurt you. I take 1 chariot per herd that will do a frontal charge.

I'd drop both units of warriors. At least one.

Take 8-10 furies, and 2-3 units of 5/5 that will ambush.

Take 1-4 spawn.