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View Full Version : Does BFG fall into the 40k mech/inf connundrum?



red120
18-10-2006, 11:11
Was looking into starting BFG, and read through the eBook, though not really grasping it completely right now. One thing that I was thinking about while making my list is how in 40k, if you want a competitive list, you can either go fully mechanized (to make your opponent's anti infantry fire useless) or fully infantry (to make your opponent's anti tank fire relatively useless).

Does this apply in BFG too? I'm looking at Hemlocks vs. Nightshades, and wondering if I take too few Nightshades, it will be easy for my opponent to eliminate the ordnance that they will deliver.

Actually, I prefer the look of Hemlocks, but it seems a bit odd to take a list with an Eclipse and then 20 Hemlocks.

Osbad
18-10-2006, 11:59
Yup that works. I recently lost a game because my mate fooled me by switching to an all-tank IG army where previouslt he had loads of grunts. My SM were too AP slanted and i just couldn't get enough blast markers laid to make a difference. Meanwhile, he was in a "target-rich environment"...

As with 40k "competitive" and "fun" can be mutually exclusive if taken to extremes.

narrativium
18-10-2006, 12:05
Well, I'd definitely take quite a few Hemlocks. A few Nightshades are good, bear in mind that if they're shooting at your ordnance, they're not shooting at something else (like, the Nightshades themselves).

Something else you might want to try: since Nightshades also have a weapons battery, you can add an Aconite to a Nightshade squadron and beef up the Firepower. It makes the squadron a little slower facing sunward, and a bit more expensive, but it's also a bit more flexible.

ReDavide
19-10-2006, 00:16
It's not quite as bad as in 40k. In BFG the differences between ship types are mostly in their weaponry - a given races ships will all be killable in the same fashion. Some weapons might be better against escorts & some better against capital ships, but you don't run into the "oh crud my bolter can't do anything against that rhino" situation like you do in 40k. You can min/max out on a certain style of weaponry, but your opponents' ship choices won't matter much.

But while ships within a given army list tend to be similar, ships between army lists can be much more vulnerable to certain weapons.

So an all-battery fleet will do more or less the same against imperial fleets no matter what the imperial player takes - he can't load up on heavy vehicles to neuter your anti-troop fire.
But that all-battery fleet will squash eldar flat, and there's not much the eldar player can change about his fleet list to avoid a grisly fate.

So it's usually nice to take a variety of weapons.

FuriosoShadow
19-10-2006, 03:03
Unless you fight only one race; they're vulnerable to different things, as has been mentioned.

While you can break a fleet in BFG (much like you can break an army in 40k), it's a lot harder to do; the ships are generally pretty expensive points wise (Cruisers are all over 100 pts), and not really any of them come with the right weapon sets. Sure, you can make annoying gimmick fleets, like Imperial fleets that take only 10 Dominators in a 2000 point game, but those can be countered by the right race, or by a clever admiral. I've found it to be a much more balanced game system in general.

red120
19-10-2006, 04:11
Hmmm..

The reason I'm asking is because out of all the Eldar lists I look at, it's pretty much a variation on the same theme - Void, Aurora, or Eclipse, and then about 1:1 ratio of Hemlocks and Nightshades, and smatter with a few Aconites.

There doesn't seem any way to do something either 1. different/unique or 2. more powerful.

Nkari
19-10-2006, 06:36
You can be diffrent and uniqie, but only so much.. The imperium and chaos has varaiety on their side, they got soo many diffrent cruisers so they can be really diffrent between themselfs. Eldar tend to be more alike imho, with the exception of the number of launchbays you have.. ;)

LostTemplar
19-10-2006, 11:35
There is only one way to actually "power-play" in BFG which is to take as many nova cannons as yõu can think. But a Eldar fleet will spell doom for that arragement, due to their race's features.

I guess the fact that nova-cannon carrying vessels are also battery vessels tends to remove this advantage... but with move / shoot / move rule of eldar... Well, this isn't that much of a dificulty.

In general BFG is a lot more balanced than wh40k, but also far more complicated within its simplicity.

FuriosoShadow
19-10-2006, 15:46
The rules are generally simpler (for example, mixed armor is handled very well in BFG and not at all in 40k), but the nuances are harder and much more complex - that's what I love about it. That and that you can't be bad at it and win. I hate watching kids who have never played 40k before win because they have some unstoppable gimmick army.

Darwin_green
19-11-2006, 08:39
I don't know... Ships with launch bays are kinda standard.

they can stop all kind of things. torpedoes, bombers, and assault craft are nerfed by fighters craft. And if you don't have fighters, you may be bum-rushed by bombers through space debris.

fracas
19-11-2006, 13:32
fleet compositions seems to vary based only on a few factors

1. how much ordnance (high carrier vs low)
2. how close (lots of 45cm+ wpnds or few)
3. how maneuvarble (escort heavy or light)

orangesm
20-11-2006, 16:21
Fracas has a good list of how the fleets as a whole can be categorized. Is the fleet a Carrier Battlegroup - primarily launch bays. Is the Fleet going to fight from arms length or get in close and get all the 'advantages' there in. The maneuvarblity of the fleet as a whole is also a determining factor.

Any fleet is suppose to be able to take on any other fleet and have a chance of victory. Some fleets are not as straight forward as others and require more skillful engagement of the enemy. The goal of every fleets against a Necron Fleet is the hulking of 1-3 large cruisers for victory.

BFG goes beyond fleet list strategy and gets into actually fighting the battle strategy.