PDA

View Full Version : [Mordheim] Reikland Gang for comments



Paddy
28-11-2006, 14:56
A second gang for your perusal - to save reference, the marksmen get +1BS.
Theme is a Captain and his detatchment (State trooper plastics)

11 Models, 5 heroes, 497 gc


Captain
Dagger, Dueling Pistol, Sword

Champion x2 (Bodyguards)
Axe, Mace

Youngblood x2 (Nephews)
Double-handed sword

Marksman x2
Dagger, Mace, Longbow

Swordsman x2
Dagger, Sword, Buckler

Warrior x2
Dagger, Halberd

TKitch
28-11-2006, 22:46
skip hlaberds and bucklers.

Give them hammers (or maces, or whichever), and give the swordsmen a second sword. Reroll to hit is AWESOME.

mjc1000
03-12-2006, 12:50
id say the same as tkitch add another thing try getting your maskmen a rifle or beat that and get a lucky roll and get a hochland long rifle just sugeting if they are good for you keep them like they are

wwwwwwwwwwwwaaaaaaaaaaaggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh

Jasonite
03-12-2006, 23:10
I like the Halbards... I'd ditch the maces off the marksmen and the bucklers...and maybe downgrade one of the other heroes to a free dagger as his second weapon. Daggers are still quite functional, after all... even if they give a 6+ save on occasion. It's worth it for the double swords... but sometimes you'll like having the halbard strength.

J

TKitch
03-12-2006, 23:33
Long rifle? you have GOT to be kidding me!

Nothing overly expensive is worth the money. Long Rifles are the MOST overly spensive piece of junk in the game.

do NOT ditch the weapons on the marksmen. they'll need em. They may not be optimized for combat, but they WILL end up in it sooner or later.

brettz123
04-12-2006, 05:06
I would suggest you take about 3-4 guys with crossbows. That will rough up anyone who messes with you. So I would dump the 2 extra warriors and take more marksmen.

Oh yeah give your heroes crossbows also. That gets really brutal. And remember it is always better to get them before they get you.

Jasonite
04-12-2006, 14:39
do NOT ditch the weapons on the marksmen. they'll need em. They may not be optimized for combat, but they WILL end up in it sooner or later.

I'd still ditch them for the first battle to help get the double swords on the guys who use them best. You can always buy them after the first battle.

I'd even go with a slightly smaller warband count and shoot for getting a swordsman up as a hero ;-) I'd put the two swordsmen in their own groups to help... save the money for after your second battle and increase your chances of getting a Lad's. :)

*shrug*

J

TKitch
04-12-2006, 16:26
I still dislike Halbreds. Why? They're never better than a second attack.

Seriously, they aren't. Unless you're fighting a T7 model than S3 can't hurt. (And if you are, then you're doing something wrong. Someone with Black Lotus should be dealing with THAT model.)

Jasonite
04-12-2006, 16:47
I suppose you're right... but there are times when you want to wound.... going up against Possessed or Orcs, for example... if you're going to keep your henchies with the halbards together...

But your point is well taken. I'd much rather have two attacks, even with two daggers.

J

TKitch
04-12-2006, 17:53
human warrior vs possessed:

hit on 4+ (50% chance to hit)
S3 vs T4 = wound on 5+ (33% chance to wound)
this gives a 16.5% chance of any one attack wounding, so 33% with two attacks. (And a small chance of both wounding!)

Hit on 4+ (50% chance to hit)
S4 vs T4 = wound on 4+ (50% chance to wound)
this gives a 25% chance to wound with one attack, and no chance of two attacks wounding.

Jasonite
04-12-2006, 20:35
I know, I know... crunch the numbers all you like... it's also about feel.

And hey... halbards LOOK cool on the field, no?

Perhaps they need a bit of a tweak, since they're pricey for their minor benefit (compared to dual weapons)

I suppose they're more of a fluffy weapon when you cut right down to it.

Actually... for their cost (not just GP, but also two-hands) they likely DO need a tweak.

Helmets shouldn't work against 'em, for one thing ;-)

Maybe your to hit rolls count as +1 for purposes of being parried? (so you can't be parried on a 5-6, and they have to roll higher to parry you otherwise)

*shrug* But you're right... losing the extra attack stinks, and I'm not sure if there's a simple way to quantify that in the game as it stands right now, without another arbitrary limit.

Jason

Setomidor
19-12-2006, 08:00
Tkitch: Your calculations are mostly correct, however:

If one model is 16.5% chance of wounding, then the chance of either two wounding is 27.5% and both is 2.7%. Why?

You have to calculate the negation (i.e. the attack NOT wounding) and then multiply those together. So the chance of not wounding is 1 - 0.165 = 0.835.

The chance of two attacks where niether wounds is 0.835 * 0.835 which is about 70%. This obviously means there is a 30% chance of either (or both) wounding.

The chance of both wounding is 0.165 * 0.165 which is about 2.7%. This means that the chance of a single attack wounding is 30% - 2.7% which is roughly 27.5%.

Back on topic: Get rid of the double handed weapons on the youngbloods. These guys are the heroes of tomorrow, so make sure they start gaining experience right away! I run them with dagger mace at 18 pts a piece. The youngbloods will level quickly in any direction you want them to, which makes them invaluable.

Also, a pair of crossbows would be nice...

mark.
19-12-2006, 15:33
I'd dump the warriors and swordsmen, marksmen are almost as good as swordsmen in combat, and swords are expensive and the mace special rule is better I think.

Dump the sword on the captain and change the pistols in a crossbow, give him 2 maces.

Champions are fine altough 2 maces would be a little bit better, as for the youngbloods, dump the swords and give them maces instead.

For the extra money buy marksmen with crossbows, maybe an extra one with longbow if there's much scenery.


Sorry that I changed much in your list, but I think warriors and swordsmen are pointless and other weapons then mace and dagger also bad but this only gameplay-wise, if you like cool armed models and more variation just get them some axes or swords or pistols (not the duelling type), but no 2-handed weps, those suck to much.


But reading your fist post I dont know were supposed to change your list, but everyone does it, and the people here have been helpful to me so I want to help as well.

Jasonite
19-12-2006, 18:20
Swordsmen are NOT pointless. They're great, especially if one becomes a hero :)

TKitch
19-12-2006, 19:01
Swordsmen are awesome.

Reroll to hit when charging? Yes, please!

mark.
19-12-2006, 19:44
They are expensive, if you want both attacks to reroll you need to buy 2 swords, else one, that adds up.

Ability is only usably 1st round, and makes charge a little bit (50%?) more dangerous, thats good, but swordsmen cant shoot and dont have +1BS so my choice would be marksmen.

TKitch
20-12-2006, 03:08
but they have WS 4, which is rather rare outside of heroes, so they're hitting many heroes and most all henchies on a 3+.

That means on a charge each attack has a (roughly) 16% chance of missing.

you'll likely hit both. So you're only S3, who cares?

The point of swordsmen is that they're better than warriors, flat out.

Setomidor
20-12-2006, 12:49
Run a single one in a henchmen group, and just wait for the lad's got... when he becomes a hero, you can really start rocking

Rhycore
22-12-2006, 16:49
I think one of the main reasons to play Reiklanders is for the Marksmen. I would probably drop the Warriors for more Marksmen... That's just me though.

Jasonite
22-12-2006, 17:01
You don't have to give the swordsmen two swords, at least not to start.

It's like saying you wouldn't want a sports car unless it came with a full tank of gas... of course it's still good even if the tank came empty! :)

Catferret
23-12-2006, 07:59
Mark, why do you say Swordsmen can't shoot? OK, adding a bow hikes up the cost again but they are still BS3 which is good enough to make it worthwhile. I had 2 Swordsmen with sword, bow and dagger in my first Marienburg warband and they totally outperformed the xbow Marksmen because they could move and shoot and were really handy up close. The flexibility was fantastic.

Quin 242
23-12-2006, 08:18
I would suggest you take about 3-4 guys with crossbows. That will rough up anyone who messes with you. So I would dump the 2 extra warriors and take more marksmen.

Ditto this!

But, I have to disagree with Brettz123's second bit of advice. Any heros should have a move and fire versus a move OR fire weapon. They need mobility.

Kill the pistol on your captain.. get him a bow.. for when he has that shot on the way in his BS of 4 will help him. Since he can move and fire with a bow.

skip the warriors.. they are too generalized.
If you need HtH then get more swordsmen but take advantage of the +1BS of your chosen warband and get a pair of crossbowmen.

Skip the Maces on the marksmen until later. Keep your marksmen well back and your heros/swordsmen between them and the bad guys.

mark.
23-12-2006, 14:58
Mark, why do you say Swordsmen can't shoot? OK, adding a bow hikes up the cost again but they are still BS3 which is good enough to make it worthwhile. I had 2 Swordsmen with sword, bow and dagger in my first Marienburg warband and they totally outperformed the xbow Marksmen because they could move and shoot and were really handy up close. The flexibility was fantastic.

Oh, I thaught swordsmen hadn't got access to bows, just like warriors don't have..

Sorry about that, but even then I wouldnt take swordsmen from the start.

TKitch
23-12-2006, 17:43
Swordsmen have the same list as the heroes.

They have limited access to shooting, but they do have an ok selection. They juat don't hav the marksman list. However, in any merc band but reikies, even the markies are BS3.

Jasonite
30-12-2006, 15:49
Oh, I thaught swordsmen hadn't got access to bows, just like warriors don't have..

Sorry about that, but even then I wouldnt take swordsmen from the start.

It's your funeral ;-)

*grin*

Seriously, just do what you want to do. If you don't like swordsmen, don't use 'em... but if you run the numbers, they're fantastic. If you can get one of them bumped up to be a hero, it's definitely worth it.

J

TKitch
30-12-2006, 23:01
Aside form Reikies, Swordsmen have the same BS as marksmen. Marksmen just have a much better list of weapons at their disposal.