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Lady's Champion
08-07-2005, 21:52
I just wanted to know if we ever proved that they indeed do not spore- grr it angers me that people think they do- but did anyone ever prove it?

Also did we ever finally agree that Orks aren't plants they just have green fungal cells in their skin?

These are all drawn straight from the rogue trader book so why was there ever an argument?

IceFire
08-07-2005, 21:59
in the rouge trader days Space amrines were thugs in power armour. This is the fourth edition, orks spore and are plants. accept it.

PrUpLeHaZe
08-07-2005, 22:01
It says in the ork codex that orks have both animal and fungal cells. They obviously have animal qualitys (they talk and walk around, basic human shape), and also fungal qualitys (they start out as mushrooms). Also if you have read the necron codex it says that the old ones bio-engineered a race called the krorkwho were made to fight (obviously the orks) so that explains the whole "strange genes" thing.

Lady's Champion
08-07-2005, 22:03
Where does it actually say they begin as mushrooms? Actually written down?
And to be fair, Space Marines are really just glorified thugs now...

IceFire
08-07-2005, 22:07
3rd edition ork codex. near the back. its got a couple of pages about it

Lady's Champion
08-07-2005, 22:09
Really? Ok then I give up lol I thought it was a myth invented by people

IceFire
08-07-2005, 22:13
yeah first two of the last three pages. people have claimed that, as its written from an imperium point of veiw, it isnt accurate.

zealousheretic
08-07-2005, 22:14
in the rouge trader days Space amrines were thugs in power armour.

I guess some things never change...

Xisor
09-07-2005, 05:18
And I suppose that from Ben Kenobi's 'Certain point of View' everything which ever had an attack characteristic or ability could be a glorified thug :eyebrows:

I'd warrant it's safe to say the Ork are not simply 'mythologially' fungi, they're actual quite good people to kick about with!

[note:for those who don't get it: fungi~fun guy]

Eversor
09-07-2005, 06:07
:chrome: Never says anything about being plants. Orks have symbiote fungal cells in their blood, and symbiote DNA. They're still animals.

As for the spore thingamagoogie, it's more or less up to wether you want to be a revisionist or not ;)

MorningStar
09-07-2005, 06:20
I don't know about all that but the idea of shooting an ork with an anti-planet missile intriquies me :) or at least chasing him with the weed eater.

Xisor
09-07-2005, 06:50
IIRC even spraying humans with 'Weed Killer' isn't a productive thing to do (ZOMG weee R teh ORkzez!11!one!! :eek: )

Still, it'd be interesting for the effects of an AntiPlant grenade or missile being shot at orks to be dealt with almost as a footnote to a larger article if only to emphasize the oddity of it...

Xisor

Lady's Champion
09-07-2005, 08:49
The only reason I started this btw is cos on the warhammer forum they're all like "orcs aren't plants like in 40k", but then, they aren't plants in 40k either lol

IceFire
09-07-2005, 10:02
i did some research (ie google) and discovered that orks are neither plants nor fungi! :eek: they are in fact a type of lichen; a combination of fungi and algae

http://www.answers.com/main/ntquery?method=4&dsid=2040&dekey=lichen&gwp=8&curtab=2040_1&linktext=lichens

i guess this means that they can grow on peoples skin? :skull:

Sojourner
09-07-2005, 10:14
orks spore and are plants. accept it.

No, they aren't.


It says in the ork codex that orks have both animal and fungal cells

No, it doesn't.

Get your facts right, people. Orks have extra DNA that resembles that of a fungus or algae. Obviously there's no direct analogue because it's an alien organism.

Humans spend their very early lives feeding off nutrients from the placenta. Does this make humans parasites?

No, of course it doesn't. Use a bit of sense.

Note that they aren't the same as lichens or hydra or whatever. These have algae living inside their own body tissues. Orks just have the DNA; it's their own cells expressing the characteristics - namely, chlorophyll.

Lady's Champion
09-07-2005, 10:16
Exactly that's my point

Dr Death
09-07-2005, 10:20
I happen to know that it said orks were plants (of a sort) in one of the Gorkamorka books.

Dr Death

IceFire
09-07-2005, 11:32
from codex orks "...every Orkoid possesses a spiral of an agal/fungal base."
it does not say "fungal like substance" or "xenos fungi" or "resembles fungi" or anything like that. it says fugnal. prehaps fungi is a universal constant?
I think prehaps that there is not a current description that accuratly captures the orkoid species. They start off as fungi, i dont see how you can dispute that, and become as much an animal as humans.
my conclusion; they are both plant and animal.

Sojourner
09-07-2005, 12:13
Fungi aren't plants. You can't be both, hence I assume it's a rough analogy for an alien organism having aspects of both.

Being a fungus is determined by its entire lifecycle. Orks include a mycotic stage, no more. Doesn't make them fungus.

sigur
09-07-2005, 12:22
Fungi aren't plants.

damn you sojourner! There are only a few things I know and I was SO eager to put that little info into this discussion. :D

On topic: Many people (like me) don't like this idea of Orks being basically fungi and overall much fluff GW produced in 3rd edition so I guess that we'll be better off if we just forget about everything that happened between 1998 and 2004.

TheSonOfAbbadon
09-07-2005, 12:27
According to the Ork codex, Orks possess a regular gene strand, basically that of a man, but they also have a secondary spiral of algal/fungal DNA. The primary strand basically does the usual thing, number of limbs, organs etc. the fungal/algal strand works along side it to give Orks their green skin, their resilience and way of reproduction.

So, Orks are neither plant nor animal, they are Orkoid.

Cherubael
09-07-2005, 12:28
On topic: Many people (like me) don't like this idea of Orks being basically fungi and overall much fluff GW produced in 3rd edition so I guess that we'll be better off if we just forget about everything that happened between 1998 and 2004.
The Ork-Fungii relationship didnt start with 3rd ed though, it was around back when Gorka-Morka was produced, with the back page of 'Da Uvver Book' detailing the life cycle of greenskins, and how a single Ork can potentially lead to a planet being overrun thanks to the number of spores he gives off during his lifetime.

Personally i dont see why people have a problem with it. It solves the question as to why we never see a female Ork for example, and makes the Orks a bigger threat, because if you leave just one of them alive, you'll end up with a big problem when he goes on to spawn snotlings, grots, squigs and more Orks in a short period of time.

TheSonOfAbbadon
09-07-2005, 12:35
I love the fact that Orks reproduce in this way, personally. For one thing, it means that you have to burn where all Orks have been to get rid of the spores, which is what they failed to do on Armaggedon, hence the billions of Feral Orks that come out to help with the 3rd war.

Also, female Orks? UGH!

athamas
09-07-2005, 14:13
there were several pages on how orks grow in the gorkamorka books, orks have extra DNA!

Xisor
09-07-2005, 14:42
Right, whilst we can establish they aren't plants per-se, *But* due to the method of their life cycle to the layperson, they grow in your garden. With plants. So, in this regards, people saying 'them orks are plants' is IMO fair enough, even if it's not true.

Personally, it's an interesting perspective to look at, 'breaking the boundaries' of flora and fauna!

Xisor

lordmetroid
09-07-2005, 16:34
There is animals on earth as well that make use of symbiosis with flora.
Reeves for one area is made up of pretty much only those kinds of creatures. Then there is some smaller microscpic animals that make use of chlorophyll symbiosis as well...

Not incorporated into their own DNA though. Not like an Orkoid. I love my Orkz <3

El_Machinae
09-07-2005, 17:12
The closest analogy I can think of is a butterfly or tadpole. These two creatures are much more immoblie than what they become after their chysalis.

The beauty of the ork spore system (or the harm, if you're the Imperium or Empire or whatever) is that any invasion is a successful invasion. The cost of landing orks on a planet is minimal compared to the damage they do.

Any planet they infest will have to continually spend a portion of their non-renewable resources combating the infestation. This will drive any non-advancing planet (like the Imperium) towards a poor-resource state faster. Eventually, each planet runs out on non-renewables (promethium, uranium, etc.) and will have to slide into an agrarian society and be removed from the galactic equation of power.

IceFire
09-07-2005, 17:14
i like the fact that orks reproduce in that way. its unique. we all know how humans come about (damn storks) and i assume eldar and tau are about the same. nids are bugs and necrons do there thing.
Orks are different. I like it.

Vaya
09-07-2005, 17:18
A question that comes to mind is this one:

The Empire obviously knows about Ork reproduction, and is also quite adept at meddling with things on DNA-level (remember Kryptman and his pet lictor?).

Isn't is possible to create some kind of biological weapon to destroy Ork spores?

nurglich
09-07-2005, 17:51
Kryptman had a pet lictor????? you learn something new every day don't ya... really?

Vaya
09-07-2005, 18:00
No, I was just referring to the lictor they caught and infected with some disease, with which they killed the Nids on Tarsis Ultra.

Lady's Champion
09-07-2005, 18:41
So ok they start life as plants so at what point do they look like Orks? There seems to be a gap here...

TheSonOfAbbadon
09-07-2005, 18:51
Start as a spore, then It's basically a cross between a womb and a seed, the womb is underground with the Ork growing like a not-yet born baby human would, and the mushrooms grow up to the surface. I don't know what the mushrooms are for.

Harlequin'sDance
09-07-2005, 19:18
I imagine that the mushroom would be for providing nourishment, as the is no mother to do so. Perhaps via photosynthesis.

MorningStar
09-07-2005, 20:00
Humans spend their very early lives feeding off nutrients from the placenta. Does this make humans parasites?

Well in the strictest sense of the word yes. You can't say symbiotic because a baby really doesn't offer much to its mother while in the womb, doesn't offer much after being born either. :)

I like the idea of Orks being like the Hydra. Would be an interesting conversion an ork with two heads.

PrUpLeHaZe
09-07-2005, 20:32
It wasnt really his pet. They captured it in one of the ultramarines novels on that planet whose name i cant remember and used its dna to make a toxin to kill the nornqueen with. They killed it right after.

Edit: didnt know there were any after the one i was answering. oops