PDA

View Full Version : How to use Empire Captains (On Foot) best



kobraburdz
24-12-2006, 23:35
Anyway I just started playing WHFB as the Empire and Ive already ordered a small force of about 500pts of troops to get me started and 2 Captains which are composed of these guys
http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=WEB023&orignav=300808 (The Guy on the left)

http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=99061102056&orignav=300808
(Guy on foot)

So I was wondering what you guys think the best use for Empire Captains on foot is and I also have some questions on what to equip them with.

Is it good to give them pistols? (They just look cool when they have them and they have bs 5....)

Do I go crazy on his wargear and buy him fullplate, shield, etc. or just keep him cheap as possible?

What magic weapons are best? (I currently have my eye on the sword of sigismund)

Are they better on foot or mounted?

FlameKnight
25-12-2006, 00:11
Always buy fullplate and shield when you don't take magic armour; it's cheap and effective.

At 500 points you're probably best off just taking a greatsword; it's far, far better value for money than most magic weapons. You might consider taking a ward save for your general though, as long as you can spare the points.

vorac
25-12-2006, 00:17
Well imo they are much better mounted with the possibility of having a mundane 1+ save, and i wouldn't bother with any magic weapons as they neither have a great strength or a lot of attacks, when it comes to the empire your characters should take magic items that help the troops, like the rod of command, the griffon banner on a bsb, sigil of sigmar, icon of magnus.

TKitch
25-12-2006, 04:10
at 500 points, I'd either go with a greatsword (only if on foot) or the sword of might for a few more points (almost guaranteed if mounted.)

mounted is a good deal anymore, now that you can still stick him in a normal unit and be protected. (Plus the additional model slot he uses up, he pays for the horse outright.)

kobraburdz
25-12-2006, 23:47
Ok thanks for the advice
Now how does this layout for captain NO. 1 look?

Empire Captain
Battle Standard Bearer (Griffon Banner)
Fullplate
Greatweapon

And for Captain NO. 2
Fullplate
Shield
Sword of Sigismund

Commodus Leitdorf
26-12-2006, 03:19
The purpose of a Captain on foot in a 500pt game is to anchor you battle line. Dont worry about decking him out with anything designed to bring havoc on your enemy, but do try to make it so that he can survive a few hits. Anything to up his Armour save is good in this regard.

You could go cheap and go Full Plate and Shield, mount him on a horse or even arm him with the Armour of Meteoric Iron (Though I dont have the new book yet but if the rumors are true, and they have been so far, the difference between putting your captain on a Horse and the new cost of the AoMI is 4 pts...so unless you really NEED those 4 points i'd go for that)

Whatever choice you go for will dictate your weapon choice...though you can never go wrong with a Greatweapon

Mephistofeles
26-12-2006, 09:35
Well imo they are much better mounted with the possibility of having a mundane 1+ save, and i wouldn't bother with any magic weapons as they neither have a great strength or a lot of attacks, when it comes to the empire your characters should take magic items that help the troops, like the rod of command, the griffon banner on a bsb, sigil of sigmar, icon of magnus.

I'm sorry but a hero for 50 points which has 3 attacks at Strenght 4 with WS 5, do you call that a low number of low strenght attacks? With a great weapon that's 3 strenght 6 WS5 attacks, for about 58 points...

Negativemoney
26-12-2006, 12:01
I would take a Captain with full plate Sword of Might and Enchanted shield. This will give him a 2+ armor save on foot and 3 S5 WS5 attacks which is more thany you need in a 500 point game.

If you are going to take a BSB don't bother giving him a magic banner unless it is a warbanner but rather give him a sword of striking or a sword of justice.

Falkman
26-12-2006, 15:29
mounted is a good deal anymore, now that you can still stick him in a normal unit and be protected. (Plus the additional model slot he uses up, he pays for the horse outright.)
I read through the rulebook quite thoroughly when I got it, and as far as I remember characters on mounts no longer takes up the extra space they occupy in the unit, so a mounted captain does not use up an additional model slot in the unit.


Empire Captain
Battle Standard Bearer (Griffon Banner)
Fullplate
Greatweapon
You can't give him a great weapon if he's the BSB (unless, of course, they changed the wording for that in the new Empire book).

Mephistofeles
26-12-2006, 20:31
You can't give him a great weapon if he's the BSB (unless, of course, they changed the wording for that in the new Empire book).

No you are correct, you still can't.

And to Negavitemoney: I would take a greatsword over the shield and sword of might any day. Remember that the sword of might doesn't confer the +1 extra armour save that a hand weapon does. With a great sword you can choose to have a 4+ save with strenght 6, or a 2+ save with strenght 4, and always have 3+ against shooting. That is nice.

kobraburdz
26-12-2006, 22:02
Ok whoops sorry didnt know that BSB couldnt have a great weapon. Now Ive actually been able to expand my game into 1000 pts (Thanks to Christmas!) and because of the fact that im less constrained points wise do I still keep them cheap or do i go out and buy more expensive stuff now?

Lord Vilmore
27-12-2006, 16:08
I'd go for a magic weapon here and there now as the prices are normal now. hooozaa:)
But mounted they get a very good armour save pretty cheap aswell and cant be picked out anymore so I'd go for that.

Corrupt
27-12-2006, 20:34
Plan for any combat hero on foot?
Stick him in a big central block of infantry to anchor the middle of the line!

Baindread
28-12-2006, 00:05
I read through the rulebook quite thoroughly when I got it, and as far as I remember characters on mounts no longer takes up the extra space they occupy in the unit, so a mounted captain does not use up an additional model slot in the unit.

Why shouldn't he? He still physically uses up space so why wouldn't that count?

TKitch
28-12-2006, 14:51
Why shouldn't he? He still physically uses up space so why wouldn't that count?

Quite much. A Horse's base is at least as long as 2 human bases. (25x50mm versus 20x20.)

So, It actually takes up 2.5 deep, so unless you're sticking the captain WAY out in front of the unit (which would be rather against the rules) you're going to eat a model slot with the horsey.

It's simple geometry. Big rectangle eats more space than little square.

captaincortez
29-12-2006, 22:06
I have had success putting a simple handgun on my captain (along with a GS and full plate). As I use him to anchor my battleline in a unit of greatswords, he doesn't move all that much. With BS5, you can certainly make up the points for the handgun.

Rivlo
30-12-2006, 21:11
I would suggest using this:

Captain
Horse
Fullplate/Shield
BSB
Holy Relic (To make sure he doesn't die)

Captain
Horse
Fullplate/Shield
Sword of Sigismund (That's the one thats +1strength strike first right? if not take that one)

And then stick these two guys in units of 25 swordsmen or whatever you use and give them 8 or 10 man halberd units for detachments. Add in knights/cannons/mortars and bob's your uncle!

Oh and The easiest way to fit your horse-riding cappys in a normal unit is put them on the longer mordheim bases (stack two on top of eachother).

Festus
31-12-2006, 09:15
Hi

...the longer mordheim bases ... What are those??? :wtf:

A cavalry character goes on a 25x50mm base, there is no alternative, as given on p.7, BRB.

Festus

Mephistofeles
31-12-2006, 12:55
As Festus said, you don't have a choice on what base to take. In 40k I think you are allowed to put them on bigger bases than the ones reccomended, but not in this game.

And by the way Rivlo, the BSB can't have a shield.

Rivlo
31-12-2006, 15:13
What are those??? :wtf:

A cavalry character goes on a 25x50mm base, there is no alternative, as given on p.7, BRB.


I'll have to check with my friend on that, as he said it's completely legal... It might have been some other alternative game base, but it was the exact same size as two swordsmen bases. Besides, unless you're playing in a huge tournament, I'm sure no one would nitpick at you for a having 5mm less width on the Cappy. For tournament games, you'll probably just have to grin and bear it, unless you put him on foot (which takes away from his armour save and the ability to charge out of the unit).


BTW I play O&G so I really don't have a problem with basing, considering that my orcs are on the larger bases so a cavalry base fits perfectly. :D

Negativemoney
01-01-2007, 20:10
Honestly the width could mean the diffrence from getting 5 models into BtB to getting 6 or even a 2nd unti clipping it. Going larger most people won't complain about but going smaller will make it seem like you are trying to exploit certain rules. As Festus says its in the rule book under the description of cavalry.

Cpt.Hellboy
01-01-2007, 20:23
Empire captins rock!They are one of the cheapest heros around. Give him full plate and a shield. If you have a big cavarly unit of knights then give the captain a barded horse with lance. If he is in a mele unit then just give him a normal sword or great weapon. Remeber though that he is cheap and keep it that way so you can have a big army.
For Sigmar!

Drogmir
02-01-2007, 09:55
Does anybody have recommendations for when a captain should use a pistol and a sword on a horse combo?

Valkyrie
03-01-2007, 11:05
well before the new empire was released, I used to give them full plate and enchanted shield and a random magic item... 2+armour is usually good enough to withstand most of the incomming blows...

Lieutenant Frederic Henry
05-01-2007, 20:49
Keep 'em cheap. A great weapon and full plate is all you really need, though a handgun is nice sometime. Any magic items selected should go towards improving the chances of his unit's survival, not your Captain's survival. Rod of Command is nice, but there are other options. Remember, Empire Heroes are support characters, not rank breakers. Use them as such, and they'll shine. Tool 'em up for combat and challenges and what not, and the other bigger, gribblier, scarier races will chop them to pieces. They can beat a unit champion if you give 'em full plate and a greatsword. If you are challenging other things, you're either very brave or very foolish.
Cheers.

bigbauske
05-01-2007, 23:55
I never used a pistol on my general, I usually use meteoric iron, a sword of battle and then throw in Van Horstmans Specelum. I find it a nice combo that con suprises a few people.

Makarion
06-01-2007, 06:49
For the cost of what people buy in magic items on their general alone, I buy another two ranks of infantry...

Enchanted Shield is almost the only item I am really fond of, all others are going to benefit the unit, not the model. Having said this, I sometimes take an item for background-story reasons.

grashnak
06-01-2007, 23:46
What do you guys consider good items to help units?

GRASHNAK

Von Wibble
07-01-2007, 12:29
For those of you advocating horsies - remember that a great weapon only gives +1 S in this instance. So you can't get above S5 without spending points on magic items. Whilst of course my preferred combo of Armour of Meteoric Iron and great weapon gives S6 and the 1+ save. Important distinction against Orcs and the like I feel.

Otoh if you are happy enough with S5 there are other good magic items. Rod of command is a good choice and has improved as you now choose when to use it.

Icon of Magnus is imo a must have against armies like undead. Its a nice counter to greatswords weakness of fear also (in that stubborn doesn't help here and they will be more likely outnumbered).

Items like the Silver Horn or Orb of Thunder if taken would be given to archlectors who have the points to spare.

Doomfire Ring (again much improved) is one for faster characters who can line up nasty shots...

MarcoPollo
08-01-2007, 17:48
I am thinking of using him like this:

Captain
Full Plate, Great Weapon, Longbow, Rod of command.

I will put him in a unit of archers and bait with him.
I need the mobilitiy to keep up with the skirmishing archers, and the ability to shoot (so handgun is out). Plus given the advantages of lining up your characters when charged allows to get a good match-up when the mele fighting begins.

Putting him on a horse is a no go for skirmishers as these cannot be combined.

Of course he can join other units when necessary.

Mephistofeles
09-01-2007, 10:49
I'm thinking of adding a captain to my greatswords, and keep him down to just full plate and greatsword, just so as to give them some more hitting power, their normal 6 attacks is way to little for such a strong and expensive unit.

I would consider giving him something which helps the unit, isn't there some item which gives the unit magic resistance? I think I've seen one, just can't remember what it was called.

Von Wibble
09-01-2007, 20:13
Sigil of Sigmar 15pts. One of my favourite filler items.

Keller
10-01-2007, 05:27
I've been on hiatus from Warhammer for a few months, so I have yet to pick up the new book. From the little I have read, it doesn't look like my plans will be changing much for how to use them.

My standard outfit is simply plate armor with a halberd. Leadership 8, 4+ save, 3 S5 attacks for about 65 points. Makes a great addition to any unit without taxing the army.

I also like to try various new strategies from time to time, very similar to Marco's idea. I have had reasonable success with a captain w/ a longbow and Rings of Volans or Doomfire in a unit of archers. Makes a great harassing unit that can actually fight a bit.