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Cirenivel
31-12-2006, 23:51
so, what is the best count-as for a chaos defiler?
i know that some might say "why do you want to make a count-as?"
well...Beacause its UGLY, i just don't like the model.
anyways, please come with some propositions.
thanks

Cirenivel

Grimtuff
31-12-2006, 23:55
Well, it would help if you told us a number of things, such as which CSM Legion you play and what design aspects you are looking for.

Cirenivel
01-01-2007, 00:03
i don't have a chaos army yet, i'm gonna buy one in a months time, and i wanted some advice on the defiler a bit ahead of the big buy.
Altough it will probably be Black or Alpha legion, and i doesn't have a clue on what to use as a count-as.

Cirenivel

Grimtuff
01-01-2007, 00:05
It would REALLY help to know. Black Legion i'm picturing large tracks instead of legs (not sure why) and Alpha Legion just take the Hydra motif and run with it.

Hicks
01-01-2007, 00:14
Indeed, a big chaosy tank would do the trick. Grimtuff's idea of an hydra is excellent. You could use defiler legs and model hydra heads where the claws are to create a mechanical monster.

There are also pictures of a scorpionesque construct that uses the defiler as a base.

Acolyte
01-01-2007, 00:20
Make a Knight Titan out of it. There's several logs on how in the P&T section, and Mechs >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Everything.

lord_blackfang
01-01-2007, 01:18
Here's another variant.

http://gallery.blackfang.net/Images/Sons/oni_01.jpg

bertcom1
01-01-2007, 01:37
There are also pictures of a scorpionesque construct that uses the defiler as a base.


Here's another variant.

Is this the one Hicks means?

That's a really impressive model, lord_blackfang. Is it yours? Did it win anything in a Golden Demon?

Is that a Khorne Berzerker it is holding?

Gensuke626
01-01-2007, 02:22
i don't have a chaos army yet, i'm gonna buy one in a months time, and i wanted some advice on the defiler a bit ahead of the big buy.
Altough it will probably be Black or Alpha legion, and i doesn't have a clue on what to use as a count-as.

Cirenivel

Chaos in general, I'd use a tank or a dread, since it will move only at walker pace anyhow.

Black legion, being the most undivided that undivided gets...I dunno, I've always considered the design to be originally Black Legion...maybe make a 'prototype' defiler based on a dread...

Alpha Legion on the otherhand, allows you into a world of possibilities, alot following Demi Ork Logic. I mean...if you modified a Hellhound to have a Battle Cannon on an artillery mount...you could do it that way...or use the russ as a base...

lord_blackfang
01-01-2007, 02:43
Is this the one Hicks means?

No idea...



That's a really impressive model, lord_blackfang. Is it yours? Did it win anything in a Golden Demon?

Thanks. Mine. No GDs in my backwards little country :(



Is that a Khorne Berzerker it is holding?
Yup. And there's another one under the other claw.
http://gallery.blackfang.net/Images/Sons/oni_05.jpg

guillimansknight
01-01-2007, 02:57
Here's another variant.

http://gallery.blackfang.net/Images/Sons/oni_01.jpg

omg how did you makes that!!!!


cool model

slanesh defiler counts as are great iv been drawing up one its a huge spider/deamon/machine type thing(like an oblit style defiler but a lot more spider like )and it looks like a spider demonette(is that how you spell it?)
with amour and leg supports fixed on ceyborg(spelling?) style

note: the spell check thing dosent work for me:wtf: (sorry:confused: )

Misanthrope
01-01-2007, 04:41
Dear sweet Jesus, that is WAY TOO MUCH PINK. Otherwise very nice conversion.

Personally I think any counts-as Defiler should be a walker of some sort. Otherwise you could just take a Basilisk or Leman Russ, stick arms on it, a reaper autocannon and heavy flamer and call it a Defiler which is a little cheap.

1 - As a walker it can only move 6" in the movement phase, so its considerably slower than the average vehicle.
2 - As a walker it can charge in the assault phase and engage in close combat so it should have some believable methods and tools for doing so. It might be cool to simply give it some Destroyer-looking upgrades like gigantic saws or steam rollers but remember enemy units can fight back...
3 - As a walker it can move safely over difficult terrain.
4 - It has automatic daemonic possession, although this doesn't have to be reflected visually, it could be.

I'd say my two most likely "visions" of a counts-as would either be a battle tank such as a Russ that has been massively warped by Chaos, its weapons replaced, its hull gutted and torn with daemonic features bubbling and screaming over its surfaces, and perhaps the front adorned with a wall of grabbing clawed hands... OR some sort of super-Dreadnought. Although I'm unsure of the compatibility of the parts, it might be interesting to try and take the turret of the Defiler (with autocannon and heavy flamer) and attach it to the legs of a regular Dreadnought (or Forgeworld one!). Attach some sort of minor close-combat impliments and there you go!

As a side note I think the Defiler model is absolutely rediculous and stupid. Glad to see someone else agrees! Ugliness aside, I think its also very contradictory -- it has two gigantic claws that themselves are almost as large as the upper body of a Dreadnought and yet it has only STR6? At the very least they should count as Dreadnought CCWs (STR10 Power Weapons) but whatever, yet another of the reasons why the model is silly.

Now that I've mentioned it I'd really like to see a Dreadnought-Defiler combo conversion...

Lord Humongous
01-01-2007, 04:54
How about a FW "big squigoth" model with mechanized / chaotic type modifications? It would be particularly suitable for LatD, I think. If you don't want to splash out the cash to cut up a FW model (and who does?) a nice dino model, some plasticard, some tubing, and so on should get you there with a bit of patience.

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Orks/Squiggoth1.jpg

Sakura1000
01-01-2007, 09:07
I would personally use something from Tyranids, like a carnifex and model on like, the cannon over it's shoulder and flamers on the arms, could think of it like a giant mutated beast from the Warp

xibo
01-01-2007, 10:25
@catgirl isn't a tzeentch defiler more probably going to slaughter plague marines/zombies/cultists than khorne berzerkers?

@topic: you could try converting a dark elve war hydra to an alpha legion defiler... it could have two riders with an autocan'/lascan' and another one with an heavy flamer/havoc missile launcher/five arms mutation, and the battlecannon being some kind of arm or leg or tail or... tongue

Tonberry
01-01-2007, 10:39
@catgirl isn't a tzeentch defiler more probably going to slaughter plague marines/zombies/cultists than khorne berzerkers?

Yes, but the Bezerker plastics are alot more posable than the Plague marine plastics.

studderigdave
01-01-2007, 10:40
you can also make use of other models in your quest to mae defilers. i agree with you, the current defiler model is horrible. i made my own:

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c322/studderingdave/Death%20Guard/Defiler1.jpg

keep in mind it might not be the look your going for, as i play deathguard.

Helicon_One
01-01-2007, 11:38
For that authentic Old Skool feel, how about remaking one of the old Khornate Daemon Engines?

http://www.solegends.com/citcat9x3/c92408epicchaoswarmachine-03.htm
http://www.solegends.com/citcat9x3/c92409epicchaosorkwarmach-03.htm

Tim

Cirenivel
01-01-2007, 12:48
http://gallery.blackfang.net/Images/Sons/oni_05.jpg

that looks very good, can you please explain how you made it?

Cirenivel

Cirenivel
01-01-2007, 12:49
you can also make use of other models in your quest to mae defilers. i agree with you, the current defiler model is horrible. i made my own:

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c322/studderingdave/Death%20Guard/Defiler1.jpg

keep in mind it might not be the look your going for, as i play deathguard.

you'r right, it's not exactly what i'm looking for, but it seems to scream death guard. Very nice model
Thanks for the idea

Cirenivel

jubilex
01-01-2007, 13:17
Off topic, so sorry, but misanthrope stated that defiler s was 6. I have the first print of the dex and it is s10, is this one of the changes?

Slaaneshi Slave
01-01-2007, 13:33
Str 10 is with the DCCW added in. Its the same for all other dreadnought type vehicles.

jubilex
01-01-2007, 13:51
Thanks slaaneshi. Talked to you a while back (go, go, Gogol Vox) and my mate, norsemantyr turned up. He found himself near your location some years past. Couple of days ago saw a post by you about the milan and wondered what you did for a living.

Rlyehable
01-01-2007, 14:07
Here are some that I found on the internet:

http://www.coolminiornot.com/134498
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c398/jsvironfurnace/DSCN0871.jpg
http://www.coolminiornot.com/118267
http://www.flameon.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1863&highlight=&sid=da76fad4d38ae7166ef8a27121ce1991
http://z11.invisionfree.com/Work_In_Progress/index.php?showtopic=6624&view=getnewpost
http://s11.invisionfree.com/Work_In_Progress/index.php?showtopic=3734


I liked the conversion that GW sold before the release of the actual Defiler kit, but I could not find a picture of it.

Tonberry
01-01-2007, 15:09
This is what I did when I saw how horrible the Defiler model was:

http://img487.imageshack.us/my.php?image=defilernv2.jpg

Lord Humongous
01-01-2007, 17:02
Str 10 is with the DCCW added in. Its the same for all other dreadnought type vehicles.

I've got the first printing, which lists it as str8, and makes no mention of DCCW's. Did they change that?

In any case, the Defiler is counted as a Monsterous Creature, so it already ignores armor and messes up vehicles. Str 8 / no armor save is plenty good against most infantry (or anything with toughness short of a wraithlord or carnifex) and 2d6 penetration will take care of any vehicles.

Dreads are not Monsterous Creatures, which is why they need DCCW's.

sanctusmortis
01-01-2007, 17:06
GW Newcastle has a Brass Scorpion-esque model made out of the Defiler bits. Looks awesome, but unfortunately I don't have pics.

xibo
01-01-2007, 17:45
I've got the second german printing, that is, the third english one. My codex says the defiler is a strength 8 monstrous creature. It does not say it can be equipped with dreadnaught CCW...

toxic_wisdom
01-01-2007, 18:51
Yeah - Defiler is S8 per current codex, and does not have/need close combat weapon. Some confusion may exist because of the tentacle weapon. That can simply be used for the Living Vehicle upgrade.