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mark.
02-01-2007, 11:14
Hello, Ive been considering some heavy beastmen troops:

chaos ogres, strong and cheap

chaos trolls, strong and with the regeneration rule very high staying power, Im only afraid a unit breaks and flees, theyre more expensive then ogres and they cant wear any armor which is very sorry

minotaurs, better ws then ogres which is worth it, but no heavy armor :( ogres can get 3+ saves and mino's only 4+

dragon ogres, very powerful but when comparing them to the rest a bit expensive for what you get, I think one troll could match up a dragon ogre, but still its more expensive, however I hear people positively talking about them, the storm rage special rule isnt so powerful is it?

I wonder what's the best choice, and how much of them should I field? And with what equipment??


Also another qeustion, how much gors/ungors shall I field in my beast herd?


Thanks in the advance, mark.

Sherlocko
02-01-2007, 11:18
Most people love minotaurs and DO over the choices you have listed. Depends also a little bit on wich marks you are using.

On herds it depends how big herd you want. But more gors than 7-8 are just a waste, because they are only there to chop, the ungors are there for the static CR.

mark.
02-01-2007, 11:26
Ok thanks, the minotaurs are a great choice indeed, the WS4 is propably more worth then the heavy armor of ogres, shall I field 3 minotaurs or more?

And as for the beastherd, is 16 a good number? That makes 7 gor/9 ungor or 8 of both?

mark.
02-01-2007, 12:21
Also, which is better, 5 marauder horsemen or 5 centigor? Centigor look pretty powerful to and are about as cheap.

cerealkiller195
02-01-2007, 16:42
i'm all about minos when i played chaos and included blood greed is pretty useful for chasing down units you break.

Selsaral
02-01-2007, 18:04
The stupidity on the trolls should not be underestimated. They are extremely unreliable. Even with Archaon (ld 10) or such in your army, they can still fail to perform. Other than that, yeah, they rock.

The 7 move on the dragon ogres is extra juicy. Further, with great weapons they have 7 strength which can fill a roll no chaos ogre or chaos troll can compete with. Don't forget they have 4 wounds each either. Gorthor is the only chariot in the game I think who isn't terrified at the thought of a free charge on dragon ogres, and even he wouldn't want to do it.

I also like minotaurs and chaos ogres, depending on my general and the broader concept of my army. In small warbands battles (500 points or less) I found that armoured, fear-causing and cheap chaos ogres were great. In khornate armies, chaos minotaurs with the mark of khorne are sensational.

mark.
03-01-2007, 15:20
I am planning in taking some khorne, and because of other answers, Ill take minotaurs then.

How much? 3?

And Im still unsure about my fast cavalry, marauder or centigor??

Thanks for the asnwers.

Sashu
03-01-2007, 18:00
First, Centagors are fast, and cav, but they are NOT fast cav.

My vote would be mauraders. I don't like the Drunken rule. You don't want your fast light cav, being stupid on the turn you need them, or being frenzy when you don't want them do be.

As to how many big guys, I would say 3 or 4. They are on 40 mm bases (correct me if I'm wrong) so, against a unit that is 5 models wide you can get 4 into base to base.

Also, be sure to give them two hand weapons. They are a great buy.

mark.
03-01-2007, 19:34
Ok drunk is not good indeed.

But the 2hw was my last choice actually, I was doubting between the shield (total AS 4+) or the great weapon, the minotaurs already have 3 attacks so I'd think GW is more useful, however last strike is not so great, I4 is still pretty good.

But if GW is out of the picture I would choose the shield, extra HW is not worth it I think, they already have nice attacks.

sephiroth87
04-01-2007, 16:53
I'm also in agreement with the minotaurs. They're also useful for fleeing charges, as most of the beastman units have terrible leadership. The minos, however, can flee a charge and your opponent won't expect it. Then charge him in the side with something, and slam back into the front of the unit with the minotaur unit after you rally.

mark.
04-01-2007, 17:08
Thanks for the hints, Im not into that kind of tactics but im anxious to try.

How much mino's shall I put in one unit? And should I get them a shield or another weapon?

fearchanges
04-01-2007, 18:59
go for 3 minotaurs with great weapons and the centigors with shields, I always use these and never complain about them.

mark.
06-01-2007, 18:49
Ok something Ive been thinking about, thanks!

_Ashdil_
07-01-2007, 21:17
I dont have any mins for my beastmen, but I would love to have them. Ogres are good, but not good enough IMHO. The extra points for Minos are well worth it! And as I play nurgle that 5+ scaly skin is great!
Other then that trollz are as people say, to hard to rely on, but with the new stupidity rules, they can atleast fight even if stupid.
Centigors rock! And the models are just awesome, why I only have five of them is just a money problem, I would like to have 4x5 sometime and see how that goes.

I also love my 3 dragon ogres. Thier Ld of 7 is not too good, but as a beast player you cant rely on a units ld! I have them with add HW as 4 S5 attacks works better then 3 S7 vs most enemies I normaly meet (low T enemies)

So Dragon ogres and Minos, plus centigors is what I should go for.

Selsaral
08-01-2007, 14:29
I also love my 3 dragon ogres. Thier Ld of 7 is not too good, but as a beast player you cant rely on a units ld! I have them with add HW as 4 S5 attacks works better then 3 S7 vs most enemies I normaly meet (low T enemies)


Dragon Ogres are LD 8. ;)

Makaber
08-01-2007, 14:40
Allright, this is how it works. The Beastman monsters basically come in three flavours:

Offensive: The Minotaurs. High weapon skill, viritually no armour. Always give them great weapons: For many attacks with low strength, you can use Beastherds. The only time additional hand weapons on minotaurs are better, is when you expect them to fight more than the round they charge, and you don't want that.

Defensive: The Ogres. Ogres with great weapons are generally inferior to Minotaurs, as their heavy armour option still doesn't provide enough protection to reliably shield them from harm, and they get expensive very quickly if you give them shields as well. For a heavy hitter unit, they suffer from not having the WS4 of the Minotaurs. Their unique advantage is their ability to have a 3+ save in close combat, which is unrivaled in the Beastmen army list. However, since Beastmen typically play very aggressivly, it's hard for them to find a place in the overall battle plan.

Flexible: The Trolls. With their many attacks, regeneration, and option to vomit, Trolls are both survivable and hard hitting, and can fill the roles of both Minotarus and Ogres. However, there's a price to pay: Their stupidity coupled with the low Leadership values of Beastman heroes means they're very unreliable.

Finally, there's the Dragon Ogres. They're not a niche category in themselves, because quite simply they're best. Their speed, on par with heavy cavalry, is a godsendt, they're very survivable, and their high Strength means they can punch through anything. However, they're of course very expensive and will attract a lot of attention.

As for what you should field, it's really up to you. I'd strongly recommend Minotaurs though, since they provide the punch the Beastmen army needs to win it's combats. Always give them great weapons. I can't say much about Ogres since I don't have any experience with them, but I'd deck them out in armour, since the great weapon shock troop is a niche better filled with Minotaurs. Trolls can be fun, but I wouldn't use them unless you have a Minotaur Lord as general, because they really need Ld 9 around. If you have the points to upgrade some Minotaurs to Dragon Ogres, it can be a very worthwhile investment.

For unit size (for Minotaurs and Dragon Ogres primarily), 3 works, but 4 is best. Anything over 4 is redundant.

For un/gor balance, 7-10 gors is all you need: 7 to fill the front rank, and then some replacements. Anything more than that is pretty redundant, as they're more expensive and prevents the ungors from getting in the second rank where they can use their spears. Fill the rest with ungors.

mark.
08-01-2007, 17:13
Thanks ofr the answers.

Indeed, minotaurs seem great offensive troops.
The heavy beastmen troops are not very good defensive at all I think, because they don't have got any ranks at all.

But Ive just bought the minotaurs, but I only bought 3, however I can buy a fourth in some time, I think Ill make it with my 3 until then.

Anyway, Id like to thank everybody who posted, Ive bought my stuff now.
I think Ill field 6 gor 9 ungor or 7/8.