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dingareth
12-07-2005, 21:05
Any of y'all still remember the good days? And any return in sight?

Olith
12-07-2005, 21:10
It won't return, certainly not like it was. :(

Brimstone
12-07-2005, 21:29
Agreed, it was way too card intensive and expensive for GW to produce.

Best you'll get I expect is some form of maritime expansion for Warmaster but given the current state of Specialist Games that's pretty doubtful as well.

Baggers
12-07-2005, 22:03
I think the Warmaster maratime article was in issue six of Fanatic mag.

Cherrystone
12-07-2005, 22:33
I play man o war with out any card counters and templates as its fairly easy to create a fleet sheet whete you can record all teh ships details and damage etc, if anyone wants to have a look its on a word document.

Griefbringer
12-07-2005, 22:36
Cherrystone, I got the same idea some time ago - make a table for each ship type where you mark out the possible damage locations.

Having a separate template for each individual ship was a little bit beyond the realms of practicality in my opinion.

grave digger
13-07-2005, 01:11
Cherrystone,

please send me a copy of your document to g_digger@lycos.com


I love Man-o-War. Still one of my all time favorite GW games. I just wish I could find someone willing to play around here :(

Now if only GW could figure out how to put all of the cards on as a PDF and just sell the rules/ships.

Diggs

Karhedron
13-07-2005, 09:13
Considering that pretty much all the other games GW have produced are available from Specialist games in some form, I have always found it odd that Man O' War has completely vanished. Does anyone know how well it sold? Maybe it just never shifted enough to be considered worth resurrecting.

Jedi152
13-07-2005, 09:43
I remember reading somewhere that all the ship moulds have deteriorated (sp?) quite badly, to the point that they are now useless. GW couldn't recast ships if it wanted to.

No matter. I have the original game, i have downloaded the Plague Fleet and Sea of Blood rulebooks (I usually dislike black market downloads, but seeing as GW will never republish it, i figure that makes it 'abandonware', and my conscience is clear!)

Ships i plan to get from Langton Miniatures (http://www.rodlangton.com/index.html) 1:1200 Napoleonic range. The even have a Baltic range with sails and oars to use as wargalleys and empire wolfships!

Griefbringer
13-07-2005, 12:55
Does anyone know how well it sold?

From what I have heard, it sold much better in the US than in UK.

x-esiv-4c
13-07-2005, 14:46
Quite sad acutally. Man O' War was a brilliant game. Wish they would bring it back, it had loads of potential.

rkunisch
13-07-2005, 16:30
I think the Warmaster maratime article was in issue six of Fanatic mag.
There have been naval rules in Fanatic Magazine, but I do not think that it was that what Rick P meant when he spoke about Man'O'Warmaster. :(


Considering that pretty much all the other games GW have produced are available from Specialist games in some form, I have always found it odd that Man O' War has completely vanished. Does anyone know how well it sold? Maybe it just never shifted enough to be considered worth resurrecting.
They said something similiar about Warhammer Quest and Space Hulk. The main argument was along the lines that some file with the original artwork was missing. :rolleyes: I think it was never more than an excuse. If you look at the current Specialist Games, they have only a moderate amount of markers and card elements. They concentrated on rules and minis and that was a fair deal - if you remember the former support of this games it was a big improvement.

Well, the new Specialist Games is something completely different. :mad: Not only have they reduced the staff and nearly everything printed, as far as I remember there was no release of new minis for at least two or three months. The last one was the BoFA box. The future looks dark. :cries:

Have fun,

Rolf.

Jack Burton
17-07-2005, 09:18
god this is still my favorite gw game. My rule books for plauge fleet and the core book were trashed by my parents when I went off to college. I still have my skaven fleet and the beginings of my norse and slaanesh fleets. If anyone knows where I can track down new rules I would be forever in their debt. I was hopping that pirates of the spanish main might spur gw to reprint this game, but to no avail... I have heard for years that they were toying with redoing it, but all we have gotten is crappy boat rules for fantasy. Long live the red seas of man o war and those proud individuals that once sailed them!!!! :cries:

Orcdom
18-07-2005, 03:54
i would like that documet as well
orcdom@hotmail.com
Steve

StormKnight
18-07-2005, 21:30
I absolutely love Man O War - probably one of my favorite GW games, down to thinking the models were fantastic. I'm not suprised it did not do well though - the models were way too expensive, and GW probably didn't sell a lot of them since you didn't need very many to make a fleet.

grave digger
18-07-2005, 23:20
Expensive? That was one of the few reasons it was so great. It was not expensive. Almost all of the fleets could be made with very little cash. The only exception (that comes to mind) was Chaos Dwarves. You had to purchase a Man-o-War and escorts in one box. And the box was wacky. I remember that the ship you had to have more of came with the escort ships that you wanted the least. End result, having to purchase more of the Man-o-Wars you could not use to get more escorts that you wanted.

Dwarves, Norse, High Elves and Empire were all easy to build and cheap too boot. A box of Escorts ran around $10. You need about three of these boxes. Man-o-Wars ran between $15 and $20 I seem to recall. Could dig out old WD if need be.

End result, a fleet for around $80. The box was the greatest cost but well worth it for all of the doo-dads that came in it.

Man-o-War was many things, but not expensive.

Diggs

Orcdom
18-07-2005, 23:22
yes you could get a fleet for under 100.00 and that was no small fleet for that price either.
Steve

Jedi152
19-07-2005, 08:53
Man-o-War was many things, but not expensive.

Diggs
I know i've been ranting about GW a lot recently, but here goes...

Sadly i believe that is the reason that many of the 'smaller' games were dropped. GW want people to spends £££ and buy an army, not just a few £'s worth of figures.

Take WHQ. You brought the set, and could play indefinitely, or just buy an £8 character and add a whole new dimension to the game. SH, you just needed the game.

The reason the current SG were kept going is because you still need to spend a reasonable amount on them to play them.

Another reason showing how GW is controlled by the accountants now.

f2k
19-07-2005, 11:12
Jedi, I think you nailed it. Man-o-War, Space Hulk, Blood Bowl, Battlefleet Gothic, Warhammer Quest, Necromunda, Mordheim and GorkaMorka – all great games that could (almost) be played straight out of the box.
Where are these games now? Sacrificed in the name of profit…

Olith
19-07-2005, 12:01
Yeah, the games mentioned don't fit into the current GW ethos.

They were expenive to produce - large number of card parts.
The needed few figures - GW's main source of income. They themselves proclaim they are a miniture company that makes games.
Take up valuble instore shelf space.

It's a shame GW don't sell the boxed games lincense off to another company and let them fill the shelves of Toys "R" Us and other such stores.

rkunisch
19-07-2005, 13:02
I am not sure that profit is the only reason that those games have been (nearly) droped. It is also about resoureces. If you look at the current range of products, you will find that there is a lot more than the time the board games were released. There is LotR as a third core game which constantly get new rules/minis. 40K and WFB have both expanded army ranges and special campaign books. This problem had been addressed with the foundation of Fanatic. I think profit was the reason it has been downsized. Nevertheless, I think there is far more to it than only profit.

Have fun,

Rolf.

Jack Burton
21-07-2005, 05:49
I for one do not believe that this game was unprofitable. I also think many people here would agree with me in saying that this game would do very well for them in even a limited or specialist release capacity. All of the newbs have heard many of us old salts rant and rave about this game, and I know many that have gone to ebay for it. Just look at how much people generally pay for it now. I would love to see a petition expressing interest in a new man o war and see how may would play a new plastic version. Nows the time for ship games, lets get our favorite back!!!!

Vogon
21-07-2005, 08:30
Yeah, the games mentioned don't fit into the current GW ethos.

They were expenive to produce - large number of card parts.
The needed few figures - GW's main source of income. They themselves proclaim they are a miniture company that makes games.
Take up valuble instore shelf space.

It's a shame GW don't sell the boxed games lincense off to another company and let them fill the shelves of Toys "R" Us and other such stores.

All of which is true but misses a fairly major point. They are a GREAT introduction to the hobby. My first ever GW experience was Blood Bowl 17 years ago. I would never have picked up WFB if I'd not played BB and I've been in the hobby and spending ever since. Ohyes and I loved MoW and have a substantial Dark Elf fleet :)

Cheers

Vogon

Jack Burton
21-07-2005, 08:35
vogon makes a great point, I would never become the skaven fanatic if it were not for man o war. This game gave me a chance to "test out" the skaven and get a feel for the army. One day the plauge fleet shall sail again!

Orcdom
21-07-2005, 21:31
speaking of dark elf fleet i need some ships got any extras? here are some othe extras i have:
elf dragonship
elf dragon riders
elf eagle riders
Imperial wolf ships
plastic wargalleys

Steve

gortexgunnerson
26-07-2005, 10:11
Well think the mould story could be try against the purely money side (much as it hurts me to defend GW lol) but Blowl bowl requires even less expense and that is still marketed.

I do think the one thing that the new management just don't get about gamers is that we view models like junkies view coke. You can never have enough and its very hard to stop buying them. Vetern gamers will usually start to have an army for everything, basically the idea of hiking the price for armies will just drive people to games like Pirates of the spainish main (which is v cool and Man O war like, we're working on a cross over but empire/brettonian fleet for manowar would be v easy other races not so) if stuff was cheaper like for games like blood bowl or man o war we just buy more. For blood bowl I have every classic team and generally a couple of extra generations of my favourates.

But if your man o war lovers play pirates, moving ships, shooting with little card rulers, damaged ships loss cannons etc etc. The rules are abit simpler and seem to require a few house rules to play it smoothly but is laugh. Only main difference is you move your whole fleet then your oppenent moves theirs but you can only do 1 action per turn i.e. more, shoot, repair etc

f2k
26-07-2005, 10:35
Well think the mould story could be try against the purely money side (much as it hurts me to defend GW lol) but Blowl bowl requires even less expense and that is still marketed.

Yes, but it did take a lot of whining from the gaming community to get it back on the shelves…

Orcdom
26-07-2005, 22:48
but now my local store has to special order any blood bowl, GW is not wanting to fill it, they are wanting it a mail order only item. like the rest of the finatic games.

Steve

raged_norm
26-07-2005, 23:35
If it helps anyone, I'm willing to takes offers on a near complete boxed game.

It's missing the plastic ships and the large summary sheets and wargalley ship templates but otherwise contains everything you need to play....

PM me with offers, cash only please

spud
27-07-2005, 00:56
Funny thing with GW is that even when they discontinue a product line, they never get rid of the unsold or "overstocked" product. It just sits there in un-opened boxes in their warehouses. I remember working for them a few years back and checking out the warehouse in Ontario and finding all kinds of Warhammer Role Playing books, Epic 40k and others all still in boxes and under shrink wrapping.

I would think it might be worth your while to beg and plead with your mail order reps/hobby specialists to see if you can get your grubby mits on the stuff.

phusg
09-09-2005, 10:43
god this is still my favorite gw game. My rule books for plauge fleet and the core book were trashed by my parents when I went off to college. I still have my skaven fleet and the beginings of my norse and slaanesh fleets. If anyone knows where I can track down new rules I would be forever in their debt. I was hopping that pirates of the spanish main might spur gw to reprint this game, but to no avail... I have heard for years that they were toying with redoing it, but all we have gotten is crappy boat rules for fantasy. Long live the red seas of man o war and those proud individuals that once sailed them!!!! :cries:

The rules can be downloaded as pdfs from here : link removed

phusg
09-09-2005, 10:44
I play man o war with out any card counters and templates as its fairly easy to create a fleet sheet whete you can record all teh ships details and damage etc, if anyone wants to have a look its on a word document.

Hi Cherrystone,

You still around? I wouldn't mind having a look at that word document myself. Could you mail it to me? Thanks, Pete

Brimstone
09-09-2005, 16:18
Phusg please do not post links to GW copyrighted material. It may be OOP but it still belongs to GW.

If GW made it available as a download that would be fine to link to that but they haven't so I've removed your link.

Wonderdog
09-09-2005, 22:25
The reason Fanatic has been effectively closed down is that as mentioned profits where not as predicted.

Profits where not as predicted not due to a lack of quality in the product, but due to the BLOODY AWFUL MARKETING of said specialist games products. Zero store exposure/promotion.

Independants where only offerred the very first batch of releases and couldnt get anything after this, as GW distribution claimed they couldnt stock them for dispatch in any sort of numbers. Shortly after, GW stores stopped stocking new releases, and forced it to mail order only.

Lets face it, the SG stuff is nice, but simply not worth the price, especially when you have to mail order the damn stuff.

Hence, the demise of one of the most positive moves in GW's recent history.

#Wonderdog

phusg
12-09-2005, 08:26
Phusg please do not post links to GW copyrighted material. It may be OOP but it still belongs to GW.

If GW made it available as a download that would be fine to link to that but they haven't so I've removed your link.

Hi Brimstone, Sorry about that, I didn't think it would be a problem. Would it be ok to post the link to the main page of the site, as they have a lot more than just the copyrighted materials on there? Pete

Wisdom
13-09-2005, 15:02
Please, could somebody PM me the link?

Orcdom
13-09-2005, 23:20
do a search for a site "system17" and it has plenty of info for different games, you just have to look.
Steve

KTG
14-09-2005, 05:22
System17 is my site. How ironic! Anyway, I've got a ton of Man O' War info up and I am sorry if much of the site is incomplete, but I've got a life and System17 is in the back seat. I am always taking submissions though, so if anyone wants to contribute something, whether it be a Battle Report, pics of painted minis, strategies, or whatever, feel free to let me know.

I am planning on revising all the gaming and japanimation sections in the upcoming weeks to scale a lot of what is there back, but I am sure you'll find it all interesting.

Anyway, Man O' War is probably one of the best games ever made, GW or non-GW. Followed up by Warhammer Quest. Those two sitting on my game shelf give me the goose bumps. I can't think of any other games that have withstood the test of time better than those. For those who have never played Man O' War and are wondering if a used box set is worth the price on Ebay: yes, every cent. You wont get a game where you can do so much or have as much fun with a fleet of ten or so minis.

See ya.

pnweerar
14-09-2005, 12:24
Small world. I just book marked your site :) .

Grimshawl
14-09-2005, 17:08
I remember when it was pretty big in my area when I was first getting into GW games, I thought it was very cool the few times I borrowed a fleet to play it.

Wisdom
14-09-2005, 18:22
Cheers for makin the site mate! Had the boxed game but now, thanks to thee, I've got sea of blood and plague fleet. Think its fair to say you're my favourite person in the world right now

AcolyteLouxman
18-09-2005, 10:08
Your site rocks KTG!

i understand bout the time thing... but still eagrely awaiting any further developements to the man'o'war section!

AL

Hashut's Li'l Helper
18-09-2005, 23:25
Has anyone got any ideas about a linked MOW/warmaster game? A friend and I tried it this weekend but came up with a bunch of problems. I'd love to get some other views on this. PM me if youve done it :D