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kortholaxthedamned
04-01-2007, 16:49
Hi there. At our local gaming club (soon to be started) we're going to run a skirmish game set in the not-too-distant future, using a modified Necromunda ruleset. I imagine Answer_is_42 will post something similar to this at some point, but oh well. i just wanted to know what people thought of the weapons rules

Close combat
Massive Axe, Sword or Club- Same as regular rules
Clubs, mauls and bludgeons-same
chains and flails-same
Chainsaw-as chainsword, two handed with -1M
swords and knives-same

Pistols
High quality Autopistol- as autopistol, when purchasing roll a d6, on a 6 the gang has purchased an exceptionally high quality autopistol and the ammo roll is increased to 3+.

Poor quality autopistol-as autopistol except long range of 8-14 and ammo roll of 5+, when purchasing roll a d6, on a 1 the gang has purchased an exceptionally low quality autopistol, the ammo roll is reduced to 6+

High quality handgun- as stubgun, same special rule as high quality autopistol, can take armour piercing rounds (dum-dum bullets)

poor quality handgun- as stubgun, same special rule as poor quality autopistol, can't take armour piercing, long range changed to 8-14, ammo roll of 5+

Basic Weapons
High quality Automatic weapon- as autogun, same special rule as high quality autopistol

poor quality automatic weapon- as autogun, same special rule as poor quality autopistol

Shotgun- as Shotgun, only scatter and solid rounds available

SMG- new weapon, Short range 0-6
long range 6-12
to hit short +2
to hit long -2
Strengh 3
damage 1
save mod -
ammo roll 4+
special 1 sus. fire dice

Special Weaponry
Flamethrower- as flamer
Grenade Launcher- as Grenade Launcher
Sniper rifle- as Needle Rifle except S4, no toxin injury table

Heavy Weapons
LMG- as Heavy Stubber
HMG-as Heavy Bolter
Rocket Launcher-as Missile Launcher

Grenades
Frag-as Frag
Anti-Tank- as Krak
Gas grenades-as gas grenades, all types available
Flash-bang grenades-as photon flash flare
smoke grenades
Molotov Cocktails- small blast, S4, chance of being set on fire
Thermite grenade- Very Rare, as melta bombs

armour

all gangs- Flak
special forces teams- Flak or Full Flak armour (as mesh)

Gunsights
all except mono-sight

Bionics
Hell no.

Misc.
Unnamed painkilling Narcotic- as bio-booster
Rappel cable- as clip harness
concealed blade
Grapnel
Night Vision goggles- as infra-red goggles
Medi-pack
Crafted weapon- as one in a million weapon
Gas-mask- as respirator
Silencer
Weapon reloads

if something isn't mentioned, its not in our game.


post your thoughts. these are not all my idea, i don't take credit for them, i did help make them, but it wasn't just me. Nurgle__boy and Answer_is_42 contributed too.

So. what think?

Catferret
04-01-2007, 17:02
Seems fine except the SMG having 2 Sustained Fire. They don't tend to have that kind of rate really. I could believe 1 SF though but that seems to be covered by your Burst rules. Ditch the SMG SF and use the generic Burst rule instead. I would also be ok with it having a 4+ Ammo Roll instead of 5+.

Sniper Rifle could use Nomad Longrifle rules available on Specialist Games Site.

kortholaxthedamned
04-01-2007, 17:07
i've never read those Nomad rules, i'll have a look see. also, the SMG was included for the ganger to get close, the unload a storm of fire. 2 sustained fire dice is only a maximum of 6 shots, which represents probably twice that being fired, so its not that unrealistic surely? i do see the point in the ammo roll thing though, duly changed.

Catferret
04-01-2007, 17:14
i've never read those Nomad rules, i'll have a look see. also, the SMG was included for the ganger to get close, the unload a storm of fire. 2 sustained fire dice is only a maximum of 6 shots, which represents probably twice that being fired, so its not that unrealistic surely? i do see the point in the ammo roll thing though, duly changed.

I guess I was mainly cosidering the type of people who would use them more than anything. A 3 round burst is pretty accurate but almost all SMGs have an automatic setting. Give them a -1 to hit if they use it though!

kortholaxthedamned
04-01-2007, 17:16
hmm, but i did want there to be some advantage to firing at close range, and there's already a penalty for long range. i'll change the penalty to -2. that should balance it out

Catferret
04-01-2007, 17:19
hmm, but i did want there to be some advantage to firing at close range, and there's already a penalty for long range. i'll change the penalty to -2. that should balance it out

+2 to hit at short seemed a good advantage already!

kortholaxthedamned
04-01-2007, 17:20
Oh, i thought you meant make it -1 at close range instead of +2

Lord Humongous
04-01-2007, 18:35
It's pretty commonly accepted in Necomunda circles that giving basic weapons and pistols an autofire die (or dice) is a Bad Idea for many reasons.

1) weapon accuracy and ammo rolls takes into account the fact that multiple shots are being fired
2) HtH combat is already hard enough to make tactical use of, multiple autofire weapons per gang just makes it totaly irrelevant
3) Shooting skills generally work with basic weapons, and not with heavy or special weapons. The reason is, basic weapons DON'T get autofire.

Hoenstly, dropping the stuff about auto-fire dice would make for a decent rule set.

As for the submachine gun, just make it a special weapon; then its OK that its got autofire dice.
Also, real life SMGs tend to have slightly longer effective ranges than pistols. But longer range plus move-or-fire plus autofire would make for a very nasty weapon...
How about the SMG can only use its sustained fire dice if the user does not move? Then you could boost the range (and range mods) to equal that of pistols, or maybe even 10 +2 / 20 +0.

kortholaxthedamned
04-01-2007, 19:29
Right, removed the autofire rule, and i took the SMG down to 1 sus. fire dice. Answer_is_42 informs me that we're having a few changes to the heavy weapons, so hold fast. i feel that making the SMG a special weapon would be a bit too restrictive, however, it maybe a little more expensive, i'm not sure yet.

Lord Humongous
04-01-2007, 19:46
How expensive is the SMG? And the other guns, for that matter?

Also, are you planning to run an ongoing campaign, or one-shot games? Any changes to the gang construction / house weapon / campaign system rules?

Another thing to consider is that in the normal game, stubguns are wretchedly bad. The autopistol works much, much better (due to its better accuracy) and costs very little more.
Even if you drop the cost of the stub gun, its hardly worth wasting the time shooting it- you are better off hiding.

That being the case, I'd boost you "normal pistol" a bit, given that its such a common weapon in present day combat. In Necromunda its basically a "flavor" weapon, but in a contemporary setting, they should be a valid weapon choice, to reflect contemporary arms choices. A +1 at short range and no penalty at long range would make it worth taking, I expect. You could explain the difference by saying its such a common weapon in contemporary settings that people train extra frequently with it (true enough among most non-military forces).

kortholaxthedamned
04-01-2007, 19:56
One big change we were going to include was going to be vehicles. pick-up trucks, vans, all terrain vehicles, using the Gorkamorka vehicle rules adapted slightly (easier to damage). We've already adapted the Territories to be modern, and we figured thats about all we need to change. Oh, and duly noted with the handgun thing. i shall discuss it with the others.

Mr Zephy
07-01-2007, 17:08
Sounds interesting, what models are you going to use?

kortholaxthedamned
07-01-2007, 19:26
A mishmash of miniatures. Most people in the campaign are using models from Foundy's Street Violence range (http://www.wargamesfoundry.com/collections/SV/index.asp)
while i myself am using the Ape gang box set from Mongoose games (http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/home/detail.php?qsID=1017&qsSeries=)
as well as a few models from Eureka miniatures Boiler suited apes set, more specifically, the ape with M60, ape with flamethrowe and gibbons with MAC10's
(http://www.fighting15sshop.co.uk/index.asp?function=DISPLAYCAT&catid=151)

As i'm sure you've noticed, despite being set in a 'realistic' future, i'm still the using the most abstract gang.