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View Full Version : Shadow Warriors Mordheim list, need help!



Jhayden
22-01-2007, 22:56
I havn't played Mordheim in a few years but I am thinking of getting back into it. Tell me what you think!

Shadow Master 70
Elf Bow 35
Ithilmar Sword 20
Sword 10
Helmet 10
Dagger
Total 145

Shadow Walkerx2 90
longbow x2 30
Sword x4 40
Dagger
Total 160

Shadow Warriors x3 105
longbow x3 45
Spear x3 30
Shield x3 15
Total 195

Total 500

TKitch
22-01-2007, 23:20
Skip the Ithilmar Sword entirely. They're not worth the money when you've got the highest init in the game.

Second: Get the rest of your heroes. You'll want them for exploration.

For a few crowns, go sword & free dagger initially, it'll give you more $ To play with elsewhere.

Jhayden
22-01-2007, 23:44
Shadow Master 70
Elf Bow 35
Sword 10
Helmet 10
Dagger
Total 135

Shadow Walkerx2 90
longbow x2 30
Sword x2 20
Dagger x2
Total 140

Shadow Warriors x3 105
longbow x3 45
Sword x3 30
Total 180

Total 455 how's that? This way when I start to save up more crowns i'll be able to afford a couple more elf bows, or perhaps even a few more warriors.

I'll post the skills in a bit.

Intrepid Adventurer
23-01-2007, 10:14
What about a Shadow Weaver? I always use him, it's another hero if nothing else, and I think his spells are pretty cool anyway.

Jhayden
23-01-2007, 18:05
I was thinking of bringing in a Shadow Weaver for his nifty spells, but I want to try and keep the guerilla type tactics with my army. I'll look into it however.

Gensuke626
08-02-2007, 02:29
I dunno if I'm too late to comment, but the Shadow Weaver works wonders for a guerilla shadow warrior band, especially if you roll up that spell that makes you hidden as soon as you cast it. Run then hide or worse yet, Shoot then hide, all while in plain sight?

That's why I think Shadow Warriors are broken.

Rabid Bunny 666
11-02-2007, 22:22
edit: wrong Thread :(

They do seem to be insanely good at shooting, although i wouldn't got for the Shadow Weaver, as the one in the game i played today went invisible, wandered off, and did nothing.

Heroes with Quickshot are insane, they mow down everything.

Kiro
15-02-2007, 13:07
Been out of the game for a long time, but the last I enquired around these parts...weren't shadow warriors ruled unofficial, or banned? :confused:

TKitch
15-02-2007, 13:52
Ruled as no longer official is all.

Can still use them.


And they are a PERFECTLY balanced warband, as long as the guy playing them doesn't go for elven artillery. I have played them several times and always done well, but I've never had a complaint about their ability. (Other than the fact it was me using them. I tend to win, regardless of who I play!)

Kiro
15-02-2007, 14:58
Eh?
Why exactly were they ruled unofficial? :confused: :wtf:

jp22102000
15-02-2007, 16:39
i think it was that shadow warriors wouldn't really be in mordheim

Kiro
15-02-2007, 17:16
That just sounds so absurd;

"Good stuff guys, let's bring them out..."

...

"Actually that was a bad idea, make them unofficial"

Lord 0
15-02-2007, 19:25
I think it was the whole unassailable-turrets-of-doom thing that got people. That and the insta-stun spell of death. Oh, and the 'I can get every skill-set' thing too. By this point the 'I have a built-in auspex' thing was just a minor niggle compared to the rest of the stuff.

Kiro
15-02-2007, 20:06
Lol...so instead of doing an official tweak they just...binned them? :wtf:

Dyrnwyn
15-02-2007, 21:27
IIRC, they did tweak them. And tweaked them again. And then they realized that tweaks weren't enough and made them unofficial so the fans could work it out.

TKitch
15-02-2007, 22:44
Guys! Come on!

Shadow warriors got a single minor tweak. And then they got binned.

When the annual was released the "stun spell" was made D6+1 instead of 2D6. Then at the RR, they got nuked.


1) They do NOT have access to every list. They don't get strength without a skill. Human Mercs, DO get every list.

2) What got them binned was the "Elven Artillery" model of gameplay. Stand back in a tall building(s) and shoot. a lot. No matter how bad your dice, eventually you WILL drop enemies.



When played like they should be. (Assassins. Shoot if you can, but move in for the kill) THEY ARE PERFECTLY BALANCED.



I play them, and nobody objects. My 5 starting heroes:

Shadow Master: Shooting Expert. Pump his shooting skills, and give him an elven longbow.
SHadow Weaver: Magicalness and Combat. He can make a half decent combatant, with a couple increases and skills. (Warrior Wizard + Ithilmar, baby!)
1x Shadow Walker: Shooting. He gets quickshot and all the tweaks.
2x Shadow Walker: Combat. Powerful Build, and combat skills. They're good in fighting, honestly.


The issue people had was 4 or 5 heroes with "Weapons Training" and crossbows and Longbows on BS5 or 6. S3 and S4 shooting EVERY TURN is retarded.

Don't be a ******* cheesy git and they're fine to play as.


However, they can be nerfed VERY easily:

1) Shadow Walkers: 0-2 (instead of 0-3). They can still get 2 more heroes thru LGT.

2) remove "Hide in shadows spell" or whatever its called.

3) Shadow Warriors: 0-4 (or 0-5) Make them take some novices. And make them 40GC.

4) Powerful Build: When this skill is taken, it nukes their access to the shooting list. They either lose all the shooting skills (tough luck!) or they can replace them with legal skills.


Warband: Balanced. It's not hard, you jsut need to make them more playable and less abusable.

Lord 0
16-02-2007, 12:58
Guys! Come on!
1) They do NOT have access to every list. They don't get strength without a skill. Human Mercs, DO get every list.

Yes, that is my point. They take the skill and then they can get strength skills. That gives them access to it.

Also, in all the campaigns I played in where the elves turned up, their high leadership allowed them to get Alchemist Notebooks in fairly short order. That makes four heroes with access to all skills as opposed to the human warbands that only ever have one. That being said, I must admit that this was in the days before they were limited to two with the Strong Build skill.

Oh, and Infiltrate is a *very* powerful ability, especially for a warband that can shoot without breaking 'Hidden'. Heck, there are one or two scenarios that can be won in the setup phase with infiltrate if your opponent is not careful (Breakthrough is one, I don't remember the rest).

Jhayden
21-02-2007, 06:23
Well my Shadow Warriors list has gotten pretty powerful after around 7 games. Here goes what I have now:

HEROES--

Shadow Master Excellion Entreri
35 Experience total
Advancements--
+1 Ballistic Skill, +1 Initiative
Quick Shot

Elf Bow; Hunting Arrows
Sword x2
Helmet

Shadow Walker Biel'Tan
28 Experience
Advancements--
+1 Ballistic Skill; +1 Attack
Infiltration; Quick Shot; Trick Shot

Long Bow
Sword/Dagger

Shadow Walker Iyan'Den
25 Experience
Advancements--
+1 Ballistic Skill
Infiltration; Quick Shot; Trick Shot

Long Bow
Sword/Dagger

Shadow Walker Tir'Val
23 Experience
Advancements--
+1 Strength
Quick Shot; Trick Shot

Long Bow
Sword/Dagger

Shadow Warrior Ulth'We (You've got Talent!)
Advancements--
+1 Ballistic Skill; +1 Attack; +1 Weapon Skill

Long Bow
Dagger/Dagger

HENCHMEN--

The Shadow Company (5 Shadow Warriors)
9 Experience
Advancements--
+1 ballistic Skill; +1 Weapon Skill; +1 Attack

Long Bow(all)
Dagger/Dagger(3)
Spear/Sword(2)

RATING: 170
RECORD: 6 in 7

Some cheesy bum killed my Shadow Weaver today, and she never came back. :(
Anyway, this is how the list is going so far. It's coming out pretty well! I have been rolling like crazy on my advancements and I always have someone to verify it for me, so all's good in the hood.

Catferret
21-02-2007, 06:43
That's a lot of xp on the Henchmen! Only 7 games? Which ones have you been playing? There aren't many that give bonus xp to Henchmen.

Spartan-001: Master Chief
21-02-2007, 13:20
I agree with Catferret, 7 games and so much xp? my shadow warrior henchmen only had 2 advancements after seven games (half of them died aswell). Still if you got that many xp well done. Its helps if you buy your heros hunting arrows ( it works trust me ) and quickshot they will mow down everything.

Jhayden
21-02-2007, 15:39
Unfortunetly my rare item rolls have been AWFUL (with the exception of the elfbow which was a once in a lifetime roll of a double 6).

We played Wyrdstone hunt a bunch of times (all except 2 actually) and every time you hold onto a piece of wyrd stone you gain an experience I believe. That's how they managed to get so much XP. So that's 1 per game and 2 from holding onto Wyrdstone.

Spartan-001: Master Chief
21-02-2007, 16:09
i did'nt no you gain xp from holding wyrdstones to be honest. If so i should of had alot more xp...hmmm...interesting.

TKitch
22-02-2007, 06:15
A Henchman group or hero earns 1XP for each shard of stone they're carrying at the end of the fight.

In a single fight I let one henchman sprint aorund like mad and collect 5 shards, and then hid.

Cheesy? Yeah. 2 advancements in a single fight from 6XP? HELLS YES!

Lord 0
22-02-2007, 10:51
That is not cheesy, that is perfectly legitimate experience management.

Spartan-001: Master Chief
22-02-2007, 23:24
is that the wyrdstone senario? or in a basic game? i need the little secrets of mordhiem :D ( if any)

TKitch
23-02-2007, 00:59
Wyrdstone hunt (or something)

If you're playing against slow warbands (undead or dwarfs) or multiple *grins* you can get a LOT of XP.

Jhayden
23-02-2007, 03:43
That is not cheesy, that is perfectly legitimate experience management.

You wanna hear a REALLY cheesy tactic (although completely legit)?

I forgot which scenario it is but basically each team gets X amount of Wyrdstone shards and then every time you kill a hero you get one of their shards. Basically my opponent got 3 pieces and I got 1. He kept ALL of his heroes on one side of the board and used his other, weaker henchmen to create a wall of shooting not even my shadow warriors could get past. All he had to do was kill one of my heroes and then he voluntarily routed with all of the warpstone (and he killed 5 people in the process...).

I had just enough to buy back some guys and regear them, now I gotta get a new Shadow Weaver though :(

Lord 0
23-02-2007, 18:53
That is not cheesy either, it is just sensible. What was he supposed to do? Walk up to you with the warpstone and hand it over? :p.

Jhayden
24-02-2007, 16:44
That is not cheesy either, it is just sensible. What was he supposed to do? Walk up to you with the warpstone and hand it over? :p.

It's cheesy in that there is no way to beat him... every turn was "K, I hide", "K, I hide", "K, I hide" until eventually I just quit.

TKitch
24-02-2007, 17:45
don't let him after your heroes.

Or, if he wants to be a lazy ass git, and do that. Do the same thing.

After 3 turns or so of nothing, he'd probably agree to some kind of fight.

Dyrnwyn
24-02-2007, 18:24
It's cheesy in that there is no way to beat him... every turn was "K, I hide", "K, I hide", "K, I hide" until eventually I just quit.

It doesn't really fit with the way your warband is set up, but you could have marched your henchmen up until you could see him, after all, you reveal hidden models at double your Init. Hide and seek is annoying, but there are ways around it. Pirates can buy Spyglasses, which reveal hidden models on a 4+. Elves can spot Hidden at double thier Initiative. All you really need is one suicide model to run around revealing hidden enemies for your shooters.

Lord 0
26-02-2007, 11:32
Lanterns are both cheap and common too.

If you have set your table up properly (ie. sufficient terrain) you can do the old move-then-hide up to him under cover until you can charge him, you don't need to suicide at all. Otherwise, setting up a shooting range and then charging in a spotter that Dyrnwyn suggested is perfectly viable.

Oh, and playing with Random Bad-Thing can help too. Little flushes someone out of their hidey-hole than a gigantic spider or a swarm of rabid dogs or something.