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boogle
29-01-2007, 17:52
having decided to do an Empire army again, i got myself the Character set, however i'm not sure what to do:

A) have my captain on foot with the Griffon Banner in a large unit of State Troops, downside is 4+ Save

B) have him mounted in a unit of 8 knights with another character, once again with the Griffon Banner (US 20, +4 Combat Res before starting, 1+ Save, plus Preceptor and other Character to accept Challenges if necessary), downside is massive points sink in 1 unit

may have to buy another set and do both to see how it works, but what are peoples opinions on this?

thanks

Von Wibble
29-01-2007, 18:08
Mounted with Griffon banner is pointless in a unit of knights - just get teh war banner which does the same job for 30 less points even if your unit takes casualties.

Mounted with Griffon banner in an infantry unit otoh gives you best of both worlds - the full cr bonus and the 2+ save.

boogle
29-01-2007, 18:34
sorry 2+ save, can he not be targetted freely by missile fire though as he is of a different size to the unit of infantry?

TheWarSmith
29-01-2007, 18:36
I think the new rules for mixing model sizes says he can't be picked out as long as there are 5 rank/file members.

I've been thinking of getting each of the "general" kits and having a collection.

Mephistofeles
29-01-2007, 19:27
He can only be picked out if there are less than 5 other models left in the unit, in the new rules :)

So I say Griffon Banner and mounted in a big state unit.

boogle
29-01-2007, 20:21
Nice, might just do that, plus he takes up 2 spaces too, so 18 man state troop unit with full command gives a nice +6 rank bonus, plus 2+ for the 2 Standards, with detachments, another +1 for a flank charge and outnumbering, 10+ sounds ok with some kills too would take some shifting

Mephistofeles
29-01-2007, 21:18
Oh, take a unit of 25-30 with him, or else your opponent just needs to shot one of them to take you down to 4 in rank bonus, and that's a wasted Griffon Banner!

Take 30, that's my point of view.

Lieutenant Frederic Henry
30-01-2007, 03:12
Mepistofeles (as always) is entirely correct. Griffon banner requires many ablative wounds to be effective. That's why you put it in with a unit of dirt cheap halberdiers.

I knew a guy who took a BSB Captasus. He swore by the crazy thing. Said he could bring the extra leadership to bear wherever it was needed on the battlefield. Fella handed my tail to me one night, too. It was a refreshing take on a rather stale character (two, really. BSB and Captasus).
Cheers.

chivalrous
30-01-2007, 03:24
Mepistofeles (as always) is entirely correct. Griffon banner requires many ablative wounds to be effective. That's why you put it in with a unit of dirt cheap halberdiers.

I knew a guy who took a BSB Captasus. He swore by the crazy thing. Said he could bring the extra leadership to bear wherever it was needed on the battlefield. Fella handed my tail to me one night, too. It was a refreshing take on a rather stale character (two, really. BSB and Captasus).
Cheers.

Captasus!?!

Cacodemon
30-01-2007, 05:08
Captasus!?!

Which is a common name for a Captain mounted on a Pegasus.

Also remember that BSB cannot ride a Pegasus.

Bahd Mufu
30-01-2007, 05:36
He can only be picked out by template weapons otherwise allocate hits evenly.

Bahd Mufu
30-01-2007, 05:52
Consider what other units are in your army. The banner of Sigismund could render the whole unit virtually unbreakable. This is valuable if your opponent outmanouvers you all the time. Undead are great at hitting flanks because they have magic moves. In this case the counter attack needs to be prepared in advance. You can put the Banner of Sigismund in a large unit of Hangunners. People expect units of hangunners to roll over and die very easily so they will get a nasty surprise when they don't. Then you can run some knights down the flank and send them packing. The sneaky thing about a unit of hangunners is that you can deploy them in a long line and put the bsb on an edge where he can't be called into challenges and targetted with attacks. You can also move him freely within the unit to avoid oncoming chargers. This sort of strategy requires much patience and nerves of steel but goes off like a frog in a sock.

Mephistofeles
30-01-2007, 15:29
Are you sure that he cannot be challenged? I though you could always be challenged, and as long as you were in the front rank you had to accept it with one character or hide?

I am very sure this is the case, but I don't have the book with me, so if I'm wrong, please correct me.

Mephistofeles
30-01-2007, 15:31
Mepistofeles (as always) is entirely correct. Griffon banner requires many ablative wounds to be effective. That's why you put it in with a unit of dirt cheap halberdiers.

I knew a guy who took a BSB Captasus. He swore by the crazy thing. Said he could bring the extra leadership to bear wherever it was needed on the battlefield. Fella handed my tail to me one night, too. It was a refreshing take on a rather stale character (two, really. BSB and Captasus).
Cheers.

Why thank you :P

Also, I think that swordsmen are the best here, since they minimize casaulties. Since they will have 10 static combat resolution (6 ranks, outnumbering, flanking and banner) and negating 3 of your opponents (I'm counting on the detachment working here, if not, you will have 9 static combat resolution), you just need to not die, and you will win by horrendous margins even if you do not cause a single kill.

The bsb is actually an ok killing character too.