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View Full Version : Shooty army - which one to choose?



Hannibal
17-07-2005, 19:50
Hello all,

Iīm thinking about starting a shooty force in addition to my more cc oriented ones. hich one would you recommend and why?

Thanks,

Hannibal

Ordo Hereticus
17-07-2005, 19:55
Skaven Skryre

Reason: Read the skaven codex and all their shooty abilities and you will understad why :)

Alternative: Empire gunline

Kjell
17-07-2005, 20:26
Alright, list of possible shooty armies:


Skaven: Do employ moderation. Unless you're a really, really splendidly nice chap to your fellow gamers the Shooty Army of Doom could potentially cause a few grumbles.

Empire: Can be super-shooty, but I've never seen anyone dislike it as strongly as the SAD.

Dwarfs: I suppose they're like the Empire, only more elite. They're tougher, got better guns and they won't keel over as soon as a goblin comes over and says hi.

Dark Elves: Never, ever played them, but for some reason I love warriors with shields and repeater crossbows. I just like the idea. Nifty warmachine, too.

High Elves: Archers? Naah... Not that hot. Better than human archers, though, but I think the strength would lie more in their warmachines. Good mages, even though they're not traditionally shooty.

Wood Elves: Not a clue. I know nothing about them, really. Awesome archer models, however. Best elven stuff ever, in my opinion!

Dogs of War: Yep, can be shooty. Can be madly shooty, too. Pikemen are ace defensive troops as well.

Tomb Kings: Maybe not the best, but their catapult can be rather devastating. Their bow-armed skeletons are not bad either. Magic does a lot to improve everyone.

I think that was a short, somewhat uneducated low-down on the majorly shooty armies. Please correct me where I'm wrong. :)

Sgt John Keel
17-07-2005, 20:51
Well, most armies can be shooty, except Chaos and Vampire Counts.

An interesting twist could be a Bretonnia Peasant Army with two Trebuchet, but if you're gunning for effectiveness I'd say either Dark Elves, Dwarves or Empire. I have never tried the SAD though.

Goblin armies can include a lot of warmachines too, like eight Bolt Throwers and two Doom Divers.

/Adrian

Ordo Hereticus
17-07-2005, 21:00
I use skaven SAD (selling them soon on ebay if anyone is interested) and combined with their immense magical power, they are completely devestating.

And as said before, have a smile on your face and be friendly to your opponent then most people wont get too angry, though if you act like a totall ******* then people will get annoyed and complain :/

Elves can be fun, i've seen a few shooty/magical high elf amies, and they do kick butt, though not quite as nasty as skaven.

IkuTurso
17-07-2005, 21:30
empire. just empire.

leeoaks
17-07-2005, 22:29
why not go for a dark elf list with alot of d riders and shades and bolt throwers. will look nice to

rune
18-07-2005, 06:28
my dark elf army isnt quite a shooty army of death, it only has a max 78 rxbow shots a turn (39 rxbows) and 2 RBTs in a 2000pt game. The rxbows are okay, could be more, but more importantly there could be 3 or 4 RBTs.. personally id bring 3 as to not over-do it. ;) hehe

rune
18-07-2005, 06:31
So needless to say you could have well over 100 shots a turn if you really wanted to.

you get:

1)core selection rxbow warriors with shields and dark riders with rxbows
2)scouting shades with rxbows, chariots that can carry 2 guys with rxbows or a character with the magic rxbow 'lifetaker'
3)two reaper bolt throwers for 1 rare slot

everyone has BS4. have fun?

PelsBoble
18-07-2005, 07:18
Well even if they have BS 4 they get the penalty for multiple shots. Combined with long range this often makes it hard to hit even with BS 4 ;)

For a shooty force i would go for dwarfs. As they have alot of fluff concerning their warmachines, and they have damn good soilders to take charges. They have cheap bolt throwers and can take runes on warmachines to make them the best you get.

Hannibal
18-07-2005, 08:19
Thanks for all the help so far!

Well, Iīm currently playing a balanced HE army which doesnīt have much shooting. I once tried to get a shooty/magic list with them, but I couldnīt find the right one. We normally play 1250 pts battles here and in that case the HE seem not to be the strangest in long range fire.

Against DE I have to say that 3 of my friends actually play DE and I donīt want to play them too.

Skaven are nice, IMO they have the best fluff around, but painting all that little beasties isnīt my work of favour.

One thing I would really like to have is a stoner or two. I love that template weapons. Therefor I think it comes down to
Dwarfes, Khemri or Bretonnians.

Any deeper suggestions to one of these armies?

Hannibal

Ordo Hereticus
18-07-2005, 10:47
A friend of mine runs a very nasty shooty khemri army, a few units of 10 bowmen, 2 units of light horsemen, some chariots (bowmen inside them of course) screaming skull catapult for every 1000 we play (he loves them) then he pounds up on liche priests, and his general in chaiot :/

Lots of magic to make the shooting x2 as bad, and template weapons which make you flee! very annoying, and occasionally a casket of souls to back up the fire line.

Dwarfs are nasty, especially those thunderers with shields, heavy army and hand weapons along with their guns. Never found Dwarf shooting as bad as empire/skaven though, and in combat they arn't all that good either.

Empire would be one of the best shooty army choices i would say.

Brets can be a little shooty, but nothing too devestating, though when backed up by lance formations at either side, charging in doesn't seem like such a good option lol.

Crazy Harborc
18-07-2005, 17:38
IF most of your opponents are pushing T4 troops, you will need S4 plus shooting to get wounds on those higher toughness troops. Empire and or Dwarves. By the by, with either army I prefer more crossbows than black powder shooting. That 30 inch range gives a good chance of an extra round of shooting before HtH contact occurs.

If most opponents are pushing T3 troops go for an army of elves. The elve's higher BS means more potential hits. That should mean a higher number of hits converting.

KillbotFactory
18-07-2005, 17:49
I can't belive nobody has mentioned one of the deadliest shooting armies out there. Lizardmen have the deadliest combined magic/shooting combination possible. This is assuming you want some magic to complement shooting. If you dont want magic then you should ditch all options except empire/dwarfs/dow.

The reason Lizardmen shooting is so deadly is because of thier access to core skirsmished shooters. Blowpipes is icing on the caking, giving you up to 20 posion shots from a 60 point unit, a pretty good bargain. Take a bunch of skinks, a handful of salamanders, and Slann and just dance around your opponent as he not only get shot to pieces but fails to engage anything.

Naghaz
18-07-2005, 22:18
I can't belive nobody has mentioned one of the deadliest shooting armies out there. Lizardmen have the deadliest combined magic/shooting combination possible. This is assuming you want some magic to complement shooting. If you dont want magic then you should ditch all options except empire/dwarfs/dow.

The reason Lizardmen shooting is so deadly is because of thier access to core skirsmished shooters. Blowpipes is icing on the caking, giving you up to 20 posion shots from a 60 point unit, a pretty good bargain. Take a bunch of skinks, a handful of salamanders, and Slann and just dance around your opponent as he not only get shot to pieces but fails to engage anything.



So true, I hate the ranged lizard army as much (if not more) than the SAD army actually. It's just brutal.

Falcon
19-07-2005, 06:27
Don't go for woodelves They are not shooty any more. ;-)

sqri
19-07-2005, 07:41
Dwarfs - they are great. Thunderers and Crossbows in core. Deadly machines with runes. If anybody survive shooting they are good in hth too (WS4, T4). But the best shooty army is the Empire. :) Empire's gunners and shooters are't as expensive as Dwarves. Magic. Machines. And the Hellblaster... ;)

Hannibal
19-07-2005, 10:19
Yes, it seems to me that Empire has the best shooting army overall. By this I mean that Empire gives you a lot of tactcally flexibility without loosing much in shooting.

Actually Iīm leaning towards a flexible, shooting based list and that could be done with my HE, too. So I have to try it first. What HE lacks in shooting compared to Dwarfs or Empire, they gain in movement and magic. But magic really isnīt that what I want to go for.

Is noone out there who can report about his shooty army?

Hannibal

Yanos
19-07-2005, 12:23
I shall reinforce your disinclination for the Dark Elf shooty army by saying that mine doesn't do me that many favours. Apart from other Elf armies, most other opponents can soak low-accuracy S3 shots with either numbers or armour. Only the Reaper Bolt Throwers do the damage their reputation suggests, and I'm too resaonable a chap to have more than 2 in my 2000pt army :D !

For my 2 cents (or would it be pennies here in Blighty?), I'd go with the Dwarfs. Beastly handguns, access to crossbows, pistols and Long Drong's Slayers, and S7 (oh yes) Bolt Throwers. Juggernaut Chariots of Khorne? Not with an Engineer letting you re-roll to hit!! 4+ re-roll, followed by 2+, and it be gone, along with any other chariot that ain't got a Ward save! Don't get me started, my Cold One Chariots and War Hydra could be used to serve cheese'n'pineapple at parties!!

Plus you get the stone-throwers you wanted, as well as various other groovy things (Flame Cannon, Gyrocopter). I see no bad here :) .


Edit: And did I mention your missile units can take on most things sent to deal with 'em? Light Cavalry, flyers, they'll even bounce off your War Machine crews if you get lucky!!

Hannibal
19-07-2005, 13:23
Yes, I have to agree with you that Dwarfs are a really good shooty list. But on the other hand there are very few people playing Dwarfs in a shooty way. Most lists Iīve seen tend to have more warrior blocks than shooting. The non existing magic is also a nice part of Dwarfs, because I use to play with magic in my other games and a bit of variety never hurts.

There is a theory around that says you have to be superior in one and competitive in 1-2 of the 4 phases (movement, magic, shooting, melee) to be succesfull. Unfortunately Dwarfs are on the lowest level in 2 of them, magic and movement, so you have to find a way to be good at shooting AND melee to be successful IMO. One way to reach that aim could be that large unit of thunderers that is reformed before the charge hits you. And I think that a small unit of miners and a gyro would give some nice flexibility to a static list.

Hannibal

Yanos
19-07-2005, 14:09
True enough. Bear in mind though that superiority/competetiveness doesn't always mean exercising power. I'll admit the Dwarfs are largely screwed in the Movement phase no matter how you look at it (!), but they can load up on the anti-magic like no-one else really. Spell-eaters, Spell-breakers, Rune of Valaya, Rune of Balance, you name it, they got it! I'm starting to convince myself here :D !

Just a matter of anchoring those flanks really.

Equally it ain't hard to make Dwarf units solid in melee, be they normal Warriors or some other unit.