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View Full Version : WIP - Heads or Tails ( building two armies for the price of one )



toxic_wisdom
03-02-2007, 03:32
Okay, need to come back to this a little later. For the time being though I wanted to get this up and running.

The idea is to use only one set of minis and vehicles, but build two different armies - Space Marines and Chaos Space Marines.

I'm already working on the background for both armies, and I already know the look I want - at least for troops and transports...

-- Chaos Space Marines with Black Templar upgrades
-- Chaos Space Marines Rhino with Black Templar upgrades

-- Color scheme is red, tan, and gold - with hints of green.

The tricky part of course is determining the mirrored lists. I want a Librarian to cross over to a Sorcerer Lord, and a Commander to cross over to a Lieutenant. Not interested in Fast Attack outside of a few bikes perhaps, rather more focus on Troops and Heavy Support. Elite choices can be hit or miss since I'm only looking to build in the range of 1500 to 1750.

Any thoughts or suggestions would help. Keep in mind that a little bit of counts as might be needed - ie Assault Marines could cross over to Possesed with Daemonic Flight. Obviously there are a few models which cannot be taken - ie Defiler and Land Speeder since the two do not coexist in SM and CSM, and even counts as would be difficult.

TanithScout
03-02-2007, 04:05
if you want an army that can be fielded both as a space marine army, and a chaos space marine army, why not use a renegade force of marines, so you can simply have pre and post eras for the armies. armies such as the astral claws, relictors, soul drinkers, or your own diy force. just try and make them in between, give them imperial parts, i.e. your black templar bits, but also make them look dark and a bit closer to chaos with spikes, skulls, spooky looking runes and all that stuff.

-TanithScout

toxic_wisdom
03-02-2007, 04:17
...or your own diy force...

DIY ? I might be missing something here...

MasterModakai
03-02-2007, 05:45
DIY ? I might be missing something here...

Do It Yourself.

Make up a Chapter of your own with your own background.

Hideous Loon
03-02-2007, 08:52
DIY armies are fun. 'Cause you can let your imagination run wild (within reasonable frames, of course, no lost-scions-of-the-Emperor, Lost Legion of Whoop-assy-ness) with both fluff and painting.

Quin 242
03-02-2007, 21:26
I do this very same thing with my Grey legion and alpha legion.

Since I don't take ANY vehicles I just used a few pieces of chaos gear here and there on some troopers, similar to 13th company really...

Since the fluff for Alpha legion has them re-painting thier armor in Imperial colors to get closer to the enemy well..
NP at all.

I use my scouts as Cultists when I want. they are wearing scout armor yes but without the black carapace it just counts as Flak light and thier bolt pistols are just disguised las :)

you just need to have friends that won't give you grief :)

Voronwe[MQ]
03-02-2007, 21:27
Ah, the 13th Company packs are great for it, and the Wulfen models are some of my absolute favourites.

Voronwe

toxic_wisdom
05-02-2007, 14:40
-- content removed (didn't like the test list at all)

Easy E
05-02-2007, 16:52
Interesting idea. I love the way you think to save money.

I'm interested to see the models. It maybe tough to make them look both Imperial and Chaos-y.

toxic_wisdom
09-02-2007, 06:17
Okay... Currently working on the primary (and secondary) HQ choice. Decided on using the Space Marine Commander model...

http://store.us.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.us?do=List_Models&code=302163&orignav=300866&ParentID=253996&GameNav=10

...to represent the SM Commander - Chaos SM Lord. Just need to add some Chaos depth by including a CSM Lord Backpack (9947010206803) and some elements from the CSM Accessory Sprue (99380102005).

And as for the SM Librarian - CSM Sorcerer Lieutenant I'm tossed between two models. I favor the robed look for my Psychics, so I'm either going with the model for Cypher the Fallen Angel (99060102057) or the model for the Dark Angels Standard Bearer (99060101024). Either of which will need some conversion work.

Hhmmm... I could simply use the model for Grand Master of Librarians Ezekiel (99060101023).

toxic_wisdom
19-02-2007, 06:06
Okay - managed to create a mirror list for the dual army. All models used are identical in both lists, with the exception of the Chaos Lord (converted Lucius rep Uther Pendragon) switched for Master (SM Commander rep Arthur Pendragon) and a Librarian (Brother Ezekiel rep Merlin) added to the Space Marine list.

Please keep in mind this is primarily a theme project - not for use in tournament types.

Any thoughts?

toxic_wisdom
19-02-2007, 06:31
The Sons of Pendragon ( Space Marines ) - 1500 Points

-- Take The Fight To Them
-- See But Don't Be Seen

-- Eye To Eye
-- Faithful Unto Death

HQ - 191 pts ( 191 )
115 pt Commander - Master ( mc pw + storm shield )
076 pt Wargear: Adamantine Mantle - Artificer Armour - Terminator Honours - Frag Grens - imPurity Seals

HQ - 213 pts ( 404 )
131 pt Librarian - Epistolary ( mc force weapon + bp )
044 pt Psychic Powers: Fury of the Ancients - Veil of Time
036 pt Wargear: Psychic Hood - Artificer Armour - Terminator Honours - Frag Grens - Auspex - imPurity Seals

Elite - 245 pts ( 649 )
063 pt Sergeant ( mc pf + bp ) Terminator Honours
007 pt Wargear: Auspex - imPurity Seals
168 pt Veterans ( ccw + bp ) Terminator Honours x6
000 pt Unit Vet Skills: Infiltrate
007 pt Unit Wargear: Frag Grens

Troop - 181 pts ( 830 )
045 pt Sergeant ( pf + bp ) Terminator Honours
012 pt Wargear: Auspex - imPurity Seals - Meltabomb
030 pt Space Marine ( lascannon )
025 pt Space Marine ( meltagun )
045 pt Space Marine ( ccw + bp x3 )
024 pt Unit Vet Skills: Infiltrate and Acute Senses

Troop - 181 pts ( 1011 )
045 pt Sergeant ( pf + bp ) Terminator Honours
012 pt Wargear: Auspex - imPurity Seals - Meltabomb
030 pt Space Marine ( lascannon )
025 pt Space Marine ( meltagun )
045 pt Space Marine ( ccw + bp x3 )
024 pt Unit Vet Skills: Infiltrate and Acute Senses

Fast Attack - 217 pts ( 1228 )
082 pt Sergeant ( mc lightning claws ) Terminator Honours
007 pt Wargear: Auspex - imPurity Seals
110 pt Assault Marines ( ccw + bp ) x5
018 pt Unit Wargear: Frag Grens - Krak Grenades - Meltabombs

Heavy Support - 272 pts ( 1500 )
045 pt Sergeant ( pf + bp ) Terminator Honours
007 pt Wargear: Auspex - imPurity Seals
200 pt Devastators ( lascannon ) x4
020 pt Unit Vet Skills: Infiltrate - Acute Senses

toxic_wisdom
12-03-2007, 01:29
The Sons of Pendragon ( Chaos Space Marines ) - 1500 Points

HQ - 204 pts ( 204 )
086 pt Chaos Lord ( dark blade + bp )
075 pt Daemonic: Resilience - Rune - Speed - Strength - Visage
030 pt Vet Skills: Furious Charge - Infiltrate
013 pt Wargear: Spiky Bits - Frag Grens - Krak Grens

Elite - 397 pts ( 601 )
042 pt Aspiring Champion Chosen ( pf + bp )
222 pt Aspiring Champion Chosen ( pw + bp ) x6
084 pt Unit Daemonic: Speed and Visage
042 pt Unit Vet Skills: Furious Charge and Infiltrate
007 pt Unit Wargear: Frag Grens

Troop - 173 pts ( 774 )
042 pt Aspiring Champion ( pf + bp )
029 pt Chaos Space Marine ( lascannon )
024 pt Chaos Space Marine ( meltagun )
042 pt Chaos Space Marine ( ccw + bp x3 )
036 pt Unit Vet Skills: Infiltrate and Counter Attack

Troop - 173 pts ( 947 )
042 pt Aspiring Champion ( pf + bp )
029 pt Chaos Space Marine ( lascannon )
024 pt Chaos Space Marine ( meltagun )
042 pt Chaos Space Marine ( ccw + bp x3 )
036 pt Unit Vet Skills: Infiltrate and Counter Attack

Fast Attack - 273 pts ( 1220 )
092 pt Aspiring Champion ( master crafted lightning claws ) Strength
145 pt Raptors ( ccw + bp ) x5
000 pt Unit Daemonic: Flight - Visage
036 pt Unit Vet Skills: Furious Charge - Infiltrate
000 pt Unit Wargear: Frag Grens - Krak Grens

Heavy Support - 273 pts ( 1493 )
042 pt Aspiring Champion ( pf + bp )
196 pt Havocs ( lascannon ) x4
035 pt Unit Vet Skills: Tank Hunter - Infiltrate - Night Vision

Major_Gilbear
12-03-2007, 21:32
I think the idea here is very sound, but am left wondering one thing: Why crossover everything?

Aside from just seeing if you can, what is so bad/expensive about having four characters; two Imperials and switch them out for two Chaos when you play as traitors?

Same could apply to vehicles; Rhinos and Landraiders are shared, but have both a Defiler and a Landspeeder, switching them out as appropriate.

That way, for the extra cost of one vehicle and two characters, you've not hamstrung yourself too badly as army composition goes. Plus, you can customise the characters more heavily too, making it more obvious which army you're fielding when you use them.

Just my two cents.