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navratil
16-02-2007, 00:09
Is it possible to make a viable all cavalry force for bretonnians for a 2250 game, Ive never seen bretonnians played before and was just wondering if anyone has ever played against an all cavalry list either as or against them and what you saw as the strengths and weak points of the list.

dominic_carrillo
16-02-2007, 00:16
yes. my friend's army is exclusively mounted cavalry and pegasus knights. there are no peasants, which usually run away and always die. i dont know why anyone would play anything but all cavalry.

navratil
16-02-2007, 01:39
Thanks for the info can you tell me anything youve seen about the army like is it viable in 2250 games it have any major weakness or pretty well rounded.

bluu
16-02-2007, 01:48
To answer our question, yes, it is possible, even prefered to play an all-cavalry Bretonnia army. This is because of several reasons. The biggest one being the powerful "Lance Formation", which makes Bretonnian cavalry able to handle ranked up infantry with ease. Also, they have several different kind of cavalry available to them, which means their cavalry is more versitile than that of other races. Bretonnia have Pegasus Knights, knight mounted on flying horses, which can take up many roles ordinarily unavailable to cavalry due to their superior movment, and the fact that they move as skirmishers, instead of like a rank- and file-unit. These, together with a number of lance formations, and perhaps some singe rank cavalry are very powerful, and gives the Bretonnian player a tactical advantage which no other cavalry heavy army has.

Personally, and this is only my personal thoughts, an all-cavalry list is quite boring. Against most armies, you simply run at full speed against the enemy and slam into them as fast as possible, with much less thought of tactics and strategy than in other armies. Also, what I've heard is that many people get bored after playing the army this way. since it doesn't really give you that much variation. Including peasants in your list gives you the option of taking the only shooting available to Bretonnia, being Peasant Bowmen and the Trebuchet. Also, you have the Grail relique, a unit of Grail Knight-worshipping peasants who can be used as a tarpit, since they are unlikely to run, no matter how much of a beating they take. Also, you have cheap Men-At-Arms, that can easily be fielded in huge numbers to give you some Combat Resolution. They can also act in coordination with cavalry, slamming into the front of an enemy unit, giving the cavalry a nice setup for flank/rear charges. They can also be used as sacrificial units, due to their low costs. Personally, I think that fielding a mixed force will make the experience much more fun for both yourself and your opponent. It will make it possible for you to evolve your tactical sense, and even make your list more of an "all-comer", as some armiers field units which will not be destroyed by a lance charge. Also, many people believe that an all-cavalry list is cheesy, as is maximizes on the "no-brainers", being rock-hard, well-protected cavalry, without any of the less powerful peasantry.

To sum it up, of course you can take an all-cavalry, it will probably earn you more wins than a list with peasants. But, you might want to think about using the entire army list, and also evolving a tactical diversity, which the peasanty offers. I should also say that I am not a Bretonnia player, but I have faced them many times, and played them on a handful of times, and know of their potential. My main army is High Elves.

dominic_carrillo
16-02-2007, 01:50
its very good. superior armor saves, good fighting, good characters and excellant magic defense.
extra hero means you can have a group of really good fighters and a mage.
the bretonian warhorses mean that our movement is great.
why shoot at stuff when you can just kill it? i mean, knights are going to live longer whether theyre in combat or not, so peasants arent really worth it.
he plays every knight unit except for the errant ones.
he has two small units of questing knights, three or four units of Knights of the realm and the Gay Ole' Knights (grail knights)
all of the units are played in squads of 6 to 8 which means there are ALOT of units to kill.
he takes out gunlines, chaos and basically everything else by charging two units into combat at a time, which cuts down the effectiveness of fear and if everything goes his way, he will have a buttload of S5 attacks.

the pegasus knights go wizard hunting and rear flank charge. they are played in a unit of three to save points for the meat and potatoes of the army, which is always the Knights of the Realm.

good luck. avoid peasants. have fun

navratil
16-02-2007, 03:37
Thanks for the replys I will probably test out some cavalry lists for the 2250 and possibly add some bowmen to the mix depending on how i like the play testing.

TheWarSmith
16-02-2007, 03:52
yes. my friend's army is exclusively mounted cavalry and pegasus knights. there are no peasants, which usually run away and always die. i dont know why anyone would play anything but all cavalry.

Grail Reliquae are INSANELY GOOOD!!!!! Stubborn Ld8(or higher) and often a break test reroll due to the BSB(if you're smart) makes a REALLY REALLY good tarpit unit.

I really wanted M@A to be decent cause i felt bad using too much cav, but i've reached my breaking point and concluded that they suck big floppy donkey D**K!!. They're relatively expensive and they just plain suck

navratil
16-02-2007, 04:11
Seeing as how I have no Bretonnia whatsoever yet and pretty much limitless spending 4 what would a good 2250 list consist of? and im definately getting the classic bret lord with the lance featured in a white dwarf probly 4-6 issues back as Earl De Grace i believe in the battalion battle report vs tomb kings.

Alathir
16-02-2007, 04:43
Am I the only one in the world who likes Men at Arms? I think I may be.

Cavalry forces are definitley viable and most people do them, but I like to field quite a decent amount of peasants as well. I think it looks cooler on the table and those men at arms models are freaking awesome.

Vattendroppe
16-02-2007, 06:30
Is it possible to make a viable all cavalry force for bretonnians for a 2250 game, Ive never seen bretonnians played before and was just wondering if anyone has ever played against an all cavalry list either as or against them and what you saw as the strengths and weak points of the list.

I've done it, so yes, it's possible. But there are some great weaknesses to all cav forces of brets. First of all, you don't get many models, all your units will be worth darn lots of points and rely deeply on their armour save. NOT fun meeting up against cannons and stone throwers. You should always pray before the battle.

Also, you cannot rely on combat res, and you won't have many archers.

But you have an army that's great for manouvering and that has got a real funny armour save bulk! :D

Makarion
16-02-2007, 06:44
It's not only cannons that kill knights.... Any decent high-magic army will do some very high-point casualties. And a smart player hides his or her wizards in blocks of infantry, so they may not be easy to hunt with pegasus knights, either.

Ergo, if you are absolutely certain you need to have an all-cavalry list, bring some *mounted* damsels, to hide in your lances.

navratil
16-02-2007, 06:48
Well I havent actually bought any bretonnians yet im still in the process of finding out what army would suite me best I like the brets for the simple fact knights etc and the highly detailed paint jobs i can do on em, where as if i played undead themes skeletons are alot easier to paint but I have no info on the tk's or vc's whatsoever. So I guess ill see if I can findout what people think of each team and what their strength's and weakness's are.

Vattendroppe
16-02-2007, 07:28
Well I havent actually bought any bretonnians yet im still in the process of finding out what army would suite me best I like the brets for the simple fact knights etc and the highly detailed paint jobs i can do on em, where as if i played undead themes skeletons are alot easier to paint but I have no info on the tk's or vc's whatsoever. So I guess ill see if I can findout what people think of each team and what their strength's and weakness's are.

As have been pointed out, one can certainly make a viable list including only cavalry, but you can make MUCH better and funnier lists using peasants!

druchii
16-02-2007, 08:23
Is it possible to make a viable all cavalry force for bretonnians for a 2250 game, Ive never seen bretonnians played before and was just wondering if anyone has ever played against an all cavalry list either as or against them and what you saw as the strengths and weak points of the list.

Don't listen to the naysayers!

An all cav list is as fun as your opponent makes it! Think of an all cav list as the great white light which snines on an army, and reveals the blemishes.

If your opponent lacks cavalry of his own, fast cavalry, warmachines, YOU WILL HURT THEM.

While it is true that ALL units suffer against the bait and flee tactics, Bretonnian lances (and indeed all cav armies) are particularly vulnerable to this, and the over extended charge tactics.

Peasants are just, and the emphasis is mine, PLAIN. BAD. A unit of 20 M@As with full command is 150ish points. So is a lance of 6 Knights of the realm. Odd.

Oh, here's MY championship Bretonnian list. It is most definately an Errantry war list, and has indeed brought the crusade to a good few goodie-two-shoes.s.s'.

http://www.thegreatuncleanone.com/viewShort.asp?ArmyID=236330

Welcome to the lance!
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EDIT: made TGUO.COM's army post a bit easier to read. Sorry!