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Duhgame
02-03-2007, 03:43
I've heard some rumors going around that LOTR is going to be retired in the next 2 years (approxiamte best guesses on a rumor). Will this release future release dates on new stuff for 40k? :D

Will we see more than 2 codexes a years and more models released or will it stay the same and a new 3rd game will replace LOTR? I'm just curious as to what others have heard and have speculated based on previous expereince or an idea of how GW works. :angel:

Thanks in advance!

MaliGn
02-03-2007, 04:06
In the past afaik GW have always released 2-3 army books per year for each of the two main games (40k and wfb) with the only markd increases in this scale being when a complete rule revision of each game was conducted eg 3rd ed 40k. Since GW have basically abandoned their previous specialist games after the first couple of years; and with the release of LOTR movies being over and there being a limited amount of new potential miniature ideas from lotr to draw upon it is reasonable to see lotr going off the radar soon. However GW will either redevelop some old specialist game (cross reference epic 40k) or find a new avenue for wargame development (GW Narnia or Harry Potter?).

Feor
02-03-2007, 06:22
Hopefully they replace LOTR with more work on their various specialist games. It'd be nice to see some Battlefleet Gothic stuff in my local GW that wasn't already assembled, painted, and starting to collect dust. :p

Plus the legends of Bloodbowl and Gorkamorka makes me giggle.

Inquisitor Lord Horus
02-03-2007, 10:23
LotR was limited from the start once the Tolken well drys up unless the get rights to make their own storylines it will go in afew years. But before it dose they must do the hobbit. Ithink that when is does go one of the specelist games will rise up to take it's place BFG i think but overall i dont think the speed at which GW releases things will change to much.

Adept
02-03-2007, 11:09
1 - The contract GW has with New Line Cinema ends in 2010. The contract, at the time of purchase, was worth a bundle due to the recent release of the films. The films are over now, and New Line has to realise that the licence is no longer worth as much. It is my opinion that they will offer to renew the licence with GW at a greatly reduced rate over a shorter period. Say, renewing every two years instead of ten.

LotR occupies a very popular niche. Tolkien has a much wider appeal to both the general public and wargamers in general. There will always be a keen fanbase playing and collecting LotR. I don't think it will be going anywhere, although GW have made some poor business decisions in the past so I could well be mistaken.

2 - LotR has had no negative impact on the 40K release schedule, and there is no reason to suspect canning it would increase the rate of 40K releases.

3 - Specialist games were created as a seperate section of GW well before the introduction of LotR because no single one of them sold well enough to warrant the promotion time or store shelf space. This is unlikely to change in the future, and we are unlikely to see any of the specialist games return as a third core game. Frankly, I think thats a good thing. I like my specialist games, and don't see the need to continually update and re-release them just for the sake of it like GW does with 40K and WHFB. Leave well enough alone, I say.

RobC
02-03-2007, 17:27
unless the get rights to make their own storylinesThat, my friend, will be the day that hell freezes over. Or 2068 - depends which happens first.

THE KAPPTIN
03-03-2007, 03:49
GW has said many times that LotR is one of their core games and as such is not going anywhere. They do have a contract that will run out... maybe when that happens they'll change the name of the system. :P

I think it could go either way, really. They have made up their own things in Tolkein's world (e.g. the new Arnor demon) so I think when they run out of Tolkeinish material they could easily start makin' their own.
Or, maybe they'll just have to retire it at 2010.

I think if LotR ends, it won't have any positive effect on the rest of GW. Just a hunch. Except WD; we won't have so many wasted pages! :D

I can't see them increasing specialist games or release rates. Maybe they'll just try to do a better job on the things they do release. (balance, new fluff/art, and, for pete's sake, proofreading!)

Adept
03-03-2007, 07:04
I think if LotR ends, it won't have any positive effect on the rest of GW. Just a hunch. Except WD; we won't have so many wasted pages! :D

What are you talking about? There'll still be all that 40K crap in it...

The game is afoot
03-03-2007, 07:05
I think if LotR ends, it won't have any positive effect on the rest of GW.

You're absolutely right.
Lord of the Rings is far more famous than Games Workshop.
Ask the average man or woman in the street which one they have heard of?
LotR everytime.
If you take LoTR out of GW stores it's just one less reason to go in there.
The best GW sculpting of the past 5 years has consistently been in the LoTR range.
Recently GW were looking at the possibility of extending the LoTR contract but they are having to wait.
New Line Cinema's rights to do the Hobbit run out soon, unless they renegotiate with the Tolkien Foundation. Peter Jackson is suing NLC for unpaid monies so they have said he won't be directing the Hobbit.
The Tolkien Foundation don't want anyone else to do the Hobbit except Jackson and they don't care which movie house gets it.
GW's contract is with New Line so they will be hoping that NLC renegotiate with the Tolkien Foundation.

Either way, GW definitely WANT the rights to continue if it means they can get the Hobbit because it will be a massive cash injection even if it's only for a 12 month period.
It will breathe life into the existing LotR range as well.
All that free advertising goes a long way toward more bricks and mortar stores in the USA and Japan.

Regarding release times, they were Always slow before LoTR, what makes you think that will change should LoTR depart from GW.

Chancer
03-03-2007, 10:21
I don't think that dumping LOTR wil increase the release schedule any. I don't recall the realeases for 40k and WFB being any quicker pre lotr. Its thanks to the massive cash injection from LOTR that Gw has a lot of the resources that it has.

I don't think that they will dump the game anyway. They will alienate for too many players. They could just do what they do with the warhammers and repackage the game every 6 years or so with a slight rules tweak, then re-package the miniatures and re-write the supplements slightly. They have already done it once to bring it in line with the core game format. I daresay that they will do it again in about 5-6 years or so. It is how they do business.

As the memory of the movies fades they are starting to do more and more of their own thing rather than just recreate the stuff from the movies so there is some potential fro growth.

Osbad
03-03-2007, 11:37
2 - LotR has had no negative impact on the 40K release schedule, and there is no reason to suspect canning it would increase the rate of 40K releases.

This is the absolute truth. If profits from LotR hadn't subsidised the other two games, we wouldn't have even seen the level of releases for 40k we have had. 40k fans need to cease this mindless bigotry and realise the truth!

MaliGn
03-03-2007, 12:56
...once the Tolken well drys up...

Which will take an awfully long time as there is an astronomical amount of middle earth related Tolkein text out there.

Brandir
03-03-2007, 16:24
The GW LOTR licence runs out Nov 2011.

With a film version of The Hobbit due to hit local cinema screens in December 2009 and a 'name tbc' LOTR prequal to be released in December 2010 I suspect that GW will renew any licences available.

Adept
03-03-2007, 18:55
This is the absolute truth. If profits from LotR hadn't subsidised the other two games, we wouldn't have even seen the level of releases for 40k we have had. 40k fans need to cease this mindless bigotry and realise the truth!

It really gets my goat, you know? The majority of 40K and WHFB players won't even give LotR a chance. Won't even look at the rules, won't consider playing a game of it, and take every opportunity to bitch to each other about how it's stolen resources from the other core games, stolen WD space, and is a mindless cash-in from the movies with no future.

They've made up their minds with a solidity reminiscent of religious fanatics, refusing to even listen to the other side let alone weigh their arguments objectively.

Osbad
03-03-2007, 19:07
It really gets my goat, you know? The majority of 40K and WHFB players won't even give LotR a chance. Won't even look at the rules, won't consider playing a game of it, and take every opportunity to bitch to each other about how it's stolen resources from the other core games, stolen WD space, and is a mindless cash-in from the movies with no future.

They've made up their minds with a solidity reminiscent of religious fanatics, refusing to even listen to the other side let alone weigh their arguments objectively.

Absolutely agree. It is really irritating how ignorant, bigoted and just plain WRONG they are. Right from the start LotR has been GW's unwanted red headed child. No wonder there is little crossover from LotR players into GW's other games, because, as a rule so many individuals playing those other games have been just plain rude in their assessment of what in reality is an excellent game and a real boon to the wider wargaming community.

As you say Adept: dissers of LotR should really check their facts before repeating their incorrect and outdated prejudices in public, as doing so just makes them look childish and stupid!

One fact that should stick in the craw of any bigoted 40k fanatic: I have a copy of a WD which publishes a scenario using 1st edition Warhammer to play the Battle of the Pelennor Fields. GW was playing LotR years before th "Warhammer World", let alone Warhammer 40,000 was even thought of! If, God-forbid anything happened to GW, people would still be playing LotR decades after 40k will have been forgotten, if history is any predictor of the future!

Get over it people: LotR is an ASSET to GW, not a LIABILITY!

The game is afoot
04-03-2007, 16:51
One fact that should stick in the craw of any bigoted 40k fanatic: I have a copy of a WD which publishes a scenario using 1st edition Warhammer to play the Battle of the Pelennor Fields. GW was playing LotR years before the "Warhammer World", let alone Warhammer 40,000 was even thought of! If, God-forbid anything happened to GW, people would still be playing LotR decades after 40k will have been forgotten, if history is any predictor of the future!

Get over it people: LotR is an ASSET to GW, not a LIABILITY!

Thats a powerful fact right there.

yabbadabba
04-03-2007, 19:07
I have to agree with those who say give LOTR a chance. It is definitely one of the best skirmish level games out there, and is incredibly easy to convert to other genres - take Legends of the Wild West.

Just out of interest does anybody convert rules anymore?

The other things is that if you look at GW LOTR releases recently you will notice that they are making their own stuff up.

I would hope that GW keeps it going for as long as they can. I hope they also sort out specialist stuff too!

Nurglitch
04-03-2007, 20:02
Yeah, there's an entire forum (http://www.warseer.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=17) devoted to developing new rules and converting rules. For example I've converted the Bloodbowl rules to both a 40k-style skirmish game and a Quest-style dungeon crawl.

I think the power of LOTR is the fact that its variants have actually gained a following in the notoriously fickle world of wargaming.

lanrak
05-03-2007, 00:59
Hi all.
I find it odd that when GW have to pay for sombody elses IP,they make a good job of developing the actual game for the bought IP.
LOTR is a good (large ish )skirmish level IMO.
The game it self does compare well to other similar systems.

So why do GW refuse to develop thier own IP, as in the 40k game, to a similar high standard?
Even though the games developers ARE capable of eveloping much better
game system for 40k.

40k game is 40k aslong as the IP stays constant.The changes from RT to 4th ed have been huge.

So why not redo the 40k rules and game mechanics, to be more in synergy with the 40k background?

Just a thought.

TTFN
lanrak.

The game is afoot
05-03-2007, 06:02
So why not redo the 40k rules and game mechanics, to be more in synergy with the 40k background?
Just a thought.

...and a good thought.
I think it's a simple answer and it came out of Jervis' mouth a little while ago...
"It's all about the miniatures."
The game systems have become very secondary.

MaliGn
06-03-2007, 01:43
[QUOTE=yabbadabba;1353189]

The other things is that if you look at GW LOTR releases recently you will notice that they are making their own stuff up.
QUOTE]

not quite true, while GW are releasing non-movie Lotr stuff they aren't actually "making stuff up" they are using ideas from other middle-earth set pieces of work by Tolkein and things hinted at within LoTR itself. Oh and in regards to Hobbit stuff wasn't there a Battle of Five Armies boxed set out a while ago? IIRC that was at the end of the Hobbit.