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feintstar
05-03-2007, 06:58
I am considering the feasibility of taking an Archmage with the Book of Hoeth, a banner of Sorcery, and 3 combat heroes, ignoring all other magic.

With 2 4 dice casts on average, you can let the non irresistables simply get dispelled, and live off the irresistables. That gives you enough magic effectiveness to really screw your (magical) foes around (5 dice cast of drain magic will end an enemy magic phase by itself, and failing that, fortune is fickle) while having enough base heroes to mix it up in combat, and WIN. Or when facing combative enemies, take shadowmagic, for pit of shades, steed of shadows and unseen lurker. Or take beasts magic, for bear's anger, the wolf hunts and the hunter's spear.

Has anyone tried this? How well did it work out?

So the build I'm dreaming of is something like:

27 Spears, Commander, Armour of the Gods, Sword of Might
(7x4)
27 Spears, (Archmage, Book of Hoeth)
(7x4)
19 Spears, Commander, Lion Guard, Lion Banner (Anchor unit)
(5x4)
6 Silverhelms

5 Dragon Princes with Banner of Sorcery, Commander, Battlebanner (breaker unit)

6 Shadow Warriors (marchblockers)

1 Chariot

6 Ellyrian Reavers, (bait)

4RBTs (force them to come to me, for the countercharge)

Which should fit nicely into 2500 points. It could theoretically be competitive in all the phases. If I could squeeze in a unit of White Lions, i could give them the Banner of sorcery, then give the DPs a Warbanner for D6+3 static combat res. Thoughts?

EvC
05-03-2007, 11:08
I wouldn't ever roll five dice at any one time, the chances of a miscast and loss of 400 point character are too great.

Vattendroppe
05-03-2007, 12:02
I wouldn't ever roll five dice at any one time, the chances of a miscast and loss of 400 point character are too great.

Totally agree.

smileyface
06-03-2007, 01:35
I am considering the feasibility of taking an Archmage with the Book of Hoeth, a banner of Sorcery, and 3 combat heroes, ignoring all other magic.

I did some maths on the book a while back, and I agree that if you're going to use it, one caster is probably the way to go. The difference is, I think it's a pretty bad idea. Casting on four dice gives you one IF in every two spells. So two out of every three game turns you get a spell off. The third game turn you get about 0.75 spells off because your banner of sorcery rolled a 1 and the book is a lot less effective on three dice.

My problem is, I don't think one cast per turn is enough of a return when you've invested 405 points in this. Take your example of "Drain Magic" - you can completely shut down the enemy magic phase provided that you take High Magic, and provided it's the "drain magic" that is irresistable, and provided your opponent has only one caster. If your opponent has a more normal two-caster or three caster system, then you get to drain one of them and the other casts... not exactly inspiring stuff. What's worse to my mind is that if you do this you are paying 405 points for unreliable defense. You could take a level 3 archmage with 5 dispel scrolls (or 3 and a destry scroll/annullian crystal) and get better defense cheaper. Granted, the book version means you don't have to alter the list when using a different approach, but I still think the return is too small. I think a better investment would be a couple of level 2's toting both rings, the jewel of the dusk, and a scroll. That gives you the same DD but with a scroll, is only 5 points more is you get the banner as well, and lets you try for three or maybe even four spells per turn with two bound spells as well. I think you'll get more through that way. The only advantage I see to the book archmage is that he is more likely to chuck out the really big spells - you know, casting value 10+ stuff. I'm not really bothered about that though.

Regarding the rest of your list, I feel obliged to point out that HE characters taking on enemy characters is a bit of a pipe dream. You might beat empire characters or goblins, but dwarves, chaos, vampires, TK, brets, and even WE are a bit hard for you. Also, I'd advise taking more small support units and fewer spears. Big blocks of spears look nice, but when it comes to combat res they don't offer more ranks than small units, and they don't offer more combat ability than cavalry do.

forgottenlor
07-03-2007, 07:33
A friend of mine uses it and rolls 5 dice. Its hell, really. He shut down my slann complete in one game with drain magic. True, its risky. My experience as an opponent though, is that it can be very very nasty. Remember, there is absolutely nothing you can do to stop the spell the wizard wants to cast.

warhawk95
07-03-2007, 14:10
the idea seems to work although if you are going for pure magic defense why not just use a lvl 3 scroll caddie or a lvl 3 with 3 scrolls and annulian crystal. book to me seems more like an offensive item that you use so you can get off the big spell to hurt your opponent. you have the PD to do this but to use it as deffence??? seems like a waste of point to me. if you wanted to use the book then why not just swap a commander for a lvl 1 scroll caddie with channeller. then you get a mage for deffense and one for pure offense, just take a damage lore like fire, metal, or death and just constantly cast the big spell with 4 dice, you have a 49.2% chance of get IF on a +12 and over 50% with lower casting values.