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Fallen_star
13-03-2007, 14:30
I'm currently in the process of making a high elf army however whilst pondering various strategiesí began wondering if there was a more reliable method of stopping a bretonian charge since there are several players in the gaming store near me who use 2 large blocks (4*5 I think) in 1000pt matches with flanking peasants and a trebuchet in a corner......

my first though is lore of beasts but they get some warding save thingy.
second bolt throwers but there save is a bit mean.
not getting charged harder to do but helms with ellyrions banner and eagles...

pcgamer72
13-03-2007, 14:48
There's always the Lore of Metal =D.

Fallen_star
13-03-2007, 15:11
@pcgamer72
true its a nice lore but if i remember rightly brets get special rules to ruin magic aimed at them....

though I have pondered placing terrain to force a narrow defile between hills then using comet of cassandra on the gap should make them think twice.

Vattendroppe
13-03-2007, 16:39
I'm currently in the process of making a high elf army however whilst pondering various strategies’ began wondering if there was a more reliable method of stopping a bretonian charge since there are several players in the gaming store near me who use 2 large blocks (4*5 I think) in 1000pt matches with flanking peasants and a trebuchet in a corner......

my first though is lore of beasts but they get some warding save thingy.
second bolt throwers but there save is a bit mean.
not getting charged harder to do but helms with ellyrions banner and eagles...

Flee is always an option, not that much with HE though. Lore of metal. Chunks of terrain in the battlefield.


@pcgamer72
true its a nice lore but if i remember rightly brets get special rules to ruin magic aimed at them...

I've never heard of such a rule, you mean the ward save they get from praying perhaps?

Chicago Slim
13-03-2007, 17:14
Fleeing the charge is definitely a tactic that you should develop, preferably fleeing with fast cavalry. Keep in mind that the whole point of fleeing from a charge is to draw the charger out to where you can then charge into his flanks, so you need to set it up so that you have something ready and waiting, which will have LOS on his flanks after he fails his charge...

wildkarrde0
13-03-2007, 17:22
as you mention lore beast can hurt them the spell that stop cav moving is always usful and as high elve you need to roll it and its only 7+ to cast i,ve pinned down whole units of brets like that with my beastmen until the giant can get there to thump them:)

pcgamer72
13-03-2007, 17:37
@pcgamer72
true its a nice lore but if i remember rightly brets get special rules to ruin magic aimed at them....


They'll get their ward save, but they'll get that against anythng that hurts their armor much.

McMullet
13-03-2007, 17:44
Flying and Scouting units can block the Knights from marching, which delays them from charging by a couple of turns.

Another tactic is to have small "bait" units, for HE I suppose you could use 10 archers or something. Use them to screen the rest of the army. The Knights can charge the bait unit, but you ensure there's a unit of cavalry to charge knights in the flank once the bait is dead, even if they overrun.

smileyface
14-03-2007, 01:49
Flee is always an option, not that much with HE though.

Funny, I've always thought of flee-to-victory as being a very HE way of playing. High basic leadership plus the inability to hold an enemy charge equals fleeing!


I'm currently in the process of making a high elf army however whilst pondering various strategiesí began wondering if there was a more reliable method of stopping a bretonian charge

You could potentially stand in the way. Taking a lion guard character in an infantry block makes them stubborn, and that's you losing combat but holding on a nine.
The downside is that if they catch on and kill the character in a flurry of lances, it ends very badly. Also it tends to lead to massive casualties.

Personally, I prefer out-charging them, and playing devious games.

Outcharging:
Your basic cav charge 16", your special cav charge 18", characters on eagles go 20", and the chariot support goes 18". They charge 16" (although units with characters can potentially go 3" faster). Now, since you probably outshoot them, they will be obliged to advance. That means they are advancing into your charge range. If you can reliably estimate 16", then you should get the charge.

Tricks:
Make them up as you go. Hide behind terrain so they have to advance round it. Be clever. If that fails, use this one, the classic bait and flee:
Basically, you set it up so they can charge something. When they do, you flee with that unit. Then your other units charge them.

Fast cavalry is best for the bait unit, except that it makes it a bit obvious. I mean, people with any experience expect fast cav to flee.


bretonian charge since there are several players in the gaming store near me who use 2 large blocks (4*5 I think) in 1000pt matches with flanking peasants and a trebuchet in a corner......


Blocks? Is that right, a four by five block of knights? Not a four by three lance? Because two blocks that big would be a thousand points straight off. Two lances of twelve would be about 2/3 of his army.

If you had four units of five cav with standard and musician (total cost: about the same as his big lances), and you had a couple of chariots, then you could move so that all four cavalry units are just within his charge range (two cav units to each one of his), but spaced out a bit so that if he charges one, he turns a flank to the other. Meanwhile you bring your chariots up to just within their charge range - and as a bonus you can use your bows to check you got the range right. Then either he retreats (getting you closer to the easy VP's of the war machine and giving you more table control); or he stands/advances carefully (keeping you to his fore) in which case you can move one unit round each flank, retreat slightly with the others, and kill him in your next turn; finally, he might charge, in which case the charged units run, then in your next turn your non-fleeing cav go in the flank with chariots in front. Result should be a win.

Or you could use magic. I've never been that big a fan of it, personally.

explorator
14-03-2007, 03:23
second bolt throwers but there save is a bit mean.

The Brettonians would get no armor save vs. your bolt throwers if you launch a single shot, if that was your reference. Brettonian ward saves will hinder this tactic but should not eliminate it.

Vattendroppe
14-03-2007, 06:07
Funny, I've always thought of flee-to-victory as being a very HE way of playing. High basic leadership plus the inability to hold an enemy charge equals fleeing!

The thing I wanted pointed out is that HE can have a little problem with the pts cost of their units, finding baiting units can be harsh. You can always do it with ellyrian reavers though, but you would have to spend some points in each unit, making the whole idea very expensive pts-wise.