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Tuch
04-04-2007, 01:20
I've got a few questions about goblin fanatics.

Since they have no weapon skill and cannot be charged am I right to assume that neither the fantic itself nor their opponent can end their move in base to base contact with one another and that they simply maintain the one inch barrier?

Also, as fanatics cannot be charged are frenzied units required to do so?

lparigi34
04-04-2007, 03:29
1.- I can not tell if the Fanatic 1" rule does not apply. The 1" rule is for enemy units, and the fanatic is neither friend nor foe... The 1" rule is intends to maintain some visible order, specially to make clear in multiple combats who is fighting and who is not. So I suggest that if you think you need to put 1" space to your Fanatic, in order to be sure of what is going on, then go for it.

2.- Do not think so...

Doc Havoc
04-04-2007, 03:58
All of these answers are clearly spelled out inthe O&G codex. Please refer to the part of the book that describes Night Goblins and Fanatics.

Vattendroppe
04-04-2007, 05:24
As Doc Havoc said.

But just in case. When one moves through a fanatic you take hits as if it would have been moving through you. You cannot charge them (IIRC), but you can chose to kill it by moving you unit to it (fluffwise they form a circle around it and kill it while it's spinning) and suffer 2d6 hits from the fanatic.

mattjgilbert
04-04-2007, 11:01
Indeed, as detailed in the army book a unit will take hits for contact either way: fanatic moves into unit, unit moves over fanatic.

The fanatic is still a "foe". You can shoot it after all...

Briohmar
04-04-2007, 11:46
As Doc Havoc said.

But just in case. When one moves through a fanatic you take hits as if it would have been moving through you. You cannot charge them (IIRC), but you can chose to kill it by moving you unit to it (fluffwise they form a circle around it and kill it while it's spinning) and suffer 2d6 hits from the fanatic.

Ah! but how many people are actually willing to do that. I know I did last Saturday in the second game of a tournament I was playing in. I cast the unbreakable spell on a unit of five hounds, and sent them out to die and kill the fanatic, thus allowing a charge on the now defenseless night goblins by my chaos knights. I had never executed that option before, but I feel it was the right choice this time, and the hounds were supposed to die anyways when they sprung the fanatic, he just failed to hit them.

Vattendroppe
04-04-2007, 11:49
Ah! but how many people are actually willing to do that. I know I did last Saturday in the second game of a tournament I was playing in. I cast the unbreakable spell on a unit of five hounds, and sent them out to die and kill the fanatic, thus allowing a charge on the now defenseless night goblins by my chaos knights. I had never executed that option before, but I feel it was the right choice this time, and the hounds were supposed to die anyways when they sprung the fanatic, he just failed to hit them.

I didn't say no one wanted to do it, just that it is rule-wise possible ;)

However, there could be situations where you would want it. As you say, or for example, if you play brets and have a fanatic dangerously close to a unit of say grail knights and a unit of some men-at-arms that can take the fanatics out. A clear choise to me at least :p

mattjgilbert
04-04-2007, 12:02
I've seen it done to :D Clear the fanatic out the way using a unit that can take it or you are willing to sacrifice...

Josef Bugman
04-04-2007, 12:16
I hate fanactics they can cause damage to my entire army but it is right funny when they smack onto a tree

Briohmar
04-04-2007, 14:10
I've always loved the concept of the fanatics, just never been real fond of what they do to my army if I get too close.

Having moved into a fanatic now, I will say that it is 30 points well spent. (Gods how I love Chaos Hounds.) Though I don't think I'd try it with anything more expensive that that.

ZeroTwentythree
04-04-2007, 15:59
But just in case. When one moves through a fanatic you take hits as if it would have been moving through you. You cannot charge them (IIRC), but you can chose to kill it by moving you unit to it (fluffwise they form a circle around it and kill it while it's spinning) and suffer 2d6 hits from the fanatic.


Huh? :eyebrows: See, this is why I hate the over-reliance on special rules contained only in army books. I had no idea this option existed, as it was not previously available IIRC and none of my opponents has really volunteered the information.

Vattendroppe
04-04-2007, 16:49
Huh? :eyebrows: See, this is why I hate the over-reliance on special rules contained only in army books. I had no idea this option existed, as it was not previously available IIRC and none of my opponents has really volunteered the information.

The new 2d6-kill-fanatic-thing is new, that's why you read the new army books ;)

ZeroTwentythree
04-04-2007, 19:44
I don't care to buy a rulebook I have no other use for just to find out they changed the fanatic rules in a way that won't come up unless I (the opponent) initiate it.

Vattendroppe
05-04-2007, 05:15
I don't care to buy a rulebook I have no other use for just to find out they changed the fanatic rules in a way that won't come up unless I (the opponent) initiate it.

Why no, you read your opponents ;)
Or ask him to tell you if there are any rules you should be aware of since you haven't played against the new OaG before.

Greyfire
05-04-2007, 05:50
am I right to assume that neither the fanatic itself nor their opponent can end their move in base to base contact with one another and that they simply maintain the one inch barrier?


If you are talking about voluntary movement I think the answer is yes, you have to respect the 1" rule. If you're talking about what happens after the fanatic hits a unit, you're also correct as detailed in the O&G book. Charging through it, while suicidal, could be a good move to make, but it won't usually cause the unit to end it's move over the fanatic. Using a cheap unit to draw the fanatics out is great too, but there's usually no way for the fanatic to end it's move in a unit. The section of the O&G book discussing what happens if a unit ends it's move over a fanatic is what I think you're asking about though (I know it's the one that kept me awake after reading your question last night;)).

Since you can't charge the fanatic, you can't get base-to-base with them that way. Since you can't voluntarily move over the fanatic as it's still an enemy model, you can't get base-to-base that way either.

So I was left pondering how a unit would end it's move over the fanatic. Why would that text be there about the fanatic being within a unit? Please, someone correct me if I'm incorrect but the only way that I could see happening is if:

1) The charge that would be through the fanatic is a failed charge so moving your base distance puts you right over the fanatic (bad luck on that one).
2) if a unit pursued someone over the fanatic (and didn't roll well enough to pass over it/stop short of it)
3) if a unit flees into it (and again has the dice gods frown upon them so then end their movement right onto of the merry lad).

All of these methods aren't quite voluntary tho'. I didn't see anything in the O&G book that allows the 1" rule to be ignored for voluntary movement. I can't just move a cheap unit over a fanatic to cause it to be destroyed. Did I miss something there?

Oh, and I agree with Vattendroppe - do your best to read your friends' books during idle moments to refresh your (and maybe his) memory, and save your money. It took three readings before I noticed the "fanatic destroyed if moves into another fanatic" sentence was missing and my friend had been playing that way since the new book came out. I think now they just do d6 hits to each other, bouncing out the other side of the one that's encountered first. In effect it should be the same thing, but there's a chance one or even both could survive an encounter now. Not very likely but it could happen with lots of ones.

-=- Greyfire

DaBrode
05-04-2007, 06:34
Ah! but how many people are actually willing to do that.

In last Saturday's tournament I charged over my own fanatics to get the charge off and kill stuff.

I'm an O&G player man, that's what ya gotta do!

DaBrode
05-04-2007, 06:36
I don't care to buy a rulebook I have no other use for just to find out they changed the fanatic rules in a way that won't come up unless I (the opponent) initiate it.


If you don't care to buy the book, play by the old rules. But honestly, this forum is not here to give you free Army book quotes.

ZeroTwentythree
05-04-2007, 12:55
You missed the point. I don't play O&G, and I wasn't asking for army book quotes, and don't care to use either a new or old O&G army. And I hardly think many opponents are going to go for a request to use the old army book because I (a non O&G player) haven't bought their army's new army book.

I was commenting on the fact that one has to buy every other (opponents') army book in order to know what your own army is allowed to do against various "special rules" in that army.

As a Skaven & Empire player, no O&G opponent has explained to me that since the new book came out, fanatics can be attacked in this way, and I had no reason to suspect anything.

Atrahasis
05-04-2007, 13:28
Whenever a new book comes out I make a point of buying it or asking to borrow an opponent's at the first opportunity. Familiarising yourself with the armies you will face is one of the most important things you can possibly do.

You most certainly do not have to buy the book to be able to read it.

Briohmar
05-04-2007, 13:49
You missed the point. I don't play O&G, and I wasn't asking for army book quotes, and don't care to use either a new or old O&G army. And I hardly think many opponents are going to go for a request to use the old army book because I (a non O&G player) haven't bought their army's new army book.

I was commenting on the fact that one has to buy every other (opponents') army book in order to know what your own army is allowed to do against various "special rules" in that army.

As a Skaven & Empire player, no O&G opponent has explained to me that since the new book came out, fanatics can be attacked in this way, and I had no reason to suspect anything.

I too buy every army book. I do this for two reasons. One, I'm an intelligence analyst in real life, and my stock in trade is knowing how the enemy fights, and two, I am an American living in Europe, and while I do speak some French, and am functional in German, there are language barriers in games that can be easily overcome by both players opening a book to the same page, each is his respective language, and comparing notes.

DaBrode
05-04-2007, 21:21
You missed the point. I don't play O&G, and I wasn't asking for army book quotes, and don't care to use either a new or old O&G army. And I hardly think many opponents are going to go for a request to use the old army book because I (a non O&G player) haven't bought their army's new army book.

I was commenting on the fact that one has to buy every other (opponents') army book in order to know what your own army is allowed to do against various "special rules" in that army.

As a Skaven & Empire player, no O&G opponent has explained to me that since the new book came out, fanatics can be attacked in this way, and I had no reason to suspect anything.

I buy my own army's books and although I must agree it's extremely helpful to buy your opponents books as well I find I'm not willing to spend the money on them.

However, I do make it a point to borrow my opponents army book at any time during the game where I feel a rule may be questionable, not only because I want to check up on their interpretation of said rule but also because that's how I can learn about their army. The fanatics rules are laid out nice and easy on only a single page. I suggest borrowing it for the 3 minutes it'll take to read it and learn a bit from there.