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spagunk
10-05-2007, 02:30
I want to preface this post with a warning that I do not intend for this to be a "I Hate GW" type thread.

The new BA codex (or mini-dex) coming up presented quite an interesting side effect to my existing army. As it stands, my models are organized as thus:

5 HQ choices
5 Elite choices
6 Troop choices
5 or 6 FA choices
5 Hvy choices
4 Special Characters

Not bad IMO as it it fairly spread around with Elites being somewhat heavy due to tech marines being moved over to elite status in 4th ed C:SM. With the advent of the leaked BA list, things have really taken a dramatic turn (probably for the worse).

9HQ choices
8-9 Elite
4-5 Troop
3 to 4 FA
4 Hvy

Let me explain the change. First, my original list had only 2 squads of Termies (1 8x, 1 6x + 2 extra useless ones). This changed to almost three as the squad size is now 5 max. Scouts got moved over to elite status as well, giving me 1 10x and 1 5x. Both dreads are now elites which means +1 more elite choice. Tech Marines are still elite but they don't take up space on the force chart (Still a choice though). Same goes for DC which increases my count. Number 9 is potentially a VAS but it is entirely possible to become a regular AS (despite having modeled them with MBombs grrr). The troops lost the two scout squads which dropped the count to 4 +1 for the assault squad i got from the FA choices. This could max out at 6 if i decide to take the VAS as a regular AS. FA drops down to 3 possible 4 as i have 2 Land Speeders that may either be seperate squad or one (which didnt change as thats how i did it before the new list). Hvy choices lost the Dreadnought which only gives me 4 to choose from currently. The greatest change was my HQ choices. Since i no longer require permission to use special characters, my HQ choices nearly double.

Anyway, enough of the pity party. Here is why i made this thread. Did any BA players encounter a similar issue when they saw the leaked BA dex? If so, how did you cope with the change?

Remember, no GW hate and please no crying :cheese:.

Dranthar
10-05-2007, 02:39
I don't have a BA army but I imagine it's going to be a common phenomenon. I'm surprised you didn't gain any troop choices from assault squads though, I figured that most players have a unit of those somewhere anyway.

Well if all else fails you could instead just switch your to be traited marines from the SM codex and rename them as the "Blood Angles" - The most feared Marine/Architects in the Galaxy! :D

spagunk
10-05-2007, 03:08
Well, i didnt go into details but currently i have 1 Assault squad, 1 biker squad, 1 atk bike, 2 Land speeders...so i "Gain" 1 troop but lose two because of the scouts.

LMAO @ Blood Angles...keepers of the words of Pythagoras and lords of the obtuse.

UncleCrazy
10-05-2007, 04:33
My g/f's BA is staying the same for the most part.

I think the only big change is moving scouts to elites, and making the DC take up space.

Karhedron
10-05-2007, 08:58
Once you get past 3 choices in most of the Force Org chart it becomes academic anyway as you cannot field all your choices in a single army. It looks like BAs will slightly heavier on Elites than other chapters but I don't see it as a real problem. I always struggle to decide what to take anyway.

My slight gripe is losing the generic 3-wound Chaplains and Librarians. Mephiston and Lemartes may be cool (although the Lemartes model sucks like a dyson :() but I generally prefer to create my own characters. Still, will probably work out OK.

jubilex
10-05-2007, 09:23
My mate caspar's got problems with this too. Quite how does he accommodate this lot? Death co, techmarine, dread, 21 terminators and 21 scouts. Assuming the rumours are true, it would be insanity to not take the death co (as you have paid for them). So, that for most is a 100% no-brainer. It is now impossible to use the figures he has bought, with a five limitation on the terms. :wtf: Now, the op didn't want any gw hate, fair enough, but can you be surprised by it when it comes? Don't get me wrong, I don't expect to be able to field every mini I have. At 3000 points I have about two thirds of my eldar on the table and about 20% of my chaos. But, I went into that with eyes wide open. This is not what seems to be happening to the ba. I for one would be most ****** off if this happened to me. Hey, new dex in a few months time! Slinks away, preparing to be ****** off. :rolleyes:
Ah, well, no gw hate, but mnnnn.

marv335
10-05-2007, 09:29
well I had a BA army in the change from 2nd to 3rd ed.
I had to completely change my army from the ground up. almost every single unit I had was changed in some way.
most of my assault marines needed to be re-armed for a start. I has to buy some tactical marines too.
It was a massive change. I coped though, as did every other BA player I knew at the time. and with a minimum of whining I might add.....;)

cochise
10-05-2007, 09:39
In fact, you really dont have to pay for the DC... as long as you stick to the "free" options. You could field 2 assault squads as troops. Paying only the equivalent of 2 marines. Elite options give the DC for free, bikes dont give DC,dreads dont give DC, neither do tanks. In fact is quite easy to end only paying those 2 marines in points for 4 or 5 DC members. Of course, the more marines on foot (or jetpack) you put on the list, the more DC you will get. Something that goes with the fluff IMO.

Karhedron
10-05-2007, 10:03
Remember that the list in WD is probably a tester so they can get feedback for the full codex when they eventually get around to it. My advice is to play some games and then write a (polite) letter suggesting changes to GW. If enough people express the same oppinions we may be able to get it changed when the real codex comes out.

I look on the new list as a welcome update but also a chance to try out some ideas and give some feedback.

ankara halla
10-05-2007, 10:25
My three terminator squads turned to six, my four scouts squads turned to three (with 7 models left over...), my eight HvySupports turned to five (three dreads going to Elites), my sixty odd tactical marines stayed the same but my fifteen assault marines are now competing for their place, my four speeders stayed the same, my HQ got four extra (previously special chars) to hang out with my previous five (My SHp wen't to hang around with the extra scouts though...) and my VAS/HG stayed pretty much the same.

All in all, my biggest gripe is with the Elites slot. It went from four (4) to twelve (12)!!!

Ridicilous...

machine_recovered_meat
10-05-2007, 10:32
Tis an odd one...

I've gone from

8HQ, 8 elites, 8 troops, 6 fast attack, 9 heavy support

to...

8HQ, 12 elites, 10 troops, 3 fast attack, 7 heavy support.

Since half the trick in picking an army is the 'what do I want? what do I need? what can I afford?' conundrum, there'll be a lot of competition for elites slots. Should be interesting.

SanguinaryDan
10-05-2007, 14:40
My biggest problems have been in the Elites category. I've gone from fielding 0-1 Elites to 3 Elites. To fill those slots I've got so many choices it's annoying.

I really don't like the Elite Scouts bit. It's not like I was a 5 Scouts with naked Vet Sgt player, but I did like having one 10 man or two 5 man units of them in my list.

So at this point I've got 9 HQ +2 HG units, 15 Elite(8 Dreads, 2 Termies, 3 Scouts, 2 VAS) + Death Company, 8 Troops(5 Tac, 3 Assault), 8 Fast Attack(2 MM/HF, 1 HB/AC, 1 HB/TRL, 3 MM bikes, 5 Bikes), 13 Hvy Support(2 Devs, 2 Baal, 2 Destructor, 1 Annihilator, 2 Vindicators, 2 Whirlwinds, 1 LR, 1 LRC).

Karhedron
10-05-2007, 15:03
I agree with the comment about Scouts, I have a couple of units that I am not certain will be used again. :eyebrows:

The introduction of combat squads and the transferal of Assault Squads to the Troops section raises some interesting possibilities. I can easily see BAs with no Tactical squads at all. Infantry will consist of Devastator squads with heavy weapons in one squad and bolters in the other. The bolter squads will fulfil the role of Tactical squads while the Assault squads will fill up the Troop choices.