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Jasper77
20-05-2007, 11:33
Hey ya,

After a long hiatus from WHFB I decided to jump back into it a give an O & G army a try. Just because I love the new models and have a soft spot for the greenskins.

I want the list to be as competitive as possible but without taking away the fun from the game.

My list might suck so prepare yourself. If your and experienced O & G general or not please offer as much constructive criticism as possible. Here goes!

Black Orc Big Boss - Heavy armour, shield, Ulag's Akrit Axe - 116

Lvl 2 Night Goblin Shamen - Dispel Scroll - 110

28 Night Goblins - Netters, Spears, Full Command and 2 Fanatics, Horn of Urgok - 257

20 Night Goblins - Full Command, Bows - 80

19 Black Orcs - Shields, musician, standard - 284

10 Goblin Spider Riders - Spears, Shields, Full Command - 160

Total 1007

Any advice would be most welcome.

Cheers

Falkman
20-05-2007, 11:45
Some stuff to say about this list then:

You might consider mounting your Black orc big boss on a boar to increase his save.

Night goblins can't take magical items, so they'd have to drop the horn.

Seeing as Spider riders don't get rank bonuses, I think a unit of 10 is very big, perhaps take two units of 5 instead?

Other than that it looks pretty decent, I'd add in some shooting in the form of two Spear chukkas or a Rock lobber, but that's just because I like my armies to be active in all of the phases of the game.

Xarius
04-07-2008, 13:59
i'd go with 2 units of 5 spider riders with no comands, give them short bows though, they are good for support and harassing flanks. I'd also trade the gobbo shaman's dispell scroll for 2 magic mushrooms. also to save points dont bother with a full command for your gobbo archers, maybe just a banner.

Gobbo Lord
04-07-2008, 16:52
20 black orcs is too many in my opinion. But the list is fine (other than the night goblins taking the Horn of Urgok, only characters can take magic items).

You should play a few games and understand the games mechanics before you start asking for advice on how good your list is. Having a competative list comes with understanding how the game works in relation to your army.

Also 1007 points is over by too much considering your cheapest troops are 3 points each, you could drop two bow armed night goblins and it would make it 1001 points. which is more likely to be accepted by your opponents. Theres nothing more annoying than someone saying their over the points limit by more points than their cheapest troops, theres no excuse.

invinciblebug
04-07-2008, 22:20
give the black orc big boss a boar, boar is very good on orc caracters as it ads a very nice +2 save and another str 5 attack. split your spider riders in 2 units with one musican each as two units of 5 is better in almost every situation then one unit of 10. Drop the horn of urgok on your night gobbos (as they cant have it). Drop the full commmand on your 20 man night gobbo unit and give them only musican as they are only a supporting unit that will often flee and get killed, the standard and champion are just a waste of points. drop your shamans level to 1 he wont do much anyway, go all magic defense with dispel scrolls.

Drop a blorc and make them 18 blorcs and deploy them six wide to maximise their killing power, you might want to give them a magic standard to.

And you CANT have a orc army without orc boys, their essential you should have two units thats 25ish strong, shields and choppas or two choppas is good, spears is not.

Actualy you should drop the blorcs and spend all the saved up points from the blorcs and the changes mentioned above to buy orc boys. Their the best unit in the army.

Some spear chukkas is also very good and you would want a couple of them.

And please remember to never make a orc force without orc boys;).

Gobbo Lord
05-07-2008, 00:42
And you CANT have a orc army without orc boys, their essential you should have two units thats 25ish strong

What rubbish, the op is a new player. He is not after the most effective tournament combination of greenskins. Maybe he doesnt have two units of Orc Boyz, it looks like he has the skull pass set and some extras. You arn't commenting on his list helping him to tweak it or pointing out what is wrong with it, you are changing it entirely with phrases like this and reinforcing in this new players head that Orcs and Goblins wont work with out Orc Boyz.


Actualy you should drop the blorcs and spend all the saved up points from the blorcs and the changes mentioned above to buy orc boys. Their the best unit in the army.

Again reinforcing that Orcs and Goblins cant be played without Orc Boyz.


Some spear chukkas is also very good and you would want a couple of them.

Again is this new player going to have acess to all of this or would your time be better spent helping him with the list he has given rather than writing your own.


drop your shamans level to 1 he wont do much anyway, go all magic defense with dispel scrolls.

You are trying to guide this new player to the established "tournament build" for the army. Orcs, Spear Chukkas, magic defense caddy. They dont know how the game works yet, let them discover the army by themselves, i might point you in the direction of this thread for a read on army advice. I asked if people lacked imagination asking for certain army builds but it was decided that the problem was posters steering everyone in the same direction for each army, same vampire combos, same orc units, same demon armies etc.

http://warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150227

Conotor
05-07-2008, 03:19
Black orcs suck. Drop them 4 normal ones, a unit of 24, and 5 wolf riders.

Split up your spiders.

add a few fanatics.

Put your boss on a boar.

Baduk 'Eadsplitta
05-07-2008, 07:15
magial weapons arent always needed coz blorc characters have the armed to da teef rule

Gobbo Lord
05-07-2008, 09:35
Black orcs suck. Drop them 4 normal ones, a unit of 24, and 5 wolf riders.

Haha, I give up, i really do. A NEW player posts a list. Probably brought himself some black orcs along with the skull pass set and some other things. Rather than help him with how to use his black orcs you post the above

Hey why doesnt every Orc and Goblin player take 3 units of 23 orc boyz, Two lots of 5 wolf riders, 2 spear chukkas, a boar chariot, black orc characters on boars, and a scroll caddy. Thatd be fun. every greenskin army you ever face being the exact same one.

I remember once i posted that i was having problems ranking up my black orcs and how people fit the musician in. The first reply was "black orcs suck get normal boyz instead". I swear some people are making it their mission to make everybody use the same build as everyone else.

Help them with what theyve posted, dont rewrite the list.

Edit: Just checked up Conotor, it was you who posted that black orcks suck on my thread enquiring about ranking them up. If they have the models and want to use them leave them be. They dont suck. They dont flee when normal boyz do, they dont suffer from animosity, they are stronger than normal boyz, they have a psychological effect on the opponent. Some people can use multiple things to make their lists varied and interesting, different from the next players. Please stop spreading your cut and paste army building ethics around.

Arguleon-veq
05-07-2008, 11:46
Welcome back to Fantasy!

I love the Black Orc models and was determined to use them no matter what, I tried your build for them for many games and they just didn't work. Here is a nice combo for them;

12; Full Command + Nogs Banner of Butchery. 2 x 6

That set up is working great for me, I love the Boss of the unit too, he can even kill Vampires. 4 S5 Attacks. In my last game he took out an Elven Archmage.

Now on to your list;

Black Orc Big Boss;

Great choice, I would give him kickin boots though, this way you get 5 S5 attacks in the first round and 5 S4 afterwards. Its very effective. His toughness provides good protection.

Night Gob Shaman;

Another nice choice. I would either give him the Staff of Stealin [for some great magic defense] or if you want a more balanced approach go with the Staff of Sorcery and the Itty Ring. This ups both your magic defense and offense.

28 Night Gobs;

This set up is fine although I would drop the Nets.

20 Night Gobs;

Set up is fine here too, Id get a Fanatic here though if you drop the Nets on the combat unit. Or if you have points left from cutting Black Orcs down to my suggestion.

Spider Riders;

Go for 2 Units of 5 each with Musician.

Hope that helps, its should give you a very nice balanced list with decent numbers, combat potential and magic defense and offense.