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corben_da
10-08-2005, 10:00
Hi

We have been thinking about the combination of following items:

Grown of Everlasting Conquest (regenration)
with
Pendant of Slaanesh (every wound that character loses he gains 1 attack for remain of the game)

so if the character loses 2 wounds in he will get +2 attacks
and if he regenrates one of them, will he lose one of gained attacks
or will the character get those +2 attacks and lost wound?

Everence
10-08-2005, 11:38
Wow, this seems a little complicated. I'd say that they would get those two attacks. Others would obviously argue that they negate the extra attack once you get your wound back.

Please people, help him out.

T10
10-08-2005, 11:51
The pendant has no provisions for wounds that are restored to the user through regeration or otherwise.

It appears that the increase in attacks is retained even as wounds are restored.

-T10

Baindread
11-08-2005, 15:45
The pendant says that you gain an extra attack when you suffer a wound after saves, etc.


Does that include regeneration?

Mad Doc Grotsnik
11-08-2005, 15:56
Regeneration essentially prevents the wound from being caused, as they do not count towards Combat Res.

However, combine it with the Blade of Blood, and your laughing! You see, Pendant means you gain an attack for every wound. The Blade of Blood restores a wound for everyone caused, following a successful S test, up to double your starting number. If you fail, you take a wound. Which gives you an attack. Potentially suicidal, but other wise bloody funny. Especially if you engage a swarm to boost yourself!

corben_da
11-08-2005, 17:26
yeah, i was thinking about that CR thing,because regeneration gives it back in that moment and it's the same wound that you lost..
blade of blood would do nice with pendant ;)

Flame
11-08-2005, 21:28
But it doesn't give you it back at that moment, its at the end of the combat phase when you roll for it (before CR is generated of course, but after all attacks)

corben_da
11-08-2005, 22:11
yeah. when i posted this question i was pretty sure of the answer, i just had to
check what other people think :)
thanks for answers, there are allways these things that makes us wonder sometimes.

T10
12-08-2005, 07:22
The pendant says that you gain an extra attack when you suffer a wound after saves, etc.


Does that include regeneration?

It might seem that Regeneration is a part of that whole save package, but in practise it doesn't really work. Regeneration kicks in after all attacks have been resolved.

It is conceivable that the character with the pendant loses a wound before he has made his own attacks that turn, thus making him eligible for a bonus attack before he is even allowed to make his regeneration roll. I am sure you see the paradox involved.

-T10

corben_da
12-08-2005, 08:39
couldn't say any better my self :D

athamas
12-08-2005, 08:43
but regeneration is a save or sorts... there is a nasty dwarf somewhere with something like a 1+save followed by 4+ ward followed by 4+ regen...

acctully apon reading the description, its every time he feels pain... thus the wound would hurt him, but be healed...so i think he would get the attacks!

Neknoh
12-08-2005, 09:02
I have to say you get to keep the attacks, since it works like this:

Your enemy strikes
Hits
Causes wounds
You take your saves
You gain attacks for wounds lost

You MIGHT strike back (not if you're dead)
You then hit, wound and your opponent takes saves

You then regenerate the wounds
Then count Combat Resolution.


So, did he suffer the wounds without saving them (using Ward and/or Armour saves), yes, the Pendant says "After saves etc.", so, yes, he keeps the attacks, just like Trolls that regenerate wounds caused by Morghur.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
12-08-2005, 17:33
Regeneration prevents the wound being taken though, like a sort of Super-Ward save.

Thus, you wouldn't get any benefit from having suffered the wound, as you didn't.

athamas
12-08-2005, 17:37
yes but at the same time, the character was hit.. and indured.. and thus felt pain.. and thus gains an attack... the fact that the wound then healed is irrelivent!

corben_da
13-08-2005, 09:36
this is really tricky question indeed, everyone has their own opinion and thats good! :)
I hope that the character would receive that attack, but i fear that in some
FAQ there is explanation for this, might send this to WD because there is
that questions and answers slot at the end of the magazine :D

Neknoh
13-08-2005, 09:40
Regeneration prevents the wound being taken though, like a sort of Super-Ward save.

Thus, you wouldn't get any benefit from having suffered the wound, as you didn't.

Um... if enough wounds are taken, said character dies before the combat is over

But, he might stand back up, note though, that he still dies

corben_da
13-08-2005, 09:47
in rulebook it says that regeneration comes after the combat is over before CR, so that means that the character gets those attacks, because he has lost them
and is just healing after combat, pendant says that character gains wound
after saves etc. and that means like, after normal save and ward, regeneration isn't save or super ward, it's just Regeneration :D

corben_da
13-08-2005, 09:48
why should pendant care if it's same wound that the character gains after combat.. it could be healing spell or regeneration, the pendant doesent care ;)

Screamin Daemon
13-08-2005, 15:41
All these in depth answers really clearify alot of the picky details of regeneration, but I think the answer is alot more simple. If you regenerate a wound after it had been caused, then you do not get your extra attack. I understand your argument about regeneration being done after combat is done, but if you save the wound, then I don't think you should get the extra attack. Otherwise, you throw those two items in with the blade and blood, and this character will have ten wounds and ten attacks in turn 3....mean. And I like it :)!

Atrahasis
13-08-2005, 17:28
Regeneration kicks in after a wound has been suffered, the Pendant kicks in after a wound has been suffered.

Regeneration has a delay (happens at end of phase), the Pendant does not. Hence the Pendant kicks in (giving +1 attack per wound) before regeneration.

Cheesejoff
13-08-2005, 19:10
I agree, the wound is suffered regardless of whether it is healed by regen. afterwards.

corben_da
14-08-2005, 10:52
yep. because regeneration is not a Saving throw... it "acts" pretty much in a same way, but really it's slower than armour save or ward save.
regeneration has it's benefits and losses:
benefit: you have 4+ change on getting wounds back (better than 5+ ward)
your lost wounds that are regenerated doesen't count on CR, so you can
win still win because you might not have lost any wounds for CR.

Losses:
if your character/anything troll etc. dies to blows that it receives it
doesen't get change to hit back in that phase, it will regenate after
combat phase is over both sides and before CR.

My point hasn't been that character would get attacks RIGHT THE WAY
at the combat, but for next combat phase it will have more attacks..
if it regenerated them

oh its getting so complicated to explain my thoughts :D

corben_da
14-08-2005, 10:59
I have been thinking about making a character like this for my chaos army
so that's why i'm asking about this regeneration thing ;)

Chaos Lord: 704pts
- Rides Chaos Dragon
- Mark of Slaanesh, Grown of Everlasting Conquest, Pendant of Slaanesh,
Great Weapon, Armour of Damnation, Shield (against shootin better save)

PelsBoble
14-08-2005, 11:07
Well a ward save is really to prefer on a dragon rider. So i guess i would exchange the AoD for the Gaze

corben_da
14-08-2005, 11:18
it's a lot more better on a dragon rider, yep. but Gaze is used and cannot
have 2 talismans on one character :( yet if the regenration
doesent work with pendant then i will exchange it to gaze!