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Krud
03-06-2007, 15:51
Hey folks, let me know what you think of this DoW list I might build:

Mercenary Lord 133
En Shield
Warhorse
Lance
Barding
Heavy Armor

Paymaster 81
Sword of Might
Heavy armor
Shield

Hireling Wizard 110
2x dispel

Voland’s Venators 195
5 Light Cavalry, spear, shield 70
5 Light Cavalry, spear, shield 70
5 Heavy Cavalry, barding, std 120
15 Pikemen, ha, std 175
15 Pikemen, ha, std 175
9 Duelists, musician 55
9 Duelists, musician 55
10 Crossbowmen 80


4 Ironguts, std 212
3 Maneaters, GW's, HA 270
Fightin’ Cocks (10 models) 118
Oglah Khan’s Wolfboyz 190

Cannon 85
Hot Pot 50

2244 pts TOTAL

All in all, this list feels pretty versatile. I have 5 units of cavalry (3 fast, 2 heavy) that are there to flank and put pressure on my oponent. The pikemen, crossbows and artillery are my main core blocks, and the ogres are my two big hammer units. The duelists are there to hold the pikemen's flanks and the cocks provide support shooting whever necessary. What do you all think?

Bloodknight
03-06-2007, 16:02
I think the pikemen blocks are too small, but the general setup is a good one and very versatile. I could err about the pikemen, but personally I never play less than 25 per unit and never considered smaller units. I might have to try that myself.

I wonder however where all the DoW players come from in the last time - is it the new veteran´s fad? ;)

Krud
03-06-2007, 16:27
I can see why huge blocks of pikemen would work well, and 15 admittedly doesn't take complete advantage of the fight in four ranks rule, but I figure the pikemen should have enough support from the many other units, where I won'd have to worry about them winning combat on their own. I will consider larger units, but right now I'm not convinced spending another 100 points on each unit to make them 25 strong is very efficient. I am used to playing as Ogres, so MSU has always been more of my thing anyway so I could be wrong.

Bloodknight
03-06-2007, 16:33
Actually I think 15 does take complete advantage because with larger units I am personally often reluctant of charging because of the "lost" 4th rank. I think smaller units may promote a more aggressive style. As I said, I´ll try it myself.

Krud
05-06-2007, 03:13
I guess my thoughts are that my opponent will have plenty of other things to shoot at as well, so I won't have to worry about their numbers dwindling too much more. If they are concentrating on the pikemen, then they are ignoring my ogres and heavy cav, which I think poses a lot more of a threat.

I think their main role is to supply a point or two of combat res and distract a unit enough to allow one of my hammers to flank charge. However, I've still had other people tell me that 15 pikemen is still a waste, and they should ALWAYS be taken in 25. Does anyone else have thoughts on this matter?

Inkosi
06-06-2007, 10:43
15 pikes...

Recipe for Doom.

pikes to be aggresive, an even GREATER recipe for doom.

ya, fight in four ranks, +1 str against cav, sounds pretty impressive eh.

crap. i have proxy them against quite a few armies.

if you think they are going to deal enough wounds to win you the combat, think again. look at their ws and str. 4 ranks might not win u the combat, lets not even talk about the 3 ranks you re going to have.

sorry, IMHO, its not going to work. furthermore, pikes are infantry, and they are very weak in their flanks , if you re going to support them,your whole army would be slowed down by them.

their best option is still in numbers and used as an anchor for your lines.

Krud
06-06-2007, 13:55
15 pikes...

Recipe for Doom.

pikes to be aggresive, an even GREATER recipe for doom.

ya, fight in four ranks, +1 str against cav, sounds pretty impressive eh.

crap. i have proxy them against quite a few armies.

if you think they are going to deal enough wounds to win you the combat, think again. look at their ws and str. 4 ranks might not win u the combat, lets not even talk about the 3 ranks you re going to have.

sorry, IMHO, its not going to work. furthermore, pikes are infantry, and they are very weak in their flanks , if you re going to support them,your whole army would be slowed down by them.

their best option is still in numbers and used as an anchor for your lines.

I actually have been changing up the list a bit to increase the number of pikes, but before I post that let me address the rest of your post.

Admittedly, I have not used pikemen, nor have I seen them used; so this is pure theory hammer. I don't think supporting the pikemen is going to slow down the rest of my army too much. If I play in a deny flank set-up, and attack one side of the board aggressively with all of my cavalry, I don't have to worry about the other side keeping up.

Alternatively, I could march the pikes right up the middle of the board, and just keep the duellists on the flanks (and possible on other unit back) while may cav and ogres hit both my enemy's flanks; essentially creating a bullhorn-like attack. I think I will probably use this type of tactic if I do increase the size of my pike blocks. Here is a revised list I am thinking about. I dropped Oglah Khan's Wolfboyz, and a unit of duellists.

Thoughts? I felt that getting rid of the wolfboyz was a good move, as having a standard and FC on a unit that isn't very fighty might not be the best idea. I dropped one unit of duelists because I already had the fighting cocks, and I felt two units would be enough.

Mercenary Lord 133
En Shield
Warhorse
Lance
Barding
Heavy Armor

Paymaster 81
Sword of Might
Heavy armor
Shield

Hireling Wizard 110
2x dispel

Voland’s Venators 195
5 Light Cavalry, spear, shield 70
5 Light Cavalry, spear, shield 70
5 Heavy Cavalry, barding, std 120
25 Pikemen, Heavy armor, FC 305
20 Ricco's Republican Guard 300
10 Duellists 50
10 Crossbowmen 80

4 Ironguts, std 212
3 Maneaters, GW's, HA 270
Fightin’ Cocks (10 models) 118

Cannon 85
Hot Pot 50

2249 pts TOTAL

Jericho
07-06-2007, 07:36
My experience with DOW (playing on and off since end of 5th edition):

Ricco's are totally worth it. Ricco adds killing power, and WS4 will keep you alive longer. Regular pikes are a bigger psychological weapon than anything, they won't stand up to heavy cavalry or most armies' elite troops. Ogres will rock you since they are T4, have lots of S4 attacks and you don't get the +1S because they're not "monsters" per se. If the other guy packs a hero you're pretty screwed most of the time as well. Realistically the only things they can take on without help is basic infantry and other weak stuff like missile troops and whatnot. I still love pikes though, because even if they aren't as good as they look on paper they scare some opponents into doing stupid things.

If you're gonna take them take 20+ like in the revised list, I never have enough (never painted enough of them and they're getting harder and harder to get your hands on). Also be sure to give them adequate support from Skirmishers or Cav.

Fighting Cocks are a huge waste of points I think... BS4 but with T2 and bows. Back in the day they were all BS5 and useful... not so much anymore. If you want elite missile troops stick to Manflayers (devastating if your opponent can't magic missile them to death) or if you're feeling very generous then Marksmen of Miragliano.

The list looks pretty good overall, my old list is way more static and defensive (read: boring) but most of that is because I'm too lazy/cheap to buy and paint new units for the army. That's being fixed since I am finally painting my Goblin Hewer and finally bought some Ogres... might even snag some more units off eBay if the right deal comes along. Assuming you can get your hands on some decent Norse Marauder type models with flails, do it. I'm currently trying to raise a regiment for less than a few hundred bucks worth of bitz orders... they're pretty nasty in game for 8 pts each.

shady
07-06-2007, 09:59
I wonder however where all the DoW players come from in the last time - is it the new veteran´s fad? ;)

Don't know about others, but:

I've got a bunch of Foundry Landsknechts I've been painting up for historicals, and while they're not quite there in terms of numbers am planning to use for DoW, supplemented with RoR.

The RoR models are so nice that I think people tend to build up a collection of them anyhow, which can be used as the core of a DoW army.

Krud
07-06-2007, 11:48
My experience with DOW (playing on and off since end of 5th edition):
Fighting Cocks are a huge waste of points I think... BS4 but with T2 and bows. Back in the day they were all BS5 and useful... not so much anymore. If you want elite missile troops stick to Manflayers (devastating if your opponent can't magic missile them to death) or if you're feeling very generous then Marksmen of Miragliano.

Where can I find the manflayers' rules? Also, are they only available for trade or sale elsewhere? I can't find them on the GW store site.

Luna de hierro
07-06-2007, 12:18
Where can I find the manflayers' rules? Also, are they only available for trade or sale elsewhere? I can't find them on the GW store site.


you can find them in gw dogs of war homepage

http://uk.games-workshop.com/dogsofwar/manflayers/1/





4 Ironguts, std 212
3 Maneaters, GW's, HA 270
Fightin’ Cocks (10 models) 118
Oglah Khan’s Wolfboyz 190



Aren´t ironguts and maneaters a rare choice in a DoW army???

Krud
07-06-2007, 14:06
Nope, per the Ogre Kingdom army book, they are both special choices. Pretty good deal, huh? ;)

Luna de hierro
07-06-2007, 14:21
Nope, per the Ogre Kingdom army book, they are both special choices. Pretty good deal, huh? ;)



:eek:


Damn right!!!! Din´t see that till now.... :p