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Flightleader
09-06-2007, 11:52
I was at the Sydney Battle bunker the other day and I met someone who played necromunda. I've heard of the game before but did not know much beyond the fact that it was a game between gangs. After talking and visting the specialist games site I was hooked.

but now i'm confused!

I'm trying to make up a Van Saar gang out of Elysian drop troops (I didn't like the offical models and thought these would fit better with their "hightech" well equiped status).

ok so where's the confusion? basically beyond weapons costs and base costs of the models...how do I add armour and stuff? are these things only available to you as you progress through a campaign? What does that mean for a new player? can I still play or do I need to find another group of new players and start a campaign? can I play pick up games to get a hang of the rules? and if so how?

sorry I realise this is all muddled but not having a background in this kind of game play I would like to get it right!

Thanks in advance for your help.

Serge M.

Major_Gilbear
09-06-2007, 12:46
how do I add armour and stuff? are these things only available to you as you progress through a campaign? What does that mean for a new player? can I still play or do I need to find another group of new players and start a campaign? can I play pick up games to get a hang of the rules? and if so how?
You can only buy weapons and fighters when you recruit your gang. Equipment, armour and other goodies have to be rolled up and bought after each game in the post-battle sequence, at the Trading Post.

Essentially, after each game, you have some book keeping:

> Roll for your seriously injured fighters to see what injuries they've suffered
> Roll for experience to see who gets advances
> Roll for any advances you might get to see what new skills your fighters have picked up.
> Determine which fighters will be collecting income from your territories and check against the Income Table to see how much money you get.
> Determine who (if anybody) is going to the trading post, and roll to see how many items they are offered.
> For each item offered at the Trading post, roll to see what you're offered.
> Buy any items that you're offered that you want and can afford.
> Buy new guns/swap around your gang's equipment as you wish (subject to usual rules, eg: only heavies can use a heavy weapon etc).

If you join a campaign late, your gang will be less experienced than others', so you will get an underdog bonus to your experience for each game you play (whether you win or lose you get a bonus). The fights will be tough, but the extra experience allows you to level up faster. Very tough gangs are going to be a struggle to fight against anyway, so try and choose either fairer match-ups, or pick scenarios that would favour your gang.

You can play pickup games easily; either join a campaign and play games as you go along, or have you and your opponent select a gang to 1000 credits and have a one-off fight (kind alike you would with 40k). The difference is that with the latter, you won't be going through the post-battle sequence, so you won't be gaining any experience, skills, equipment, etc (again, like a 40k fight).

Needless to say, playing the same gang and advancing it over the course of a campaign is part of what makes Necromunda so appealing to play!

Flightleader
09-06-2007, 12:59
Thanks!

although this campaigning idea is very new to me. Do you start over every campaign or is your gang constantly on campaign? So could I use the same gang in every game I play or every campaign I join?

Also why can't Van Saars have Missile launchers (ML)? aren't they meant to be a shooty gang? (sorry silly question but the elysian ML is just too cool)

Edit: My list:
Leader: Plasma Pistol, Chainsword, Frag Grens

Ganger: Lasgun, Laspistol, Frag grens
Ganger: Lasgun, Laspistol, Frag grens
Ganger: Lasgun, Laspistol, Frag grens
Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers, frag grens
Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers, frag grens

Heavie: Plasmagun, Lasgun, knife

Juvie: Stub Gun
Juvie: Stub Gun

What do you think?

Thanks again.

Serge M.

Tomothy
09-06-2007, 13:47
Thanks!

although this campaigning idea is very new to me. Do you start over every campaign or is your gang constantly on campaign? So could I use the same gang in every game I play or every campaign I join?
It depends, you can keep the gang and use it in the next campaign, but usually at the end of the campaign you either want to try something new or your gang has reached the point where you should try something new.


Also why can't Van Saars have Missile launchers (ML)? aren't they meant to be a shooty gang? (sorry silly question but the elysian ML is just too cool)
Originally there were no house weapons lists, all the gangs had access to all the common weapons (note: not items, just weapons). That changed, everyone has their own opinion on the house weapons lists, but they are what they are and it has come down from on high that they're not going away.


Edit: My list:
Leader: Plasma Pistol, Chainsword, Frag Grens

Ganger: Lasgun, Laspistol, Frag grens
Ganger: Lasgun, Laspistol, Frag grens
Ganger: Lasgun, Laspistol, Frag grens
Its interesting, you've given your guys a lot of frag grens which really cuts down your other options. They're not as necessary as in 4th ed 40k because they don't function the same way. Considering the usual tactic is to split your gang into groups of "fire teams" you really only need one set per team, especially as they have very specific uses and, if its known you have them, the enemy can usually counter their viability by simply not deploying as closely together as he might otherwise. Also, the usual reason to give someone a second gun is as back-up if there's a good chance they'll run out of ammo, in necro lasguns are the most reliable, cost efficient weapon. There's not really a need to give them all back up weapons, in fact the shotgun guys are more likely to need the backup weapons because when they run out of ammo the gun can't be used because its jammed or stuffed somehow as well, so the extra ammo is just useful for different situations. Or on the juves because while the stub guns look cool, rule wise they're really not cool.


Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers, frag grens
Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers, frag grens
You've only got 5 gangers, which means you're probably going to be struggling to work all 5 of the territories you roll up. If you drop some (or most) of the frag grenades you'll easily be able to afford another couple of gangers, putting you outside of a quick bottle range and safer on the territory front.


Heavie: Plasmagun, Lasgun, knife
A good set up, the lasgun can be used for where you need 6's to hit or when the plasmagun is recharging.


Juvie: Stub Gun
Juvie: Stub Gun
Rather than stub guns autopistol is usually the favourite pistol to give juves as it maximises the to hit bonuses while minimising the penalties. For only 5 creds more your juves will be much more likely to hit.

Flightleader
09-06-2007, 14:13
I can see what you mean, I did go overboard with the grens and pistols. I've changed my list:

Leader: Plasma Pistol, Chainsword

Ganger: Lasgun, frag grens
Ganger: Lasgun
Ganger: Lasgun
Ganger: Lasgun

Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers, frag grens
Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers
Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers

Heavie: Plasmagun, Lasgun

Juvie: autopistol, knife
Juvie: autopistol, knife


I now have 7 gangers, I could drop the frag grens altogether and get another ganger... just not sure how effective the frag grens are. Maybe give the frag grens to the Juvies?

What do you think?

Cheers :)

Serge M.

Fire Mountain
09-06-2007, 17:08
Don't drop anymore of the Frags. 2-3 usually works fine. And 7 Gangers is plenty.

I would like to see alot less Lasguns though...

That amount of Lasguns will just make the game dull for people playing a more CC oriented gang, and will in effect make them game less fun for everyone as the opposing player might get a bit grumpy.
(If you are only playing people doing gangs that are similar to yours, then ignore. Have fun with the Overwatch Game)

I would say that it would be alot more interesting if you made one of the Lasgunners into a Shotgunner. I think that 4 Lasguns in a gang is a bit OTP ^^.

Shotguns makes the game alot more personal (that or a picture of your own face straped over one of your gangers :rolleyes: )

Major_Gilbear
09-06-2007, 17:41
@Flightleader:
Listen to Tomothy, for he is wise! :p. Seriously though, his points are all good ones, especially about the frag grenades and number of members in your gang.

I know you're using the Elysians, and that you are therefore limited in what you can arm them with; I'd be okay with four lasguns in an 11-man gang (5 if you count the heavy).

Rather than more shotguns though (you have lots!), maybe try and swap one of the lasguns out for a Boltgun, or even for a pistol & CC weapon? Van Saar get combat skills too, and you're bound to get CC advances on some of your gang sooner or later. Besides, the conversions would be very minor.

If you want to make your gangers a bit more individual in their armaments, you could either order a couple of Weapon sprues (like this (http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=9947059913709&orignav=300808))or try getting a pack of the FW Militia weapons (mmm, autoguns!).

Personally, I would go for the varied weapon approach, but that's just me. I find it easier to remember who's who when they are all armed differently (especially as wounding hits give experience points; you need to know who took the shot!).

On a different note, I was wondering if you would consider dropping the frags altogether and upgrading one of the juves to a second heavy with another special weapon? Or perhaps dropping another set of frags and hiring a Ratskin scout?

Chimpeh
09-06-2007, 18:49
I know I keep mentioning the FW Chaos renegade militia sprue (http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/chaosmilup.htm) but it is great for extra weapons that regular Imperial Guard units don't come with. You could quite easily remove the autoguns from the renegade arms and replace Elysian lasguns for them. Might help to add a little variety to your gang.

Tomothy
10-06-2007, 01:59
@Flightleader:
Listen to Tomothy, for he is wise! :p. Seriously though, his points are all good ones, especially about the frag grenades and number of members in your gang.
Thanks :)


I know you're using the Elysians, and that you are therefore limited in what you can arm them with; I'd be okay with four lasguns in an 11-man gang (5 if you count the heavy).
Yeah, especially if you're playing wysiwyg, i would be fine with this also.


Rather than more shotguns though (you have lots!), maybe try and swap one of the lasguns out for a Boltgun, or even for a pistol & CC weapon? Van Saar get combat skills too, and you're bound to get CC advances on some of your gang sooner or later. Besides, the conversions would be very minor.
Unfortunately under HWL (which Flightleader is playing) they don't get boltguns and the only hth weapon are mauls/clubs. My suggestion is to swap a lasgun and use those extra 10 creds i calculate you have for a boltpistol and an autopistol. Boltpistol for easy hitting and wounding, autopistol as back-up and for the 6's to hit situations. Gives a str 4 hth weapon and 2 attacks in cc. Then you've got two close assault teams. 1st = leader, juve and shotgun backup. 2nd = ganger (pistols), juve and shotgun backup.


Personally, I would go for the varied weapon approach, but that's just me. I find it easier to remember who's who when they are all armed differently (especially as wounding hits give experience points; you need to know who took the shot!).
Yeah, i started playing when it first came out and i find it hard to keep track sometimes. Especially if you're just starting the game as well. Also varied weapons give you more versatility in situations.


On a different note, I was wondering if you would consider dropping the frags altogether and upgrading one of the juves to a second heavy with another special weapon? Or perhaps dropping another set of frags and hiring a Ratskin scout?
He'd need to drop a few more things than just the frags. A heavy with a flamer (i miss setting on fire) is 100 creds or a heavy with a plasma gun (nice weapon) is 130. A ratskin scout is a good idea, modifies scenario rolls and chance at getting extra territory. All that requires is changing one lasgun to an autogun and you have enough money. Or if you make the change i suggested earlier drop one set of frags, and you've got enough left over for that second pistol for your leader, auto or las.

EDIT: Also, frags are quite a short range item, which means they're fine on a shotgunner cause they need to close up, but on a lasgunner not so effective. I would switch them onto a juve. Spreads out value and can be quite a surprise factor, ppl don't expect juves to have an expensive item.

Catferret
10-06-2007, 02:30
I've seen a hideous gang with loads of Juves armed with nothing but Frags and Clubs. Cheap combat troops with explosives. The low BS is of little concern when the template can still kill stuff when it scatters.

The rest of the gang was a Leader and a few Gangers with Autoguns/Lasguns and a Heavy with Plasmagun.

Not something I fancied trying though with it's lack of variation.

Major_Gilbear
10-06-2007, 03:28
@Tomothy:

I know he'd need to do more than drop the frags, but dropping both sets is 60 creds straight up (a good start).

Fair point on the Boltgun (man, does it show I don't use the HWLs!). Good suggestion on the CC gangers I think.

@Catferret:

I've heard of such gangs, but never seen one personally. I would think that as grenades can scatter their full distance if they miss, that there would be a lot of self-inflicted casualties (especially with the new mahoosive pie-plates that grenades get). And BS2 is a recepie for missing a lot.

Catferret
10-06-2007, 03:30
Oh yeah, suicidal Juves are a common occurence but it makes it kinda fun! :D

Probably less suicidal than Juves with Stubbers and Dumdums though... :p

Flightleader
10-06-2007, 08:54
Ok thanks for the help guys!

Leader: Plasma Pistol, Chainsword

Ganger: Lasgun
Ganger: Lasgun
Ganger: Autogun
Ganger: Autogun, stub gun

Ganger: Bolt Pistol, Autopistol

Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers
Ganger: Shotgun, Manstoppers

Heavie: Plasmagun, Lasgun

Juvie: autopistol, frag grens
Juvie: autopistol, frag grens

ok i've made a few changes to the list, is it any better? I'm used to the whole standard issue nature of an armed force and was looking at playing an enforcers gang, but after reading that they aren't a very interesting list to play I thought I would make my own gang.

these guys are in fact going to be an explorator taskforce looking for STC designs in the long forgotten underhive. They are being financed and equiped by the Van Saar house hold. The idea is that other house catch wind of this and soon gangs are getting in on the search too!

well that's the back story of the gang, sort of. will write something up later.

Cheers

Serge M.