PDA

View Full Version : Seeking Opinions on 2000 pt Magic Heavy Skaven



themandudeperson
22-07-2007, 17:48
I've got a RTT coming up soon and I wanted to see what folks thought of my list and what changes where they would suggest. Sooooo.. without further to-do:

Lord/Hero:
General:Klawmunkast
255
Warplock Engineer with full kit (no pistol) with dispel scroll and storm daemon
135
Warplock Engineer with full kit(no pistol) with eye of the horned rat
110

Core:
1x30x Clanrats w/ warpfire thrower and full command
245
2x30x Clanrats w/ ratling gun and full command
460
2x5x Globadiers
100

Special:
1x4x Jezzails
80
1x5x Jezzails
100
1x2x Rat Ogres
100
1x10x Gutter Runner Tunnelers w/ poisoned hand weapons and black skaven
182

Rare:
4xLeadbelchers
230
Total: 1997

radbug
23-07-2007, 08:03
Is the general a grey seer? If so then you might consider giving him some items, warpstone charm, some ward save or warpscrolls.

Your gutter runners are to big, and your jezzails are to small. change the jezzails into one unit of nine, and split the gutter runners into two units of five.

Not to sure about the leadbelchers but try them and see how they work.

themandudeperson
24-07-2007, 03:04
Klawmunkast is a special character.. I know he's on army builder, I just have a hard time finding an actual profile for him from GW. He's pretty much a super warlock. He comes with the typcial warlock equipment along with a warpstone eye that works like a storm daemon and he is a "rodent genius" which allows all my warmachines to re-roll misfires. On top of that he can cast Warp Lightning with 3d6 on an +11. He definately has some destructive potential.
The funny thing about the tunnelers and the jezzails is I've been getting the exact opposite advice else where.. Use one big unit of tunnelers and split the jezzails up.. I see the reasons for either approach but I don't know which is better

gerrymander61
24-07-2007, 05:15
Question is is Klawmunkast legal in a RTT? He sounds awfully like Ikit Klaw, only like some german translation.

Jezzails are fine split up. I just always put mine together for fewer line of sight troubles. I'd split up that unit of gutter runners thou. A unit of 10 be able to take out any sort of lone wizard/artillery crew. Then again, so would units of 5, and they would allow you to hit 2 war machines with greater efficiency. Also, you'd have a backup incase one didn't show up.

Good idea with the lead belchers. Was considering it for mine but too many points so meh.

Drop the Rat Ogres; with leadbelchers, who needs them? Also, split up your globadiers into 3 units of 3, then with the points from that and the points from your rat ogres, you can buy some shiny units of... SLAVES! Always worth it, particularly since it's looking like you will be outnumbered with your low low unit count.

Splitting up the globadiers gives you some nice throwaway units as well, because you currently have none, and you're clanrats, although quite nice for 5 points apiece, won't be getting any awards for solid CC troops. Use the small units of globadiers as well as the slaves as throwaway units to draw charges or shield your clanrats. Not only will it possibly allow your clanrats to win combats now and then, but it is also very in character. And fun. Try it sometime ;)

Nickn
24-07-2007, 17:50
drop the rat ogres trade the whats his name special charecter for a grey seer believ it or not skaven have some kick ass spells other than warp lightning and you dont have any war machines split th new tunelers up with yer new special drop a lead belcher and take 2 units of slaves TRUST ME THER WORTH ITif you have any points left get some thing special

fubukii
24-07-2007, 18:36
no slaves? not enough guys meh drop the lead bleachers, and the rat ogres. add more units drop the weapons teams bc they arent worth their points

Zapstorm
24-07-2007, 18:40
Klawmunkast is part of the Skaven Civil War scenario on the GW site, so he won't be legal for a RTT :(

Because of that, I fully agree that the ogres should be dropped in favor of upgrading your lord to a Seer with some items (like the ones already mentioned, ie warpstone charm etc).

The other important thing is SLAVES! A skaven army needs to have numbers over its oppenents so you should put more bodies on the field. Another good screen/fodder unit is night runners, because since you'll have a Seer for your general your ld will suffer a little bit, so to prevent panic from shooting I would screen his unit.

Also either split up the gutter runner unit or slim it down (points for other things!).

If you need to pick up points anywhere else I recommend that you drop the champrats (their not worth it IMHO) and maybe the warpfire thrower. And I've never taken leadbelchers, so post and say how they faire, else if you playtest and find them not worth it, I would either field some monks (with some pcb's) or Storm Vermin for your Grey Seer's bodyguard.

Hope this helps!

Belerophon709
24-07-2007, 19:12
drop the rat ogres trade the whats his name special charecter for a grey seer believ it or not skaven have some kick ass spells other than warp lightning and you dont have any war machines split th new tunelers up with yer new special drop a lead belcher and take 2 units of slaves TRUST ME THER WORTH ITif you have any points left get some thing special

Someone translate this into english please?

fubukii
24-07-2007, 20:11
both storm vermin and Plague monks are not worth thier points (although PCB are) 9 pts for a 3+ save clanrat when you can ahve a slav and a clanrat instead for cheaper? Just remember skaven are about numbers Not elite troops so take plague monks and storm vermin Sparingly and only in big games.

themandudeperson
24-07-2007, 22:59
Well.. I've talked to the guy running the RTT and he says special characters are a go as long as GW came up with them and it's not something I've made up(in fact he was pressuring me to replace my leadbelchers with a warpstone rat tank). I need the Rat Ogres, if for no other reason than to hold off an Ogre army that I know will be there. With almost his entire army causing fear, it's going to suck being a skaven unless I have some units that aren't affected by it..

So far, either I've had some insane luck with the weapons teams or I'm just using them in terrific manner because most of the time, even when I lose they more than make their points back. They do get stand and shoot, so sometimes I bait units into charging my ratling guns and swiss cheese them on the way in. Who cares if the unit dies, as long as it killed more points worth of them than it cost me. The warpfire thrower is there mainly because I know there's going to be Wood Elves involved with a Treeman running amok. With the D3 damage and the 2x wounds because it's a flaming attack against a flammable creature, I could kill it outright if I'm lucky... At the very least, it will keep that Treeman away from that area of the table.

As far as splitting the Gutter Runners and merging the Jezzails.. you have a good point. But either way you do it, you put the larger unit at risk and everyone where I play tries to eliminate my jezzails early, although with 2 units of tunnelers I may have a better chance of knocking out their warmachines and archers first... will have to think on that one.

I'm still see-sawing on whether I want to split up the globadiers. On one hand 2-3 smaller units would mean I could get better coverage on the table with them, but with the smaller numbers comes the higher chance of them taking that nasty 25% casualties from shooting and with leadership 5, it's pretty certain they'll bugger off. I think I'll probably split them into two units of 5 and use them to support whatever units have to square up against my opponent's "big nasties"

I really don't have the time, money or desire to put together and field large numbers of slaves.. at most I may be able to make 30 slaves, which I think will pretty much be pissing in the wind.. And if I'm not mistaken, if archers (or other missile-firing unit) are on high ground they can see past any units you try to use as a missile screen, so it would be kind of useless in that scenario, wouldn't it?

I do have to disagree about the Plague Monks not being worth their costs. With an extra hand weapon they're 8 pts a peice and you have a unit that can charge ogres or dryads or other scary things without worrying about them failing to charge due to fear, only to be charged the next turn. And due to the fact that they're frenzied they're immune to psychology so they never break from shooting casualties. With their additional attacks, they stand a better chance of bringing down nastier foes than plain ol' clanrats. And if they don't, their extra toughness helps them survive until the next turn.

nieto666
26-07-2007, 18:47
besides little do the people on this forum know how often youve played me with your skaven:) the good news is the heavy magic works great and the shooting is also very good seeing how almost all your kills came from magic against my new dwarf list:) also u failed to mention that whats his name isnt legal for rtt. i banned a all demon list for a reson so i also have to bane your special dude sorry man :)

themandudeperson
26-07-2007, 21:06
eh.. I didn't know until Zapstorm said so and I never knew there were any solid "this is legal, this isn't legal" rules for an RTT like this.

Anyways.. before I go getting my hopes up else where, is there anything against the skaven clan specific lists? If not, I may go with clan skryre and replace klawmunkast with a master warlock engineer. He's pretty much the same thing, he can cast the 3d6 warplightning but doesn't have the spellbound 1d6 warplightning eye that klawmunkast does. To field him I'd have to merge my tunnelers, and drop either my rat ogres or leadbelchers (probably the rats), but I can use the extra points to field a warplightning cannon which is a special in the clan skryre list.

nieto666
27-07-2007, 05:35
dude ive told u how to go about this thing many times......u remind me of my son who just cant decide what toy truck he wants!!! play your magic heavy list with a grey seer against my woodies get some practice in hell ill even let u beat up on my O&G or dwarfs again if u like.

fubukii
27-07-2007, 05:38
the list in the back of the book is a appendix lists and can not be used unless your enemy agrees to it

themandudeperson
27-07-2007, 11:36
I know that I can find "official" references to two of the other skaven clan lists on Games Workshop's web site and both have the following entry:

Is This List Official?
This list is legal for the 2007 Grand Tournament and Games Day Tournament Season. If you wish to use this list in Rogue Trader or other Tournaments, we recommend you check with the tournament organizers first. Tournament legality aside, these rules are fun, and we hope players enjoy using them in friendly games.

I would assume that means all of the clan specific lists are ok, but I'm going sheerly on what army builder is telling me about the list. As far as the grey seer goes Lloyd, this is what I want for my list- the grey seer is just a fall back if I can't have this.

nieto666
27-07-2007, 16:16
sure u can use one of the specific clans:) now my question is which one???

themandudeperson
29-07-2007, 14:52
That works.. Pretty much I want to use my magic phase as a second shooting phase where I can punch as many str 5 holes in your army as I can before my jezzails add the hurt to any hard targets while my weapon teams and ogres move up to shoot. If anything, I want to try and cripple my opponents ranged units as much as possible before they can do much to reduce my numbers

nieto666
29-07-2007, 17:40
well not in my army i want be playing in the RTT if u remember correctly :)