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fracas
15-08-2007, 01:49
what is the tactically most sound way for SM to get from ship to planetside for an assault?

1. direct drop attack
2. local thunderhawk delivery
3. regional landings then drive to the battle


while not directly a game question, i am interested to build a ship-based SM DIY Chapter.


thanks.

Master Bait
15-08-2007, 01:58
? the answer would be situational, surely.

Davachido
15-08-2007, 02:04
Since you are using DIY chapters why don't you make some fluff up about your chapter prefering to use a certain type of attack? Despite the flaws of that type of assault they have become adept at using this type of assault and use it continously.

Sorta of like the imperial fists perference to teleport attacks.

grickherder
15-08-2007, 02:09
Sometimes opening up with a 1st company teleportation attack can complete the mission in one go.

It is totally situational, but for larger engagements, it's probably a combination of them all that would work best. You could have the landing craft and thunderhawks moving guys down. You can have drop pods and you can have assault marines doing air drops after the craft enters orbit. Combine that with teleportation and you have a great way to do planetfall.

Arcanus
15-08-2007, 02:46
My DIY force leads the attack by sending Asgarth, a batte barge converted into a moblie fortress monastery into the planet's atmosphere and it hovers there. Then, the troops are droped onto the planet by a thunderhawk.

EDIT: Also, just an idea but, I bet a Land Speeder would be able to be fly from something like Asgarth onto a planet's surface. That'd be cool for you to use.

Alessander
15-08-2007, 04:08
Technically, the Imperium lost the technology to do this. The last recorded "fortress monestary" that could survive in low orbit (that is, have enough anti-grav tech to fight a planet's gravity) was the "Sky Fortress" during the Siege of Terra, and that was taken out by Horus' lackeys. The Imperium is lucky if they can get a land speeder in the air now.

I'm sure all land speeders come from orbiting ships, since all marine armor is built for vacuum, and I don't think that the clamps on the THawk Transporters can carry them (and THawks can't carry inthing larger than a bike inside them).

Technically, i think Drop Pods are not used unless it's for a direct attack, since they require cleanup afterwards (you need someone to pick up the marines AND a separate vehicle to pick up the pods). T-Hawks seem the standard way to get forces down on the ground if a lightning attack isn't needed. If AA fire is too heavy for the THawks to safely deposit their cargo, then the Pods come in (pods are too fast to be hit by most AA fire).

Arcanus
15-08-2007, 04:12
Yeah and conviently my DIY chapter is actually a founding legion that was exiled so they still have said technology.

grickherder
15-08-2007, 04:21
I love the mobile fortress idea-- very cool.

Arcanus
15-08-2007, 04:25
I love the mobile fortress idea-- very cool.

Yeah me too reminds, me a little bit of S.H.I.E.L.D.'s Helicarrier. Well that's what I based the idea of mine on.

Bookwrak
15-08-2007, 06:16
Yeah and conviently my DIY chapter is actually a founding legion that was exiled so they still have said technology.

Hey there XI, 10,000 years late to the party?

Arcanus
15-08-2007, 06:19
Hey there XI, 10,000 years late to the party?

What's that supposed to mean because honestly, I don't understand what your trying to say?

AdolfHammond
15-08-2007, 11:59
Drop pods are cool - But you really need the Thunderhawks to fly in loads of extra Bolter ammo and heavy support vehicles... The greatest weapon a Marine Planetfall has is surprise and devestating point force - so drop pods / teleportation are always going to feature heavily... if you land 1000 or so marines via thunderhawk, then the enemy will quickl surround and obliterate them - best to go for the throat early and disrupt the command and control of the enemy force!

Randy
15-08-2007, 12:05
That you basically disspeared during the horus heresy?

Dark Watcher
15-08-2007, 12:21
The comment is pointing to the fact that the XI legion was one of the two whose existence has been deleted from Imperial Records. I.e. the missing legions.

The 10,000 year reference would be that they have not been seen (if you follow the HH novels since the time of the Great Crusade, if then).

Chaos and Evil
15-08-2007, 12:47
I'm sure all land speeders come from orbiting ships, since all marine armor is built for vacuum, and I don't think that the clamps on the THawk Transporters can carry them (and THawks can't carry inthing larger than a bike inside them).

Marines have a third type of Thunderhawk which is even larger, the 'Landing Craft'.

http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=99110301025&orignav=300808

ehlijen
15-08-2007, 14:45
Each way to deploy troops has it's own advantage and drawback and will be performed according to the situation. If necessary, all methods are combined to achieve greater deployment speed, but that is usually reserved to dire emergencies.
The methods (to my knowledge) are:
Drop Pods: Quick, direct and accurate. But it is also cost intensive, somewhat vulnerable to AA defenses and offers no way of retreat once committed. Best used to reinforce existing fronts or create beachheads for thunderhawl landings.
Teleportation: Quicker and less costly than Pods, and unaffected by Air defenses. It is very risky though and unless terminator suits are used very inaccurate and also offers no possible line of retreat. Only an option on high profile missions where large numbers of Veterans are available and required.
Thunderhawk Hot Drops (includes deepstriking Assault marines and Speeders): Not as fast as the above options, but the presence of the Hawk offers a line of retreat. That is, if it doesn't get shot down which is a significant risk and a reason it is only done when air superiority is established prior to the operation.
ThunderHawk Safe drops: This is the slowest but also safest method of deployment. It is also to only way to get the heavier equipment onto the field without risking the Hawk in the process. It requires a safe airport though, which means it is usually only a way to deploy reinforcements, not the inital attack.

As far as I can see, the standard procedure would be:
Drop pods
Support by teleport if required
Followed immediatly by Hawk Hot drops to resupply and reinforce the perimeter
Then push outwards to establish a secure beachhead
Shuttle down heavy units while the IG takes over the lineholding
go after priority targets while the IG does the grunt work
praise the emporer
leave for the next planet

Egaeus
15-08-2007, 14:58
what is the tactically most sound way for SM to get from ship to planetside for an assault?

1. direct drop attack
2. local thunderhawk delivery
3. regional landings then drive to the battle


while not directly a game question, i am interested to build a ship-based SM DIY Chapter.


thanks.

I have to concur with everyone who's said that it depends on the situation.

Marines are supposed to be tactically adept (if often rigid in their application), so I would suspect that quite a bit of planning goes into an operation. I think the scale of the operation is going to affect things as well. There's a big difference in making a quick strike at a new small but growing threat and quelling a full-scale planetary invasion.

Arcanus
15-08-2007, 15:48
That you basically disspeared during the horus heresy?

Actually, it was before the Horus Heresy. They were exiled. They didn't choose to disappear they were forced to.

Arcanus
15-08-2007, 15:55
The comment is pointing to the fact that the XI legion was one of the two whose existence has been deleted from Imperial Records. I.e. the missing legions.

The 10,000 year reference would be that they have not been seen (if you follow the HH novels since the time of the Great Crusade, if then).

Oh, thanks I didn't read the HH novels but, I wrote fluff saying my Chapter was in the II spot for missing legion and I didn't read the HH novels yet. I plan to read it after I finish the rest of the Shannara books. I'm on the voyages of Jerle Shannara.

fracas
16-08-2007, 01:45
thanks for the replies thus

naturally i understand that the route of attack will need to vary for the tactical situation. having said that, from the comments given, i think that the most tactically flexible way would be for thunderhawk delivery, either near or far deployment, and occasionally supported by drop troops. it hadn't occur to me the teleportation attach but i guess it was because it requires essentially terminator troops.

Alessander
18-08-2007, 20:22
HM, I forgot about Landing Craft from Epic. Those models are HUGE in epic. A 40K scale one would be about 8 foot long.