Heh, irony...Originally Posted by Reivax26
Heh, irony...
Power Armour is for Wimps! Real men go into battle out of the back of a Valkyrie at 500 feet.
Renegades and Heretics Project Log. Last updated 16/3/08Getz for Lord Solar!
Nearly all the 'rants' actually just considered how effective the one list is against infantry based armed thanks to the synergy of blasts and lash- which seems appropriate for a tactics forum
Maulerfiends are on the loose, Maulerfiends are go;
Mauler, Mauler, Mauler, Maulerfiends!
Could I refer you to post #2975?
Sarcastic? - Check.
Rant? - Check.
Incorrect Tactical information? - Check.
Kelanen
He decided to start a thread over on dakka called "Can anyone think outside the box anymore?"
It's basically bashing on people who play competitively because they want to use units that are sub optimal.
Tyranids; 3W-0L-0D in tourny play in 6th
Blood Angels; 0-0-0 in tourny play in 6th
Photos of my stuff; Pics
The thing I find a bit my offensive is the idea that we all just built a list because we read the internet. I personally own 6000 points of CSM or so and have tried, and still try all kinds of things. But the truth is that my analysis, like most people, that the one list is the best one. Its supported by statistics .
There is almost no factual support for these alternate builds- if there were they'd be netlists already!
Maulerfiends are on the loose, Maulerfiends are go;
Mauler, Mauler, Mauler, Maulerfiends!
Well, personally I don't play either Lash princes(or sorcerers) or plague marines, and usually not that many oblits either. I play my Alpha Legionnaires and build my list with my own imaginary restrictions...
The difference is that I know that they are less effective! I'm not trying to delude myself that there are still nuggets of gold to find in this ghastly old codex after all this time and all of these discussions and games...
Thats the thing- and there's nothing wrong with discussing how best to use what you do take- that's all part of a tactica. But to pretend it can be as effective, at this point in the codex's life cycle, with no evidence isn't likely to garner support.
Maulerfiends are on the loose, Maulerfiends are go;
Mauler, Mauler, Mauler, Maulerfiends!
What can I say, I like using Demon engines. Defilers, Decimators, Blight Drones, Blood Slaughterers? I have them all and then back them up with a unit of Bikers. My 'Zerker and Plague marine are squads taken in holy numbers, I field ten man footslogging CSM squads and my army is lead by an unmarked Chaos Sorcerer. Optimised? Not in the slightest, but I have fun with it and it even wins the odd game.
Power Armour is for Wimps! Real men go into battle out of the back of a Valkyrie at 500 feet.
Renegades and Heretics Project Log. Last updated 16/3/08Getz for Lord Solar!
Don't really know why a thread I posted on another site needed to be brought up on here but oh well. By the way if you bothered to read it you would have noticed that I asked if people were having success with lists that were outside the normal "netlists" for those groups that I mentioned and if they were to please post them.
Dreadclaws are kind of an odd fit outside of Apoc. One unit I think about trying one day, is a squad of melta havocs. Kind of a poor mans firedragon squad. Sadly, probably still better off with oblits, but oblits hate me, lol.
And if you bothered to read this topic properly you'd notice that there are tons of people having success with their own "unoptimized" lists(me included).
I just don't like nurgle, never have. But it's an undeniable fact that they are the most effective troop type we have for holding objectives, which is 67% of the gaming in 5th. ed. Lash princes are awesome at board control and perfect against horde armies without psychic defense(like Orks), but lash is never looked upon favorably by any opponent, so I almost never run them anymore... You can put a "netlist" in the hands of a mediocre player and it still won't do as good as if it were played by a good player, but at least he'll have a better chance than with some unoptimized units in the list. Can't remember seeing any Noise Marines or Thousand Sons in last year's ETC lists...I wonder why...
Are people having success with other lists? Yes, when I played chaos I didn't play the lash prince oblit spam list, and in my area I did well. There is a guy in my area that does very well with noise marines and a khorne marked lord. So to answer that question, yes, there are people who have success with other lists. I can say that I personally had very little success with large squads of plague marines, and well before I starting giving a crap what people on warseer thought I was running five man squads...so the implication that those who run five man squads are some boxed in netlist carbon copy twinkys who worship Kelanen is frankly idiotic. Your arguments that the game would somehow be improved by gw instituting manditory sacred number sized units is weak, and your little bitch fit responce to people saying so was childish. What would be really cool, jaw droppingly amazing in fact, is for you to man up to that, say you're sorry for throwing a fit and get on with things.
Getz...out of curiosity, what is the appeal of a blood slaughterer over a regular dreadnaught? I don't have access to the rules on blood slaughterers, and I've always been curious.
Slaughterer is fleet, 13 front armor, WS5 and +D3 attacks on the charge. The other bonus is having up to 3 in a heavy support choice. Also, they don't fire frenzy but suffer from rage instead. That's not really a big deal for S10 dreadnoughts, but I can see how it could be annoying.
All that for ~30 points more then a normal chaos dread.
Tyranids; 3W-0L-0D in tourny play in 6th
Blood Angels; 0-0-0 in tourny play in 6th
Photos of my stuff; Pics
I would like to apologize to those that read my last few posts. They were done in poor taste and were a result of a lot of different things going on at once in my life.
I am however going to stop posting on this thread. I might pop in to post on other threads but not on this one. My philosophical differences in how to setup a Chaos army are just simply too varied from the mainstream thought process when it comes to this Codex and it causes too many arguments that only make me angrier than I need to be.
It's the internet. Nobody cares.
RE: Blood Slaughterers -
I'd love to use them for variety, but don't like the way they look at all. Too much like mechanical bugs/beetles... For rules vs. regular Dreads, they're WS5, front armor 13, have Rage, actually have 1 fewer base attack but +d3 on the charge, and may swap a DCCW for an Impaler, which is a short range grapple gun basically. In IA7, the points are listed as 30 more than the minimum cost of a CSM dreadnought (after you buy its second weapon).
My Chaos Project Log - ride the lightning!
Objectively, not a lot - the Impaler is entertaining rather than effective, they're expensive, have surprising few attacks and rage can be a real pain. However, the Av 13 is pretty awesome (I once had the sweet, sweet experience of piling a pair of Blood Slaughterers into a Chapter Master and big unit of Honor Guard armed with relic blades) and they're Demon Engines, so they're okay by me...
Power Armour is for Wimps! Real men go into battle out of the back of a Valkyrie at 500 feet.
Renegades and Heretics Project Log. Last updated 16/3/08Getz for Lord Solar!
Even against Thunder Hammers and fists, that AV 13 makes a big difference. Though my Defiler did once kill 3 TH/SS termies plus a Librarian and Vulkan with naught but his fists.
IMO the biggest thing about them is that they have so few attacks (base 2 instead of 3).
My Chaos Project Log - ride the lightning!
Interesting specs...wouldn't mind trying three out one day, but rage is a deal breaker.
They're pretty cheap for AV13. It's going to be a nice diversion to throw at your opponent while you get your battleplan going.
I don't see why the Dreadnough is still so maligned. Well, of course it was not really popular in codex 3.5 either, but not rightly so. Yes, it goes mad sometimes, but then you get to either run and assault or fire TWICE. It's not really difficult to keep your forces outside of its narrow front arc.
I can second Chaos Dreads being actually rather good after the FAQ. I've taken 3 of them with multi meltas to the last 2 Throne of Skulls and they have really performed wonders. Being so cheap, they always seem to make their points back too - it's all in the deployment and positioning of your forces as Xandros has said. That front fire arc is very narrow
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