5.0 Tactica - Tau Empire

[Fraf]

Don't the pirahanas come in a a box set or something? At any rate, I'm talking from a US perspective on the cost, which is where you worry about currency conversion...

Piranhas are 1 per box and the retail price is 25$, so 50$ a pair
tetras are sold in pairs for 33£, currently 53$
the difference is really thin

Has anyone ever fielded Farsight and his full bodyguard of Suits? If so how did it do?

Fun to play in friendly games, but it has the same drawbacks as most deathstars : can be outmanoeuvered or ignored by your opponent who can go at the rest of your army (which isn't much). They're also vulnerable to high Str low AP pieplates.

[lantzkev]

I'm trying to figure out how I ever ended up with some pirahanas lol.

ah here it is Tau Megaforce

forgot they don't sell it anymore. Also you're forgetting shipping etc also for the tetras =p A little remodeling isn't all that hard or expensive heh.

[meltedwing]

I think the main problem is that piranhas are quite a lot bigger than tetras. Think Ferrari vs MG. Ferrari's are small, but MG's are just itty bitty.

I think the next game I play, I will do a batrep on with video.

[IAMNOTHERE]

The vindicare match up doesnt make Farsight useless, just one more bad opponent.

The tetras have a smaller frontage and a narrower profile so are easier to fit into gaps.

[Tastyfish]

Fun to play in friendly games, but it has the same drawbacks as most deathstars : can be outmanoeuvered or ignored by your opponent who can go at the rest of your army (which isn't much). They're also vulnerable to high Str low AP pieplates.

Not really, as most Deathstars are generally close combat focused. Farsight's bodyguard have the option to work pretty effectively as a couple of teams thrown together in order to share more shield drones and play wound allocation tricks as they do still have the option of splitting their fire and are very much a shooting unit.

Biggest drawbacks are the list, you need a fairly large army in order to make the bodyguard not prohibitively expensive (Shas'vre bodyguards are more points efficient that standard suits with target locks and hard wired systems, but it's a big initial outlay and it is a less flexible formation than the same points worth of elite suits). And with this list, you have only two true anti-tank units.

As for Tetras, they're bike sized units not the same sort of size as traditional light vehicles like landspeeders and piranhas. About three times the length of a small flying base.

[Kelanen]

Biggest drawbacks are the list, you need a fairly large army in order to make the bodyguard not prohibitively expensive

Needs a big specific list for Farsight to buy you suits you couldn't buy anyway... Most of the time Farsight just restricts you, and doesn't add anything.

[Kelanen]

Don't the pirahanas come in a a box set or something?

They did when they were first released - a box of 3, which is how I got mine. I wish they still did it

I've noticed a ebay retailer that I think has done what meltedwing is doing and is selling quite a few forgeworld knock offs, if they aren't recasts I'd be very surprised.

There's a Russian seller selling copies of just about everything....

[Rogerio]

Ive used Piranahs 5 or 6 times and theyve been TERRIBLE every single time, killing zero enemies in all of those games (maybe a couple of Dark Eldar warriors from the drones once the piranah goes down) they are expensive if you want to stick a targeting array on them and they get shot down by anything really.

Only time i ever got one them into a great position was against a space marine army and i managed to hide behind some woods then pop over it and get a shot on the rear armour of of a dread.....would have been a guaranteed penetrating hit, and you guessed it BS3...i missed then got blown up the next turn by a missile....sigh.

[meltedwing]

Hmm... it sounds like you are certainly having very bad luck with your Piranha. I've used Piranha probably as many times as you have, and in one tournament I used two of them in reserve. When they came in on turn 2 or 3 (I don't recall which) I flew them 12 inches toward the enemy, but hid behind a tank that had been wrecked by that point. Next turn I moved them 12 inches closer to the enemy and conveniently put them just within charge range of some grey knights. The Grey Knights (with librarian) charged and assaulted my Piranha, which then exploded in a shower of flechette. I killed all of the Grey Knights except their Librarian who was still about 4 inches away and definitely not in base to base, so he couldn't even swing at me. Next turn I flew up to his psyfledread and made it explode in a shower of fiery death with my fusion guns (at BS4). So all in all, they killed a tricked out psyfledread and 4 grey knight power armor guys, leaving his librarian exposed for shots from my other stuff.

Do you upgrade your Piranha at all? I highly recommend flechette, disruption pods and sensor spines, which is what I used in the situation described above.

[Kelanen]

Piranha's are amazing, but their value is at best only half in their damage potential (maybe less than that). They should always have a Disruption Pod, Targetting Array and Fusion Blaster. If you see much non-MEQ then maaaybe Flechette Dispenser, but if you see more than occasionaly non-MEQ the Piranha might not be the best choice anyway. (My local environment is 100% MEQ, and the UK's high level competitive tournaments are around 75%).

The role of a Piranha is typically to turbo-boost forward stopping 1" in front of a Land Raider, or key transport, blocking it in (there's generally troops to either side, and Piranhas should always be used at least 2-3, I often field 6 in larger battles). For a flimsy AV10 skimmer the DP and turbbost mean it actually takes more firepower than the enemy wants to spend to kill it. Even then, on anything but an explode it's still blocking the Raider in (and it's Assault Ramps until it moves backwards). The ones that don't die get that all important melta shot off (and then probably die!).

They key thing about Piranhas is 24" move, and block key vehicles in! Anything else is gravy. Also don't forget to pop-off drones, and use them to block too! (but they can however be Tank-shocked, whilst the Piranha can't, and can't effectively be Rammed).

I'd be hard pressed to say what's best out of Crisis Suits, Broadsides and Piranhas, but they are without a doubt the key parts of the army for me, and I'd happily take more of those and nothing else if I could.

[Ronin no Matsu]

I'm surprised nobody talked about turbo-boosting seeker missiles equiped piranha behind some enemy vehicule and then get some marker light shot from anything in range of it. It's very very effective.

[IAMNOTHERE]

Thing is the dex is so overpriced that points on seeker missiles isn't points on suits etc. Its a big jump from playing MEQ with integral fire support to Tau who don't.

One of the big challenges for me is making everything work together, wish markerlights were cheeper.

[Kelanen]

I don't think Seeker Missiles are very effective, and they are relying on Markerlights, which I have optimised out of my competitive lists, because Pathfinders are far too expensive (given that I have no use for their mandatory Fish).

Now in fairness, the new Tetra rules, are seriously making me consider bringing those back in, and if so, and if IO have a spare 10-20pts I'd consider Seekers, but they really are a fill in, not a primary place to points. The Piranhas job is not zipping around the side, it's using that fast, wide model to block movement.

[IAMNOTHERE]

Seeker missiles have a 5/12 chance to hit - less than guard. For what's meant to be the Tau fire support they need a big boost when we get a new dex.

They just arnt worth it.

[SageoftheTimes]

*Tetras & Markerlight Availability
Stealth suits w/ Markerlights can grab 1 + 2 markerlights per model. Note that this costs ~85p per suit & 2 drones (a tetra costs 55p base). In the end, the stealth suits can ignore fire w/ the Stealth Fields, but most armies are 24" or closer in average range, have enough mobility to get closer (Stealth suits will NOT survive up close, pure and simple), and can dakka/assault them down easily. The main problem has always been where to get markerlights.

Stealth suits are insanely expensive and take points from Crisis suits, Skyrays are too expensive for what they bring, and Pathfinders, while cheap, are a bit squishy, immobile, and require the purchase of a dedicated transport (and are STILL the best of the lot). In the end, Tetras give us decent markerlight options, and I can't wait for Skyrays to get two High-Intensity Markerlights + better missile options (probably something similar to orbital bombardments, a selection of different shots and so on).

*Piranhas
You either pop them out as targets for enemies to sink fire into, or hide them behind something till they can actually do their job. There's no real middle-ground. As for equipment, you HAVE to give them a targeting array (5p for BS 4 = yes please), or they're pointless. Even then, you've gotta hide them and work a bit to get them to be useful (they're not perfect). There are times when they can block movement, but those are rare. Use them if and when you're comfortable (they're also decent at contesting).

*Seeker Missiles
The problem here is that Hunter Killer Missiles don't need markerlights to fire, cost the same amount, and auto-hit. Seeker missiles need a combination of: broader markerlight support, so that they can be more easily fired; Possibly the removal of one-shot, so that while they're more limited, you can fire them from more then one turn from equipped vehicles (probably would require a points increase, but the markerlight requirements along with the added fire directed at the vehicle(s) in question would make up for most of it); Some additional firing modes (basic missile shot, some sort of dedicated anti-tank shot, and some sort of anti-infantry blast would work, as could a multi-shot attack that has medium S and meh AP) would help too, but restricting them to the Skyray would work well.

[madival]

trying to get back into tau after a only a few games with tau and almost a year break. how is this.

HQ

Shas'el with plasma rifle, missle pod,multi-tracker

Elite


6 Stealth suits-Target arrays

3 fire knife crisis suits

3 fire knife crisis suits

Troops

6 fire warriors-devil fish , disruption pods

6 fire warriors- devil fish, disruption pods

Heavy

2 broadsides-Target array, HW drone control, 2 shield drones

Hammerhead -rail gun , disruption pods

Hammerhead -rail gun , disruption pods

[Kelanen]

@ Madival

I've seen a lot worse! You'd be better swapping the Stealths for more Crisis, and Hammerheads for Broadsides, but it';s not bad at all. If you see a reasonable amount of hordes, then the configuration you have is better.

[Grinder]

Tau players:

Has anyone here considered any Turrets armed with missile pods, at 35 it is something I've considered? Am I way off base here?

The immobile thing will limit potential targets, maybe SMS will make it on the turrets in the next codex.

Just a thought...

[SageoftheTimes]

@ Madival
I've seen a lot worse! You'd be better swapping the Stealths for more Crisis, and Hammerheads for Broadsides, but it';s not bad at all. If you see a reasonable amount of hordes, then the configuration you have is better.

If he's playing mech, he'll want pathfinders for markerlights, and he should at least try Kroot for bubblewrap to see if they're viable for him (this is a long disagreement between Kelanen and myself, as he doesn't play hybrid, and doesn't use Kroot due to vastly different terrain: no cover or area terrain, just BLoS). And Hammerheads for hybrid provide some anti-horde, something Tau is lacking badly.

None the less Madival, it's a decent core, you just have to remove the stealth suits, have less FWs in fishes (very expensive for scoring, replace with kroot and keep them in cover), and consider some different types of bling (Broadsides can benefit from Advanced Stabilization a lot, although Targeting Arrays work if you have decent fields of fire; Hammerheads need multitrackers so they can fire their main weapon at all times).

Tau players:
Has anyone here considered any Turrets armed with missile pods, at 35 it is something I've considered? Am I way off base here?

The immobile thing will limit potential targets, maybe SMS will make it on the turrets in the next codex.

Just a thought...

You should look into the Forge World Tau FAQ for updated rules. They're AV 12, so that's a big bonus, aren't open-topped, and otherwise are 35p for Missile Pods (40p w/ a Disruption Pod, hint hint). They're BS 2 TL models, so if 40p is worth it for the model (keeping in mind that BS 2 TL is worse then BS 3, and for 22p more, you can get a fireknife suit), go for it. It's just a question of weither you can find the points, and if the firepower loss is worth it for the gain of being AV 12 + Disruption Pods and Scoring.

[Fraf]

and if the firepower loss is worth it for the gain of being AV 12 + Disruption Pods and Scoring.

Tau turrets and remote sensor towers are never scoring units and cannot even contest objectives, as mentioned in their immobile rule

keeping in mind that BS 2 TL is worse then BS 3

actually, it's the opposite. TL BS 2 has 55% chances to hit, whereas BS 3 has 50%