Games Workshop Pricing Feedback Thread

[samiens]

If course 'all' never did, people have always dropped out of the hobby, especially teens

[frozenwastes]

I guess it's more fair to say that GW expects to replace lost customers at a rate that will sustain their yearly price increase approach. They're not replacing customers as fast as they are losing them though.

Still fast enough to justify more price increases every year though.

Expect to pay more and have less opponents.

[Lord Dan]

Well, the 2012 corporate results are in and GW turned a small profit.

So expect them to continue with the price increases of 10%+ a year. From their perspective, you'll all keep buying no matter what. Or well, enough of you will anyway. They probably can't believe "all" will anymore.

Do you have a link to a detailed breakdown? I'd like to sift through it and see what's doing well for them.

[Scaryscarymushroom]

Link to full report.

Thread.

[Lord Dan]

Link to full report.

Thread.

Thanks buddy. I'll take my comments there.

[Darnok]

Thanks buddy. I'll take my comments there.

As should everybody else.

This thread is not about the upcoming Hobbit trilogy, and it is not about the new financial results from GW. Please keep the thread on topic.


Darnok [=I=]

[I3uLLioN]

They're not replacing customers as fast as they are losing them though.

This is a baseless statement with no evidence.

[Lord Dan]

This is a baseless statement with no evidence.

I wouldn't say "baseless". There's no report with the GW seal on it indicating as such, however if revenues are up 1% and prices are up 13%, it means sales volumes have decreased. If sales volumes have decreased either:

1) They're taking on more customers, and everyone is buying a LOT less.
2) They've kept the same number of customers, and everyone is buying a little less.
3) They're losing customers, and everyone is buying about the same.

It's a toss up for me between 2 and 3, however one of them is certainly likely.

[frozenwastes]

Either way (I think it's a combination of less customers and smaller purchasing amounts), the numbers are in and from GW's perspective the yearly 10%+ price hikes are working just fine.

So they're going to keep doing them.

So anyone thinking about price needs to decided how long they plan on being GW's customer. If you're only going to be around for less than two years, the price hikes will be not awesome, but not a deal breaker. But if you're hoping to stick around as GW's customer for years to come, it'll start compounding on you year over year. And if the customer base is shrinking, your pool of opponents is shrinking as well.

It also used to be that GW stores gave good value for the money in the gaming space and services they offer. But those have been slashed as well. Single employee stores with reduced table space and reduced hobby services no longer contribute to the value you get for the money.

[Lord Dan]

The only reason I ever went to a GW store was for the "experience" of it, and drove an hour with some friends, apparently expecting to step into some magical world that contained miniatures not available anywhere else, and where prizes were given away every 10 minutes. Even when I went some 8 or so years ago it ended up being lackluster, and that was with the larger stores they had back then. I can't imagine what they've become today.

[darius-god-of-biscuits]

I note that my local HobbyCraft store is still selling GW stuff at the pre-increase prices.

I picked up a razorback for £20-50 and there are still battleforces for £60,

It makes me wonder if they will continue stocking GW (and similar lines) as there are no new paints and the store has obviously returned all their Flames of War Stuff.

[I3uLLioN]

Either way (I think it's a combination of less customers and smaller purchasing amounts), the numbers are in and from GW's perspective the yearly 10%+ price hikes are working just fine.

So they're going to keep doing them.

So anyone thinking about price needs to decided how long they plan on being GW's customer. If you're only going to be around for less than two years, the price hikes will be not awesome, but not a deal breaker. But if you're hoping to stick around as GW's customer for years to come, it'll start compounding on you year over year. And if the customer base is shrinking, your pool of opponents is shrinking as well.

It also used to be that GW stores gave good value for the money in the gaming space and services they offer. But those have been slashed as well. Single employee stores with reduced table space and reduced hobby services no longer contribute to the value you get for the money.

Ive been playing GW games for 15 years and will continue to do so (hopefully for many more years to come) I dont mean for this to sound patronising or anything but is a few hundreds pounds over the course of a year for a luxury hobby really so much? There are some products GW produce that I dont think provide good value and so I dont buy them, there are others that do. Same with nearly everything in the world.

As for GW stores... My local GW is really good. Lots of events and hobby space. Plenty of gaming space and a thriving community that pack out the store a few times a week. Thing is... I understand that this is merely anecdotal eveidence and other peoples experience do not mirror my own, perhaps this is soething you should consider.

[Lord Dan]

I dont mean for this to sound patronising or anything but is a few hundreds pounds over the course of a year for a luxury hobby really so much?

Maybe not for you, however if GW keeps its current pricing trend I imagine you're not going to find many people to play against in the next 5 years.

[paddyalexander]

Where gwPLC are facing a serious problem are people like me, who like elements of their products (in my case the background pre-fifth ed changes and a fair chunk of their model range), can afford the prices that gwPLC are asking for their product but find that they can get a more valuable/rewarding war gaming hobby experience for equal to or less than the cost from competitors products.

I spend about €400 a month on a variety of different war games and board games but over the last 6 years I've spent maybe €300 on gwPLC products and 80% of that has been gifts for other people.

I want to be able to play 40k and enjoy it again, I want to be a gwPLC customer again but the terrible balance of the overall ruleset means combined with the ridiculas pricing of their models means that it is not going to happen in the foreseeable future.

The fact that companies like Mantic can produce similer plastic products but have to do so trough a third party manufacturer and still be cheeper says a lot about gwPLCs' skewed pricing structure.

[Lord Dan]

I spend about €400 a month on a variety of different war games and board games

Your game room must rival the size of my apartment.

[paddyalexander]

The benefits of owning a house. I have a 6'x8' shed dedicated to the storage of the games I no longer play (mainly gwPLC stuff but also AT-43, FoW and Starship Troopers stuff). My gaming and hobby room double up as my bedroom. When a friend of mine first came to game at my place he looked around the room and genuinely asked "where do you sleep?" as my bed had been buried under a pile of boxes of gaming crap.

I have a disposable income of between €400-€600 a month depending on bills, birthdays, special events etc. I don't smoke, rarely drink anymore and my only dependents are my parents to whom I pay an allowance to.

So I am reasonably well off given the state of the economy and I balk at the prices gwPLC thinks that its products are worth. When I was a kid I worked and scrimped and saved to be able to afford gwPLCs models back in the early to mid nineties. Looking at their prices now I wonder how are they expecting kids to be able to afford their product on pocket money?

[frozenwastes]

I dont mean for this to sound patronising or anything but is a few hundreds pounds over the course of a year for a luxury hobby really so much?

Yeah, when I'm not really getting any extra value for the extra few hundred pounds.

I don't spend as much as some, but I do spend around 65 GBP a month on hobby stuff. The amount I get from GW for that budget just keeps shrinking and shrinking, while other offerings from other companies come in at better value. I could up my 65 GBP a month to 70, to 75, etc., with every yearly price increase I guess. Or I could simply get better value from other miniature makers.

With every new edition of 40k and WFB, I find I enjoy the actual game less and less (2nd ed 40k was my favorite, 4th & 5th tied for favorite for WFB), so I use indie/small press/free alternatives with some gaming buddies. So I don't see GW's rules as adding any value to their product. In fact, they seem to be designing them to require more and more miniatures for a normal size game, so I see them as helping to remove value from the GW pricing equation.

As for GW stores... My local GW is really good. Lots of events and hobby space. Plenty of gaming space and a thriving community that pack out the store a few times a week. Thing is... I understand that this is merely anecdotal eveidence and other peoples experience do not mirror my own, perhaps this is soething you should consider.

I used to live near a great GW. Played there a couple times a month. Made it very, very easy to justify buying there regularly. Then they moved it to a smaller location and cut the staff down to a single guy. Haven't been back except to check out some Finecast in person, but I haven't bought from there since.

There's also the issue of "Screw Canada pricing." When UK retailers could sell world wide, I could get an item to my door for less than the local independent stockists could get it for wholesale. So without the added value of a good GW store and an active player base (it's all dried up and switched to Flames of War and Warmachine around these parts), I got used to paying UK prices in Canada. With that ending, I haven't bought a single GW new product. I did by some bitz off a US based ebay store that were a good value.

At UK retail, GW's prices aren't awful. At Canadian (or Australian!) retail, they're terrible in terms of value. Especially when other companies don't try to charge me 50-75% more for the honour of being Canadian. What would you think if the next time you walked into a GW store, the prices were suddenly 50% higher on everything? Would you mind paying that extra based on your nationality?

[librerian_samae]

It's finally come to the point I'm just not feeling I'm getting the value out of GW pricing even for stand alone fun to paint projects, as my group still do play and I want to be able to join in still.
Fortunately in a way the rest of my group are feeling the same, and all having a bit of nostalgic kick for some skirmish we have decided to try pastures greener. (this is doubly nice for me as I can now get cool stuff to paint AND have a reasonable table ready force.)

At the moment I'm still getting white dwarf, but at £5 thats almost another figure for one of the games were trying.

Sad really as we all still like warhammer/40k, we just can't see point in spending £££ for lots of excess wound counters, even there cool large center peice stuff is just getting too pricey to be able to justify to the missus- for example I can get a stormraven (or equivalent) for circa £50 from GW or lets say if I want something for infinity that £50 quid will let me start a whole new army at a rather nice size or fully flesh out an existing force with all the shiny stuff I could want.

It's not just my gaming mates who are thinking this either, our friends and family are surprised to see the huge pricing difference between GW and non GW minis, as they thought that GWwas the standard seeing as how it's so prevalent.

[Blutrache]

It's not just my gaming mates who are thinking this either, our friends and family are surprised to see the huge pricing difference between GW and non GW minis, as they thought that GWwas the standard seeing as how it's so prevalent.

Yeah, I had an eye-opener too when I started to get into the SAGA skirmish game. Being used to GW's character figures around £10-12 the historicals go for around £2-3 tops! Troops are around a fiver for four, and they're metal too . Between the choice of 1 finecast mini character and 4 metal mounted command Normans for the same moolah, my choice is easy. Besides they can double in as Norse or Brettonians in WFB too...

/Cheers

[paddyalexander]

There's also the issue of "Screw Canada pricing."

It is even funnier in the Republic of Ireland. I can travel 300km to Dublin to shop in the only gwPLC "hobby" store in the country at Euro prices which is the pound sterling price plus 40% or I can travel an extra 150km and go to the gwPLC "hobby" store in Belfast and buy stuff at works out to between a 23% and 28% discount depending on exchange rates and thanks to a 3% difference in VAT.

At least I still of the option of going online to a UK based web store and getting the above discount before the web store has added any of their own. That was gwPLCs' biggest flaw with their international pricing. Just by following real world exchange rates when buying internationaly you could earn a heavty discount before any are added by the seller.

What was even funnier was years ago if you ordered something from the gwPLC "hobby" store in Dublin they would charge you in pounds sterling so it would work out to being discounted. I went in once and asked to order an IG battle box, usualy €80 from them. They said that they had two on the shelf but I insisted on ordering it along with some bits (back when they still did a service). Worked out to €60 for the box. The staffer was not happy.