Avatar size preference (both fluff and gaming-wise)

[borithan]

I think the warmachine status for the epic avatar is not really anything about it's size but more to do with its resilience (and unnatural nature).

I think it can be all 3. In my reading of the Emperor is that in people's perception he can be be any size he wants to be, due to his psychic abilities. His combat abilities are also psychic based (ie he is amazing because of his psychic abilities, not because he in any way rivals the basic strength of a Space Marine, for example). An Avatar, being a daemon-like being, and so presumably at least partially fuelled by the warp and psychic power, also doesn't need to be massive to be deadly. And also may be able to appear different sizes at different times. When fighting against normal people he doesn't need to be massive (but could be). When fighting a daemon or something similar, we are talking about two at least partially non-"real" beings fighting each other. The physical events a person would see don't necessarily have any bearing on what is actually going on. The apparent physical struggle could just be a representation of a psychic struggle between the two beings, and if that is true (no evidence for this... me just waffling) then both beings can appear just as big as they need to be. Yes, the small original Avatar would look a bit strange breaking a keeper of secrets over his leg, but for that fight he may have appeared much bigger.

Game wise I think the current one metal is probably best... not daftly large, and not looking strangely small. A bit dated modelwise though.

[Nighthawke]

i like the midle size one, jst fits better since i think the avatar of war the size of a blood thirster would be a lot harder. also when did the forgeworld bump up the price of the avatar? :S

[Eulenspiegel]

I´m one of those who voted for the wimpy original Avatar.

Back then I was utterly at love with the idea of a warrior of almost-regular-size being equal to the greatest monsters of the universe. The miniature that was 1,5 the size of a regular Eldar did perfectly represent that.


My old Avatar (it´s been more than two decades, stop laughing!):

[Partisan Rimmo]

I kind of agree with Eulenspiegel (but I voted medium).

It's more in the nature of Khaine to be the ultimate warrior supreme, rather than some monolithic juggernaut. If you make him huge, he just starts looking ponderous, which is the opposite of how an Avatar should be.

Regardless of the size, it should be considered capable of killing any Greater Daemon though.

[Grimbad]

I voted for the small one.
More kung fu and less hulk smash.

[Thud]

Out of the three, I prefer the old small one.

But if I had my way, it would be something between the current GW model and the old small one.

I'm not a big fan of the FW version; it's too big and just looks like it's trying, and failing, to be a Greater Daemon.

[shadow hunter]

Can you still get the old one anywhere?

[FireDragonExarch]

The Forge World model truly represents the true figure of what Khaine's fury should look like. Khaine is the god of war, and being the bloody handed god his representative in the 41st Millenium should be a towering Beast. They just need to pump up the stats of the Avatar to make everyone happy. WS10 is a really nice thing being able to always go 3+ on hitting, but I'd like his Strength and Toughness to increase as it's not logical why a Wraithlord can be tougher than him yet die quicker than him... I'd don't know about you guys but this is how I percieve new Avatar stats (hopefully)

WS10,BS6, S10, T8, I6 (maybe 5), W5, Ld10, 3+ (4++ for being a representation of a god, only superior tech can get a better invulnerable)

Seems crazy at first but look at the forge world model and Dawn of War's representation and Gav Thorpe's description in the Eldar novels. This guy after a round or 3 with assalt terminators is likely to be left with 1 wound. He should be able to come off much better...

[eldargal]

More like 10x in my opinion.

The Forgeworld one is not 3x as awesome though (which it would have to be to justify the price).

Voted FW, they are so much nicer than the rest it just isn't fair. I own one of each but I never bother fielding any but my FW Avatar.

[gutsmaka]

definatly forgeworld. awsome weapons and seeing the size of recent monsters, the avatar being smaller than even a wraithlord is bigger (and, lets be honest, wraithlords ar'nt huge compared to tervigons and mawlocks). thats kind of embarresing

[Born Again]

The thing with daemons is that they can really be any size. The avatar possesses a statue so it will be as big as the statue (or could change its size).

Think Hellebore's pretty much hit it on the head here. However big they make the statue, is how big it will be. However, for some time now I've assumed it to be the size of the next model they release. Think, the current 40k model is very old... it was already out when I started playing in mid-2nd edition, and at the time it was the same size as the chaos greater daemons, as well as dreadnoughts and the like. Since then, they're released the current greater daemons, which are significantly bigger. I imagine when they get around to doing the Avatar it will similarly be boosted in size... bigger that 12 feet, maybe more like 15?

[Bergen Beerbelly]

The image you are looking for can also be found in the old Renegades supplement for Epic Space Marine/Titan Legions. It's on page 5. It was drawn by John Blanche. Now if I knew how to put it up so you could see it I would.

[titilititi]

I prefer the "greater-deamon-sized"Avatar (I mean, the GW, not the FW greater-deamon-sized) It got to be a little gracious to be an Eldar. It's a little off-topic, but giving him an anti-grav war chariot would make him a lot more impressive and, and it's not a detail for Eldar, faster. In my dreams he also wears a burning but noble cape (the Young King's one, according to the fluff...)

[MajorWesJanson]

I like the large FW one, and wish the GW models (for both the Avatar and Greater Daemons) would be enlarged to match. Not as big as the FW Greater Daemons, but around the size of the FW Daemon Princes.

[Solonor]

In my fluffy dreams Avatars of Khaine can be off variable sizes, depending on the power of the Exarch (Young King), the greater the power of the Young King the bigger the Avatar. Since Exarchs are rare in the Craftworlds (and i imagine older exarchs are quite rare) the Seers must come to the difficult decision of which one will be called to be sacrificed, so that only when times are desperate the oldest Exarchs are called to their final honour. In rules this could be represented by different tiers or levels of Avatars.

In my fluffy dreams if a phoenix lord where to sacrifice him(her)self to khaine a mighty juggernaut of khaine would appear, the only reason it will never happen his because of a bigger more subtle plan. The phoenix Lords purpose his to master each aspect of khaine to perfection, so the existing Lords that already achieved their purpose are just waiting for all the other phoenix Lords to appear and master their aspect. when all are reunited they will each one find all the shards of the war god (in craftworlds or other places) and at the same time sacrifice themselves to Khaine enabling all the shards to come back together so that Khaine will be one once more and can finally defat the great enemy.

sorry for bad spelling and grammar.

[cynic]

I voted for the FW one, as i think that model is just awesome!

However i think the Avatar would probably manifest in all sizes, from small up to massive, maybe even bigger than the FW one.

Each craftworld has its own Avatar, and there are many varying sized craftworlds, so therefore the Avatars would vary in size too, depending which craftworld they come from.

[Starchild]

I prefer to use the original Avatar. It's my way of protesting against Mat Ward's ridiculous convention-bending antics. If Blood Angels get a T6 model that can fit on a 25mm base, then I get one too.

[Desca]

I voted for "The standard daemon-sized god-monster", but I would actually prefare something between this and the FW size

[Bob Arctor]

The ideal size for me would be between the current GW and FW models, probably about a head taller than the GW one at most.

[khaosmarines]

the forge world model looks epic... so that's my vote