Dark Eldar (DE) Strategy Guide 5th

[Meriwether]

I've found that deep-striking scourges with two (or four) heat lances really do quite well as AT units... And they also do quite well as anti-heavy-infantry units... ...and anti-light-infantry units...

They're not cheap, but thus far I'm liking their performance much more than I am hellions or reavers. (I haven't tried Beastmasters yet).

[kraken]

Found an error. Klaviex with demiklaives dont get 6x s4 or 4x s6. Its 6x s3 or 4xs5.

Furious charge ? let me just quote part of the entry from my blog "he is capable of"

So with FC he is capable of ......

Why is it people are so quick to (wrongly) criticize but getting positives or thanks for carefully researched and thought out article is like wringing blood from a stone.

Yes the Claivex IS capable of 6x s4 or 4x s6 power weapon attacks, ok ?

[Meriwether]

Why is it people are so quick to (wrongly) criticize but getting positives or thanks for carefully researched and thought out article is like wringing blood from a stone.

Because attaboys don't serve to improve a work?

[kraken]

Neither does pooping on it for no reason.

back on topic, Meri have you tried Haywires on scourges ? I have had quite a bit of fun frustrating opponents with them, they are fast becoming a candidate for 'default'. Im not keen on dropping 22 point models within 9" of enemy stuff usually, the bonus with reavers was being able to jetbike move back out of assault range , possibly into cover ?

The extra range the haywires offer makes them far more flexible and its easier to drop them somewhere safer but still in range.

Tried 2 blasters in a 4 man the other day, they sucked bad,had perfect rear shots on dreadnought twice and they fethed it up both times.

[Da Black Gobbo]

Hi guys! i'm plaining about runing 3 small wracks squads and i like to ask about people's experiences with similar loadouts.

5 Wracks: Acothyst w/Scyssor hand, 1 Liquifier, Riding a Venom with dual Splinter Cannons and nightshield.

That's a pretty cheap unit, they score with my Haemi HQ and they pack reasonable anti- MC and Infantry punch, In a 1800 points list i'm getting 3 of this units plus some other units.

What do you think??

[Meriwether]

Neither does pooping on it for no reason.

I think that a clarification that the S4/S6 comes from a potential furious charge is a very good idea, and instead of being touchy about it you should thank Sekhmet for the feedback he was under no obligation to give you and then go clarify the article.

back on topic, Meri have you tried Haywires on scourges?

I am very underwhelmed with haywire grenades in general under 5th edition, so I haven't bothered to try them on scourges yet. The other reason is that heat lances are great against heavy infantry and monstrous creatures -- very complimentary to the shardcarbines carried by the rest of the squad -- while haywire launchers are not.

[kraken]

Its perfectly clear in the article seems you are merrily passing comment on something you have not bothered to read, If anyone has comments of that nature, its got a comment box on the blog for stuff like that.

He was not being helpful either, advertising you found a glaring error (when you did not) in their blog on a thread unrelated to it, could be considered the opposite, in fact just to be clear, it wasn't.

I was trying to move away from this discussion but you seem determined to derail the thread.

As for Haywires, no, they do not kill anything, but the are an almost guarantee of vehicle shooting shutdown. If nothing else they are amusing.

Good points on the heatlances for heavy infantry and MC's I'll defo give them a go next opportunity. Im assuming you are advocating large squads rather than the ever popular 5 man setup ?

[Meriwether]

I am advocating large squads, yes. Even small squads are too expensive for 'if nothing else they are amusing' to do it for me.

(As for the other: I do a lot of writing and a lot of critique. I read your article. I was trying to be helpful, and I think he was, too.)

[Sekhmet]

I am advocating large squads, yes. Even small squads are too expensive for 'if nothing else they are amusing' to do it for me.

(As for the other: I do a lot of writing and a lot of critique. I read your article. I was trying to be helpful, and I think he was, too.)

I like small squads of incubi, they better fit in a venom. But with smaller squads, id probably take 3 with klaviex and demiklaive or bloodstone + archon. In a larger raider squad, id take onslaught and demiklave and go all incubi. But the situations where this unit is not overkill are few and far between.

And yes, its called constructive criticism. It's nothing personal kraken, and you shouldn't take criticism as a personal attack. Also, it's the Internet. You need a thick skin here.

[Meriwether]

Uhhh, Sekhmet, I was talking about scourges!

[kraken]

And I thought it was perfectly clear what you were talking about, guess some people need everything spelled out .....

For the record, Furious charge gives units with the USR + 1 initiative and + 1 strength the turn they charge. All DE with power from pain, including Incubi and their klaivex have access to it.

Meriwether advocates large squads of SCOURGES not Incubi, just to be clear.

On the subject of constructive criticism, I can highly recommend reading things properly as it can sometimes avoid rubbing people up the wrong way or embarrassing moments ^

Cheers for trying to help.

On the Scourges, is ten with 4 lances not a huge investment ? they are pretty fragile for more points than a land raider, what sort of things would you tend to target and is it hard avoiding reprisals how are you protecting them from being shot to bits and/or assaulted? even a tactical squad will beat them up if they have their transport popped, the scourges will be well within assault range ?

The other thing that makes me hesitate with Scourges is that with the ten man squad you will have 130 ish points of models doing nothing every time they fire on a vehicle. ?

[Meriwether]

And I thought it was perfectly clear what you were talking about, guess some people need everything spelled out .....

This, from the guy who is apparently concerned with

rubbing people up the wrong way

Grow a thicker skin, or stop putting things up where people can, like, actually read and comment on them... Because you're bound to find helpful people like me who don't care if you get offended by their comments.

On the Scourges, is ten with 4 lances not a huge investment ?

I generally play at 2500 points, and I like to spam units. I've brought three squads of ten with two lances a few times thus far, and each time thought 'gee, I wish I upgraded to four lances each!'

they are pretty fragile for more points than a land raider, what sort of things would you tend to target and is it hard avoiding reprisals how are you protecting them from being shot to bits and/or assaulted?

It seems to me that most of those questions are too situational to answer adequately... I have found that with Dark Eldarevery army in 40K, focusing your entire army on pieces of your opponent's army at a time (as much as you can) is the most effective way to play the game.

even a tactical squad will beat them up if they have their transport popped, the scourges will be well within assault range ?

The other thing that makes me hesitate with Scourges is that with the ten man squad you will have 130 ish points of models doing nothing every time they fire on a vehicle. ?

Ideally you won't need them for vehicles, and they'll be a very diverse anti-infantry squad that can also shred tanks as necessary.

[kraken]

Actually I welcome actual constructive crit, no really. You find an actual problem with my stuff, PM me, talk to me about it , I'll take it on board an often act on it.

In the same breath I know when 'constructive criticism' is just someone trying to enlarge their epeen. of course it does help if their is actually an error....

2500 points kinda explains it. The indi events round here are 1750 and GW forces us to play 1500 for ToS.

I find 1500 too one dimensional and rock-paper-scissors like personally, the lists that are any good are too stripped down to have much character. I'm struggling with DE lists sub 1750 atm .... just cannot write a 1500 that will either compete and/or I like. 2.5k is too far the other way IMO

[Aschen]

I just played a team game with a 850pt DE list. and I figured I'd give my opinions on the different units I used.

First of all, my HQ. a Haemonculus. God this guy really didnt do much for me. The liquifier gun seemed to do well the one time I used it. Even at a high ap against space marines, it still performed well. 2 wounds. But once I got him into combat, he just felt like an overpriced marine with a horrid save. FNP is useful and all...but not quite as useful when you only have 3 toughness

Troops? I had warriors with splinter cannon/shredder. Very useful inside the transports. Though how fast can you move and still fire outta the thing?

Incubi? Ammmaxing. hard hitting, good saves. swings quickly. Whats not to love? Finding a way to give em an invul save would be really nice...

Trueborn? They worked out pretty well too. Unfortunately I had an assault/infantry killer squad. transport got killed. I dropped some shredders on them, they fell back and killed two of my guys. Not sure if I should rethink the effectiveness...or if its just really bad dice roll

as for transports...
Raiders.- YAAAY for flickerfields. Saved my ass so many times. Got exploded once..and was like "wait! I get a cover save!" aaand saved! Out of 2 venoms/2 raiders. I lost 1 raider, and 1 venom got immobilized.

I never thought AT would be a prollem for DE. But sheesh.

Anti Infantry though. Good lord we got that won!

[Krayd]

I just played a team game with a 850pt DE list. and I figured I'd give my opinions on the different units I used.

First of all, my HQ. a Haemonculus. God this guy really didnt do much for me. The liquifier gun seemed to do well the one time I used it. Even at a high ap against space marines, it still performed well. 2 wounds. But once I got him into combat, he just felt like an overpriced marine with a horrid save. FNP is useful and all...but not quite as useful when you only have 3 toughness

Troops? I had warriors with splinter cannon/shredder. Very useful inside the transports. Though how fast can you move and still fire outta the thing?

Remember, Haemonculi have T4.

Vehicles can't move further than 6" and allow passengers to fire. You can, however, move 12", disembark the passengers, and have them fire.

[Souleater]

So, yeah, Incubi. I'll be fielding them in a squad of 6 or 7. Why? Cause I took five plus my Archon and charged into 7 Plague Marines, lost by one and was run down.

THE HUMILIATION KNOWS NO BOUNDS.

Scourges...isn't it great that we finally have units that need a debate over the most effective weapons?

I've had reasonable success with a unit of 6 with Splinter Cannons but they fall down against - yes you guessed it - the stupid Plague Marines. I think it must by the stench every time I try to kill them I whiff (ho-freaking-ho) my to hit rolls.

I like the idea of DSing in with Heat Lances. Not only do the weapons work against HI/MCs as already stated but they kill vehilces when in range too. Sure, the troops could counter charge the scourges but the Bird Men shouldn't be attacking on their own anyway - there should be other units nearby ready to assault the enemy or provide a greater threat.

OTOH I think Blasters are the superior weapon for attacking MCs and multi-wound T4 models.

[Lord Khabal]

I still thnk that heat lances are for the reavers. JSJ is great with them. Ds is too risky and HLances need to be within 9" to be effective.
wow! 5 Incubi+archon lost to 7 plague marines? that is tough... Instead of using archon put 7-8 with klaivex+onslaught and a haemonculus. Its cheaper and 3+/Fnp makes them imune to low S attacks.

[Souleater]

I think Klaviex with Onslaught is a very worthwhile upgrade. Haemonculus loses the unit Fleet, though. I still think Incubi should be with the Archon

[Your Mum Rang]

Quick question... can you use Sliscus' deep strike and drop a WWP from a deep-striking Raider in the same turn?

[Bolter Bait]

Quick question... can you use Sliscus' deep strike and drop a WWP from a deep-striking Raider in the same turn?

Yes, provided the model carrying the WWP can disembark and has room to drop the portal.

Though I have to ask, why? At the earliest, the WWP is setup turn 2 and no unit would be able to arrive from the portal until turn 3, since the WWP drops after Reserves arrive that turn. It's too risky a tactic, especially if the WWP fails to arrive early but your other units do.