Epic Horus Heresy project

[dracpanzer]

Having been out of Epic after my gaming group gave it up in the wake of 40k v3, I started busting out the old figs after reading the first few HH novels. Once we had a few workable forces painted up we tried out the various rulesets. And eventually settled upon a few modifications to the standard FoW ruleset for our Epic battles.

Namely changing the way artillery works, just had to get a scatter dice in there somewhere! Plugging in an Elan test against the pinning effect of FoW Defensive fire rules. And attaching Force morale directly to the scenario objectives rather than to platoon losses or the tactic of eliminating your opponents HQ then forcing a company morale check to auto win the game.

To revive the flavor of Epic in the system. We created Legion specific special rules for each of the nine legions fighting for either Horus or the Emperor. Each Legion has its own opposing side twin if you will. To liven it up a bit we went a bit further with each player starting the game with a deck of cards that have in game effects with specific requirements to using them. We were leary of them at first, but they've turned out to be one of the funnest things about our Epic:Fow games.

I'll get into the ins and outs of it if anyone is interested, but namely, these rules allowed us to field companies of SM's in 6 base detachments from Epic of old plugged in as platoons. Taking a bit of license on the size of a Heresy era SM company, we built them out to be ten platoons (6 base detachments) of infantry models per force. With attached rhino's, land raiders, whirlwinds, artillery, titans, air power added on.

These two things combined, gave us exactly what we were looking for in a game of Epic. Really Large games, with most of them involving 400+ bases of Space Marines plus all of the attached vehicles. We like our games fast, which is why we went with the FoW rules as a base, and we've been very happy with the results.

As a side note, we're well on our way to having a force painted up for each of the First Founding Legions in Heresy Era colors.

We're kind of out in the middle of nowhere as far as Epic goes. Nobody within a days drive has shown any semblence of interest. So if it isn't an issue I'm looking to use these Forums as a place to document and sound board our efforts if you will. Hopefully you'll enjoy the ride, the pics, and we'll all learn a few things about Epic battles with little plastic figs =]

To start off, here are a few pics of our last battle at the local GS. Imperial Fists, Ultramarines, and Salamanders facing off against Emperors Children, Iron Warriors and World Eaters. We picked randomly from the stack of armies to decide on what forces we used, so I can only say the scenario has no basis on any fluff. It was fun though. Loyalist victory in the end.

Questions, comments, criticisms as always are welcome =]

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[SneakyChris]

Wow, pics look awesome fella. Keen to find out more about the specific rules and cards.

Paint job is great btw.

[dracpanzer]

One of the first Companies I put together were my Raven Guard. I play them when I'm playing 40k. The force is built around four tactical detachments, with two detachments of devs, two of assault marines and two detachments of bikes. We built our bike detachments to six bases, unlike the usual Epic SM bike units. There's also a full company of Land Raiders, ten Rhino's, some whirlwinds and a squadron of speeders.

I've since gotten my hands on a lot of attack bikes, and more speeders. So they'll be getting some reinforcements in this area once I get back around to working on them. They're painted with a light drybrush of shadow gray over a black base, with a wash of the old black ink. Bolters and weapons picked out with boltgun and with white Legion symbols and the occasional white helm.

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[dracpanzer]

Wow, pics look awesome fella. Keen to find out more about the specific rules and cards.

Thanks much SC!

Not sure how much you know of the FoW ruleset, but as much as we like the speed and ease at which it plays, there are things about it that we didn't like. Most notably the way FoW uses Company Morale Checks and Victory Points. We were able to change these both by modifying the game scenario and victory conditions.

As much as we love the Defensive Fire mechanic, we thought it lacked a little in that if a unit was hit five times by DF that they were instantly pinned and unable to make an assault. We changed it to force any assaulting unit that would be pinned by DF to push through it by passing a motivation check, modified by subtracting the losses from DF from that check.

We also gave units that had fallen below half strength to join up with other platoons, reinforcing the platoon they joined so long as the new platoon was not increased beyond its original maximum strength.

The 6" square artillery template is just way too big for Epic. We replaced it with a 3" round template. And allowed each artillery piece in the battery to roll ONCE to range in on the target platoon. Each successful hit roll awards the bombardment one 3" template. The first is placed when targeting begins, any additional templates are placed with a scatter dice for direction in btb contact with the first. 'Hit' results allow the player to place them as desired.

[dracpanzer]

These are the Legion rules we've come up with so far in our games. We're trying to find SIMPLE rules that provide the flavor of each of the individual Legions without overbalancing the game one way or the other. In some instances Legions have the same rule for different reasons. The Iron Hands legion has 'bolter drill' simply due to the volume of fire they can put down range. While the Thousand Sons have the same rule to reflect their use of the Arcane to inflict additional damage.

These rules are still solidly in the playtest category, so while we like the idea of them. And recognize that some of these rules are constantly in place while others are only one time use for a unit or situation specific. We're trying to determine where they might end up in balance while still fulfilling the 'flavor' of the specific Legions.

All thoughts, criticisms, complaints or suggestions as always are greatly appreciated.

Legion Specific Special Rules: Each of the 18 First Founding Legions have a specific special rule that where applicable applies to any SM unit in their force.

Space Marine Legions:
I Dark Angels : Stubborn
II -----------
III Emperors Children : Expertise
IV Iron Warriors : Siegemaster
V White Scars : Light Units
VI Space Wolves : Vengeful
VII Imperial Fists : Siegemaster
VIII Night Lords : Flamer Troops
IX Blood Angels : Fanatical
X Iron Hands : Bolter Drill
XI -----------
XII World Eaters : Vengeful
XIII Ultramarines : Expertise
XIV Death Guard : Stubborn
XV Thousand Sons : Bolter Drill
XVI Sons of Horus : Air Assault
XVII Word Bearers : Fanatical
XVIII Salamanders : Flamer Troops
XIX Raven Guard : Air Assault
XX Alpha Legion : Light Units

Stubborn - Units allowed to re-roll motiviation checks during assaults.
Expertise - Units may take a Skill Check to gain a 4" move during the assault phase.
Air Assault - Units may move, fire and assault the turn in which they arrive via deepstrike.
Vengeful - Units may re-roll failed Skill Checks in Assaults.
Bolter Drill - Units may re-roll misses when firing Rapid.
Light Units - Units may use the Recce Deployment rule.
Fanatical - Opposing Units must pass a Motivation check to assault Fanatical units.
Flamer Troops - Tactical units may fire as SMG bases during their own shooting phase.
Siegemaster - Units may 'Dig In' without giving up Gone to Ground.

[dracpanzer]

Our Sons of Horus Company is tactical troop heavy. With seven Tactical detachments, one Assault detachment and two Devestator detachments. This is backed up with the usual full Land Raider company, ten Rhino's, and Whirlwinds. We've since added two Dreadnoughts to all of the forces and are in the process of adding either a Mole Mortar unit or a Thudd Gun unit along with a Thunderhawk to each company as well.

The Sons of Horus are painted with a heavy drybrush of Catachen Green over a black base coat. A light drybrush of Codex Gray was used after that. Weapons were picked out with Boltgun Metal and the 'Eye' emblem was picked out in white.

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We tried to make our Ultramarine Company as balanced and 'Codex' like as possible. So they're built around a base of six Tactical detachments with two each of Assault and Devestator detachments. The were also the first to receive their Dreadnoughts and Mole Mortar detachment and are also joined by a Land Speeder detachment for a Recce unit. They are joined by a full Land Raider company, ten Rhino's and a detachment of Whirlwinds.

Their paint scheme is a heavy drybrush of Regal Blue over a black base, followed by a drybrush of Ultramarine Blue and then a highlight of Skull white. Weapons were picked out with Boltgun Metal then emblems were added with Skull white.

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Our Imperial Fist company is still lacking emblems for the vehicles... But is based on six Tactical detachments along with one Assault and one Bike detachment backed up by two Devestator detachments. Dreadnoughts, Land Speeders and Thudd Guns are on the way to bolster the Land Raider company, Rhino's and Whirlwinds they already have.

The Fists were painted with a coat of Sunburst Yellow over a white base. A highlight of Skull White was added before a wash of Gryphon Seppia. Weapons picked out with Boltgun Metal. The emblems were made by applying a dot of Chaos Black, with the center picked out again with Skull White. The Fists then were added with Chaos Black.

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Our Death Guard company is built on seven Tactical detachments with two Devestator detachments. Currently the tenth is an Assault detachment, but its going to be replaced by a detachment of Death Guard Terminators. They just seem more like Death Guard =] They'll definately be getting some Mole Mortars and have had their Dreadnoughts added along with the usual Land Raider Company, Rhino's and Whirlwinds.

They were painted with a Fortress Gray drybrush over a Panzer Gray basecoat. They were then given a Topside Highlight of Skull White. Camo Green was added on the shoulder pad trim. Weapons in Boltgun Metal with the Legion symbol made from a Skull White mushroom 'skull' shape in a Chaos Black circle.

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Inspired by our local Iron Warriors desire to have a very shooty force. We built the company simply with six Tactical detachments supporting four Devestator detachments. Currently they're backed up by the usual Land Raider company, Rhino's and Whirlwinds. Thudd Guns are on the way. We're also working on some Epic IG bombards/siege tower conversions for Iron Warrior inspired Daemon Engines down the road.

So far they've been one of our scrappiest Companies. We've since painted up a company of World Eaters as a form of therapy for our IW player.....

They were painted with a heavy drybrush of Boltgun Metal over a black base. A wash of Badab Black was then applied to the entire model. Weapons were then picked out with Boltgun Metal, weapon details picked out first with Skull White then Sunburst Yellow. Given a wash of Gryphon Seppia and then detailed with the black lines to give them the 'caution stripe' look. The legion symbol is made from a Chaos Black circle with a 'mushroom' skull of Mithril Silver.

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Our Salamander force is built in the image of its player. Currently two Devestator detachments support three Terminator detachments rounded out by five Tactical detachments. Once they arrive from ebay, a Tactical detachment will be removed to find a spot for a fourth Terminator detachment. Although they have had their Dreadnoughts added, they still lack their Mole Mortars. They have a full Land Raider company, but will have some added with the newly arriving Terminators backed up by some Whirlwinds.

The Salamanders were painted with the Dark Orkshade Green over a black basecoat. They were then drybrushed with Catachan Green and Highlighted with Sunburst Yellow. Weapons were picked out with Boltgun Metal and Legion symbols picked out with Skull White. The Terminator detachment flames were first picked out with Skull White, painted Sunburst Yellow, with a line of Blood Red at the bottom. A was of Gryphon Seppia was then added between the two.

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These are our first foray into our Titan Legion assets. These are from the Fire Wasps and Deaths Head Legions. Still debating what other Legions to add, so far the Storm Lords and Warp Runners are in the lead. We intend to focus on the Titan Legions more once all of the eighteen SM legion forces are complete. With each Titan Legion having a pair of Warhounds, a Reaver and one or Two Warlord Titans. We have two Imperators that will be added, dunno who will get those in the end though.

The Fire Wasps
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The Deaths Heads
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Our World Eaters are based on four Tactical detachments with two each of Bike, Assault and Devestator detachments. They've got the usual two Dreadnoughts, Land Raider company, Rhino's and Whirlwind detachment. Being the deveotee of Khorne, we're assembling and working on a variety of of Daemon Engines for them.

The paint scheme is a wash of Badab Black over a white base coat. Shoulders picked out with Regal Blue. Weapons with Boltgun Metal. A Blood Red circle to represent the maw with a Lightning Blue orb for the planet inside it. Snot Green and Bleached Bone were dappled inside to make the land masses.

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Wanting to take advantage of the Night Lord Legion rules that benefit Tactical Marines. We built the Night Lords around six Tactical detachments, two Bike detachments and two Assault detachments. Dreadnoughts, company of Land Raiders, Rhino's, Whirlwinds and Land Speeders round out the force for now.

Paint scheme was a heavy drybrush of Regal Blue over a black basecoat. Drybrush of Enchanted Blue over that. Lightning was painted in with first Lightning Blue and then Highlighted with Skull White. The models were then given a coat of the old Citadel Blue Glaze. Weapons were picked out with Boltgun Metal then given a coat of Badab Black. Legion symbols were painted with a 'mushroom' skull of Bleached Bone, washed with Devlan Mud and then the wings were added in Blood Red.

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Iron Hands force built around six Tactical detachments with two Devestator and two Terminator detachments. They'll be getting some Mole Mortars or Thudd Guns, but already have their two Dreadnoughts, Land Raider company, Rhino's and Whirlwinds.

They had a simple paint scheme with a light drybrush of Shadow Gray over a black basecoat. Weapons picked out with Boltgun metal and washed with Badab Black. The hands were then picked out with Mithril Silver. Legion emblem was a circle of Skull White, Chaos Black inside of it and the Hand painted in Mithril Silver.

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Our Emperors Children force is built around six Tactical detachments with two Devestator detachments. Currently it has one Terminator detachment and one Assault detachment. But the Assault marines will likely be removed to add in an additional Terminator platoon. We'll be adding a standard bearer to the 2IC base, as well as Mole Mortars. They have the usual two Dreadnoughts, Land Raider company, Rhino's and Whirlwinds. Still trying to work out some Daemon Engines for them.

They were painted with a heavy drybrush of Liche Purple over a black basecoat. Drybrushed with Tentacle Pink and then given a coat of the old Purple Ink. Weapons picked out with Boltgun Metal, Legion symbols painted first in Chaos Black then again in Gold. For the vehicles the gold was then drybrushed with Devlan Mud.

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[Sureshot05]

That is some truly inspiring stuff and looks amazing. Wish I had more to say than that, but it is really superb. Any chance of a loyalist and a traitor group shot each?

[dracpanzer]

That is some truly inspiring stuff and looks amazing. Wish I had more to say than that, but it is really superb.

Thx a ton!

Any chance of a loyalist and a traitor group shot each?

I can work on it, don't have the best lighting here at the house. Might have to wait till we get to the game club for that big of a space. I take my test shots and what not under a desk lamp =] But I'll try and get some shots up soon.

[dracpanzer]

We had a game between Death Guard and Iron Hands last night. Each force had one objective in their deployment zones, three across the middle of the field. The bridge and one bunker to each side of it. The Death Guard fought valiently to secure the bridge under a withering fire while assaulting both of the flank objectives.

The Iron Hands were able to beat them back at first, but the flanks were annihilated in the Death Guard counter attack. A last drive to claim then in turn three was beaten back once more by the Death Guard in turn four. The Iron Hands reserves failed to arrive, and they failed four un-pin checks that might have allowed them to contest the objectives for one more turn till their reserves arrived.

Death Guard Victory, turn Five.

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[fattdex]

An epic of epic epicness!!

This is a great reason to buy up the old Space Marine lots on ebay!! they look great.

[malika]

I'm very curious how you will do the Alpha Legion. I hope to see lots of operatives! (why no infiltration rules for them?) The Word Bearers should also have hordes of cannon fodder running in front of them!

[chrach]

You magnificent bastard- great work.

[dracpanzer]

I'm very curious how you will do the Alpha Legion. I hope to see lots of operatives! (why no infiltration rules for them?)

They're certainly one of the harder legions to get the flavor of and have it come across on the tabletop. We're currently toying with the idea of 'operative' units being allowed in their army list. Perhaps Assassins/Snipers allowed as characters, similar to Techmarines, Apothecaries, Chaplains and what not?

The Alpha Legion has never really 'inspired' me if you will. So if anyone has the feel for them, we're open to suggestions of course. Not sure if you're familiar with how Snipers work in FoW. But I'd think an Epic'd up version of them would be pretty cool. Give them some manner of assault along with shooting/pinning.

Would you suggest going with an assassin that combines the different types so as to keep the rule simple?

We had a quick brain storm about modifying the ability the White Scars and Alpha Legion got. Seems everyone was pretty much in a greement with a change. They just haven't been on our radar much yet. At this point we're thinking of giving both the Legions the Recce Deployment ability from page 148 in the FoW rulebook.

The rule would work the same for both, but represent two different ways the Legions would go about it.

The Word Bearers should also have hordes of cannon fodder running in front of them!

Way ahead of you on that one =] Trying to cure my terrible terrain problem at the in home game room right now. But the Word Bearers are next on the paint table.

As always, all comments, criticisms, and ideas are most welcome!

[dracpanzer]

Here are some pics of the Traitor Legions we have done currently. Got enough terrain work done to put a board together. They take up quite a bit of space, so there are three pics to get all of the Traitors in.

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And a closer shot of each of the Legions. Back to terrain work, enjoy!

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[dracpanzer]

These are some thoughts we've had on Converting Epic to use with the FoW rules. I'll include more as I get to them, we come up with new ones or what have you. Some of these rules are not necessarily just straight conversions from one system to another, but changes we decided to implement to make the rules play more Epic like. Or simply because we didn't like the rule as written in FoW. Thoughts as always are appreciated.

#1 Armor Value vs Anti-Tank Value:
FoW goes the opposite route for resolving hits against Armored Vehicles than 40k. Once a AV is hit, the owning player rolls a d6 save adding it to the Armor of the model, hoping to beat the AT of the firing weapon. Some changes were in order to reflect the current value of weapons vs vehicles according to 40k stats with this system.

Assuming a S9 lascannon has a 1/6 chance to penetrate an AV 14 Land Raider, we flip-flopped the die roll and reduced the AV of a Land Raider to 7. Giving the owning player a 1/6 chance to fail their armor save and allow a penetrating hit. Predators would therefore have a 6, Rhinos and Whirlwinds a 4, Land Speeders a 3. I leave it up to other players to determine how many differing weapons they'll use, but this system allows you to use the strengths directly from their 40k stat lines.

#2 Infantry Saves:
The standard for FoW is a 3+ save for ALL infantry models taking hits from firing units. This of course assumes everyone is wearing cloth uniforms and no real armor whatsoever. For simplicity, we assigned this save to the typcial Space Marine in Power Armor or their equivelant. In order to give Terminators a more substantial presence upon the battlefield we gave them a 2+ save. All other infantry models were given a 4+ save.

#3 Invulnerable Saves:
All infantry models roll against their standard infantry save against any hits resulting from the fire of enemy units. In order to make the 'Heroic' character types seem that way. We decided to give them a 4+ invulnerable save against hits resulting during the assault phase. Where normally models would receive no saves whatsoever. Characters, Terminators and the like are typical units that have Invulnerable Saves.

#4 The Devestator Rule:
Devestator Units are not single purpose units like their counterparts in FoW. Where Epic has SM's using Lascannons, Heavy Bolters and the like, FoW would have Machines Guns in one unit and Anti-Tank Guns in another. To bridge this gap, we applied an 'Either Or' mechanic to Devestator bases. They can either fire RoF 3 against infantry, or a RoF 1 AT 9 unit against Armored Vehicles.

#5 War Gear:
Any unit that fulfills the 'fluff' requirement gains the War Gear ability. Which allows them a second skill check die in Assaults, against armor they have an AT of 5.

#6 Stable Platform:
Certain infantry models are afforded a stable firing platform. Simply speaking this allows the model to fire as if it were standing still whether it has moved or not.

#7 Space Marine Dreadnoughts:
Looking to avoid targeting issues, hit allocation problems and what not that kept cropping up when Dreadnoughts were attached to SM detachments. We decided to remove them from the Vehicle list altogether and classify them as infantry. Likewise to give them the flavor a dreadnought invokes, they were given an Inv. Save, War Gear, Stable Platform, and the Devestator Rule. Which gives them a 3+ save against enemy fire, a 4+ save and two attacks in assaults. With the option of firing either one AT 9 shot at vehicles or 3 dice against infantry whether they move or not during the movement phase.

MORE TO COME!

[CheesyRobMan]

The models look fantastic! Great to see fully painted armies

[dracpanzer]

Took a bit to get some time to set up our Loyalists for some pics. Here are a few of the assembled Legions.

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And a closer look at each of the individual companies.

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Now on to the Reinforcements!

These are the first two test bases for my Word Bearer company.

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I tend to favor the look of the Word Bearers from the First Heretic where most of the Brothers at Isstvan were still in black. Or so it seemed anyways. Wanted to utilise the Chaos SM figures for them since they were a bit different from the other legions at the time.

Simple paint scheme. Codex Gray drybrush over a black base, with a Fortress Gray highlight over that. Weapon picked out with Boltgun Metal and washed with Badab Black. Horns picked out with Bleached Bone and washed with Devlan Mud. Books on the shoulder pads with Bestial Brown. Flames in the Legion emblem, cloaks, banners and such picked out with Skull White, painted with Sunburst Yellow, bottom of the flames lined in with Blood Red. Gryphon Seppia used to blur the space between with an orange look.

Daemons and Cultists will be following in the Word Bearers wake.

As always, all thoughts, ideas and comments appreciated.

[malika]

What about adding the Gal Vorbak of Argel Tal to the Word Bearers? They are basically the elite company of the Legion, the first to wear crimson red and mostly possessed if I'm not mistaken.

[dracpanzer]

What about adding the Gal Vorbak of Argel Tal to the Word Bearers? They are basically the elite company of the Legion, the first to wear crimson red and mostly possessed if I'm not mistaken.

Great idea, not sure exactly how I can make them look possessed, not much of a scuptor sadly.... But I'd love to be able to bring some of that flavor into the force.

On a side note, absolutely loved how they were portrayed in First Heretic. It makes sense that possessed Marines would survive if the daemon goes in slumber mode once they're out of combat. Didn't seem like they'd last ten thousand years if they were gibbering, drooling, bloodthirsty psychotics all the time.

"For the last time Dark Apostle, could you please keep your Chosen from pooing all over the command deck? It's hard enough to discuss plans to overthrow the Corpse God Emperor with the World Eaters always playing with their chain axes. Do we have to keep stepping in Poo as well?"

[malika]

You might want to read the three Word Bearer novels (Dark Creed, Dark Apostle and Dark Disciple), there are some possessed characters in there who are sort of in control of themselves.

As for modelling them. How about chopping up some marines and chopping up and deamons and put them together?