Official WarSeer Finecast Poll.

[75hastings69]

So from what people are saying so far, the resin may be "unique" in it's mixture but it does not offer any unique features. I have to say though, that for me, the balance, in how porous it is, the safety angle, and the resilience are a pretty good combination.

So it's safe, durable, porous, but useless for casting fine detailed minis in ..... maybe that's what makes it unique?

I'd have been better off getting my dog to fill a jelly mould with exrement than using the finecast mangler squigs! (I'd need to paint it obviously )

[Druchii Monkey]

So it's safe, durable, porous, but useless for casting fine detailed minis in

For detailed minis it rocks - here is my challenge to you given you appear game for trying and trying and trying again - go and buy Golfag Maneater - check the box before you take it home - make sure you have a good one then take a look at all the details at your leisure and honestly compare it to what you think they could have done in plastic or metal. That is Finecast.

What is not is the tedium of having to deal with failed casts, returning your products, the same product miscast yet again, failed batches, those are a genuine set of problems that GW need to sort out, not limited to Finecast - but certainly seriously affecting some Finecast releases e.g. Wracks and Sternguard. They need to sort their quality assurance out, but saying goodbye to Finecast would be a shame.

I'd have been better off getting my dog to fill a jelly mould with exrement than using the finecast mangler squigs! (I'd need to paint it obviously )

You've got a talented dog. Seriously though there is no way i would buy the mangler squigs without checking them in the shop first, large demanding model, first batch, it's crying out risky purchase, but with the serious flaws on yours you would have spotted the problems in a second. Its a little like you keep stepping in that jelly mould your dog filled up with excrement again and again without so much as looking. At least look twice and tread in something perfectly formed.

[EmperorNorton]

For detailed minis it rocks - here is my challenge to you given you appear game for trying and trying and trying again - go and buy Golfag Maneater - check the box before you take it home - make sure you have a good one then take a look at all the details at your leisure and honestly compare it to what you think they could have done in plastic or metal. That is Finecast.

I suggest you take a look at what level of detail Dark Sword Miniatures can reproduce in metal.
Although admittedly, that's a 54mm mini.
But I like the 32mm version of the same character better anyway. I happen to own that one and the casting is perfect.
I don't think that anything GW has to offer, metal or resin, comes even close to this level of fine detail. All Golfag has going for him are bountiful amounts of random crap hanging on him.

[75hastings69]

You've got a talented dog. Seriously though there is no way i would buy the mangler squigs without checking them in the shop first, large demanding model, first batch, it's crying out risky purchase, but with the serious flaws on yours you would have spotted the problems in a second. Its a little like you keep stepping in that jelly mould your dog filled up with excrement again and again without so much as looking. At least look twice and tread in something perfectly formed.

It was bought for me as an Xmas gift in store. I only got it early so I could take it to work with me and make/paint it over Xmas. As for the other point about it screaming "risky purchase" none of the minis should be screaming this as GW are marketing them as the best in the world so why would any of them be risky? .... unless of course you're admitting that the medium and method used for casting aren't suitable for mass produced products? (but then again GW says it is?)

I suggest you take a look at what level of detail Dark Sword Miniatures can reproduce in metal.
Although admittedly, that's a 54mm mini.
But I like the 32mm version of the same character better anyway. I happen to own that one and the casting is perfect.
I don't think that anything GW has to offer, metal or resin, comes even close to this level of fine detail. All Golfag has going for him are bountiful amounts of random crap hanging on him.

I agree. The finecrap golgfag is nothing than couldn't have been cast in metal by pretty much any company in the last 10 years. Andrea miniatures for example have made metal models (that I've never had a miscast of) that makes golgfag look like a child's fridge drawing.

[Emperors Teeth]

Post virtually any link of something Rackham did for Confrontation or Hybrid and that argument is pretty much debunked also.

[Druchii Monkey]

I suggest you take a look at what level of detail Dark Sword Miniatures can reproduce in metal.
Although admittedly, that's a 54mm mini.
But I like the 32mm version of the same character better anyway. I happen to own that one and the casting is perfect.
I don't think that anything GW has to offer, metal or resin, comes even close to this level of fine detail.

I like the Ser Loras Tyrell model. Certainly looks nice and detailed.

All Golfag has going for him are bountiful amounts of random crap hanging on him.

It's subjective. Assume you've seen the model in the flesh? Fantastic piece of work old Golfag!

As for the other point about it screaming "risky purchase" none of the minis should be screaming this as GW are marketing them as the best in the world so why would any of them be risky?

Funnily enough marketing and reality do tend to diverge somewhat or do you believe all marketing pitches literally - you'll be sorely disappointed.

Risky means check in store just in case because you may just get a bad one and lose some time, valuable as it is that's all you will lose. Just as risky as my two metal kit purchases from GW - Morathi and Louencouer - both miscast and part of a bad batch but dealt with by GW's solid exchange policy. Lost some time, was cheesed off but came through in the end.

.... unless of course you're admitting that the medium and method used for casting aren't suitable for mass produced products? (but then again GW says it is?)

Not at all. Just saying i would have checked, because sometimes they have bad batches, and the impact on larger kits tends to be more severe.

I agree. The finecrap golgfag is nothing than couldn't have been cast in metal by pretty much any company in the last 10 years. Andrea miniatures for example have made metal models (that I've never had a miscast of) that makes golgfag look like a child's fridge drawing.

You've clearly got a talented child doing your fridge drawings as Golfag looks great. Would not want him in metal - too heavy and a pain to put together - i'll stick with Finecast thanks!

Post virtually any link of something Rackham did for Confrontation or Hybrid and that argument is pretty much debunked also.

Love the look of the Rackham miniatures but never seen them in the flesh. Didn't they go out of business and isn't one of their dudes working for GW now?

For the price GW is asking, no one should have to check to make sure the box contains a "good one" before purchasing it.

Price is irrelevant - you should "always" get a good one, but "sometimes" you don't, like all products, then you get it exchanged for a "good one". Price is relevant once you have a "good one" - separate topic though.

[Mastodon]

I just cant take anyone seriously when they start using words like finecrap, fineca$h etc. Its like saying Micro$oft. All the valid points in your argument go out the window because the retarded buzzwords just make me roll my eyes.


And on the subject of the mangler squig, while its defective, its nothing I havent seen on forgeworld stuff before. The main issue is the miscast crew. When you've had a tau battlesuit that has a chest shaped like a Z instead of a square then you can complain about mold slip.

[Hellebore]

I just cant take anyone seriously when they start using words like finecrap, fineca$h etc. Its like saying Micro$oft. All the valid points in your argument go out the window because the retarded buzzwords just make me roll my eyes.

But it's ok for GW to NAME its own product and TM it with a buzzword? The difference between saying Micro$oft and Failcast etc is that Microsoft didn't name their product Victorywin.

GW started the buzzword war by firing the first shot and then claiming what they said was entirely true. The evidence suggests this is a lie. So currently these 'buzzwords' are more accurate than the term GW itself uses.

I'm not calling a product a positive name just because the company TMed it. That's 1984 politico speak, making the term inherently positive so that anyone trying to talk about it has no choice but to imply its quality simply by mentioning its name.

So you may think failcast is a buzzword that destroys a valid argument but i see anyone still using the name Finecast in a similar way. It's not fine in any way shape or form. I wouldn't call you Godlordofpants just because you changed your name to that. You can't buy respect with weasel words.

What's next? GW no longer 'price' their products? Now all GW miniatures have an 'international numeral system' added to them, making them the greatest invention since tha abacus?

How many apple employees does it take to change a lightbulb? None, they just redefine darkness as a feature...

So I'll make you a deal, stop using blatantly false buzzwords regarding GW's resin and I won't call it Failcast.

Hellebore

[paddyalexander]

Actualy I find the term "finecast" to be a terribly ironic name for such a shoddy product, hence why I simply refer to the product by its given name. To anyone who has had any experience with the product & has not drank the gwPLC cool aid then the name certainly does not imply a quality product.

I have no problem with people using names like failcrap to imply their feeling towards the product with simplicity for those who have no experience with the product. Why should someone who has a negitive experience with a product use a positive term when refering to it just because it is being sold under a possitivly named trademark.

What I find hilarious is the number of "gwPLC intusiasts" who seem to feel like it is their duty to jump to the defence of a companies trademark.

[Voss]

I just cant take anyone seriously when they start using words like finecrap, fineca$h etc. Its like saying Micro$oft. All the valid points in your argument go out the window because the retarded buzzwords just make me roll my eyes.

So is that like not taking people seriously because they don't speak perfect English or have an 'ignorant' accent? The content is what matters, not the decoration. Though using 'retarded' as negative adjective adds a heavy level of irony to your statement.

And on the subject of the mangler squig, while its defective, its nothing I havent seen on forgeworld stuff before. The main issue is the miscast crew. When you've had a tau battlesuit that has a chest shaped like a Z instead of a square then you can complain about mold slip.

Bad fortune passes everywhere, but a miscast FW piece doesn't justify problems with finecast.

[Spiney Norman]

So from what people are saying so far, the resin may be "unique" in it's mixture but it does not offer any unique features. I have to say though, that for me, the balance, in how porous it is, the safety angle, and the resilience are a pretty good combination.

I'd say finecast has many unique features
It is overly flexible, brittle, and prone to deformity and miscasting on a scale unmatched by the resin any other miniature company in the world uses. The chances are that these features are unique because they are undesirable things in a wargame model, so should be really be surprised that they are unique?

[75hastings69]

And on the subject of the mangler squig, while its defective, its nothing I havent seen on forgeworld stuff before. The main issue is the miscast crew. When you've had a tau battlesuit that has a chest shaped like a Z instead of a square then you can complain about mold slip.

The "worst" part is the crew, but the "main" issue is the whole cast sucks! I can complain about mold slip when the product I've bought suffers from it to a degree that it detriments on the use of that kit.

[Druchii Monkey]

What I find hilarious is the number of "gwPLC intusiasts" who seem to feel like it is their duty to jump to the defence of a companies trademark.

For me it's not about the trademark or the PLC, apart from that fact they have provided me with a great hobby over many years. The issue i have with the "failcast" term is it is a blanket term used to describe a large range of issues, some to do with price, some to do with logistics, quality control, and then the actual suitability of the product for purpose. I prefer specifics because i think blanket terms such as this fail to pinpoint problems, fail to make a point, and completely lose the fact that once all the other issues are sorted Finecast sculpts are a great quality of product that no doubt have had a lot of hard work put into them by sculptors and technicians and i think the blanket term does them an injustice.

However, unfortunately, it works as a term to be used by those who cannot deal with calling it Finecast, their right and understandable, but in some posts the anger associated with the use of the term and the reuse of the term again and again seems to go beyond simply being uncomfortable using the word Finecast, just an observation.

For anyone interested here is a link to the thread in Future of Warseer section (you need to be logged in) which discusses the use of terminology to describe Finecast in detail, that thread now closed. "Finecrap" comments.

[75hastings69]

I use the term FineCRAP as it sums up my impressions of the product nicely. Even if/when they sort out the casting quality, they'll then need to look at the medium itself, as swords that curl up like the bits coming out of a pencil sharpener and horse legs giving way under the weight of the horse body and rider because (and I quote GW customer support) "if the resin hasn't been mixed properly softening can occur at ANY time in the future and doesn't necessarily need extreme heat to warp or sag the pieces" those were the exact words I was told by GW customer services after they spoke to the molding team after a friends LotR aragorn on horse collapsed. So you can spend hour making and painting a masterpiece for it to then just collapse at any given point in the future because the resin mix was slightly off????? how do you return it then?

[Druchii Monkey]

I use the term FineCRAP as it sums up my impressions of the product nicely. Even if/when they sort out the casting quality, they'll then need to look at the medium itself, as swords that curl up like the bits coming out of a pencil sharpener and horse legs giving way under the weight of the horse body and rider because (and I quote GW customer support) "if the resin hasn't been mixed properly softening can occur at ANY time in the future and doesn't necessarily need extreme heat to warp or sag the pieces" those were the exact words I was told by GW customer services after they spoke to the molding team after a friends LotR aragorn on horse collapsed. So you can spend hour making and painting a masterpiece for it to then just collapse at any given point in the future because the resin mix was slightly off????? how do you return it then?

I'd be absolutely fuming if this happened to me - might even put me off Finecast for life if that was my only experience with it - the only thing near to this i can remember is painting up twenty miniatures and giving them the Purity Seal varnish spray and them all going misty on me - turning all metallic paints to grey.

[Jonahmaul]

I've had this happen and it was incredibly frustrating! But I definitely think Finecast is an inappropriate term at the moment. GWs own 'blurb' claims it to be the best thing ever in miniature gaming (the future in fact) yet it fails on so many levels. Price is always going to be an issue and GW is a pretty expensive hobby but I wouldn't mind so much if we could be assured of spending money on a quality product. If a finecast miniature cost a pound or two more than the metal model then it's frustrating because the material itself is cheaper but if it does what GW had promised it does I'd be ok with it. The fact that we're being asked to pay a premium on a non-premium product is the problem. I was happy with my Hydra but overall I'm very cautious about buying anything finecast. It's especially galling when the plastics that GW have been releasing are of great quality

[75hastings69]

I'd be absolutely fuming if this happened to me - might even put me off Finecast for life if that was my only experience with it - the only thing near to this i can remember is painting up twenty miniatures and giving them the Purity Seal varnish spray and them all going misty on me - turning all metallic paints to grey.

A little OT but something similar happened to me. I painted a wl cannon (good metal one) and it was the best paint job I ever did, I was really pleased with it, then I sprayed it with purity seal and I was like I'd sprayed parts of it with the snow spray you use on windows at Xmas I was gutted called GW to find out there were a few bad batches of purity seal, and they sent me a new WL cannon.

[Jonahmaul]

This is definitely a positive for GW. Finecast may be failing in all sorts of ways but their customer service is excellent. This gives me genuine hope that we're going to see a marked improvement in Finecast. As people on this thread have attested, there have been some great Finecast casts, we just need this quality to be rolled out consistently.

[Zinge]

Yes customer services are great and seem to do all they can to help. Unfortunately fixing the finecast process is not in their remit. They can replace and refund til the cows come home but they can't improve the initial "service".

re: purity seal (and other spray varnishes) - the only fix that I have come across is to spray the models again in perfect conditions - sometimes this works especially if the varnish is fairly fresh

[Jonahmaul]

Sorry for the off topic but another method that I have heard of which did work for my miniatures (although not completely) is to gloss varnish them with the stuff out of a pot and then spray them with matt again to take the gloss off.