Storm of Magic pt2

[Tonny]

Geekiness and childishness are different things. I can only assume the 'LI' there is 'lacks imagination', which I feel is itself rather an immature jab. Because I don't like the idea of wizards climbing on platforms made of skulls to hurl the latest UberMegaDeath spell at enemies means I have no imagination? It's the kind of thing a child under 10 would come up with.



I disagree. Wargaming is largely not a children's hobby (given the nature of some of the materials used, neccesity for knives/drills/other dangerous tools, the patience and time required for assembly and painting etc), and WH certainly was not this child-friendly not that long ago. Designing 'terrain' that makes no attempt to look remotely serious (have you *seen* the comical reapers on one of these new 'fulcrums'?) goes against what I have always percieved WHFB to be.



Not among actual wargaming terrain, no. If I went looking in a toy shop, however, I almost certainly would find comparable pieces.



I certainly used to before I stopped playing it. Which was, coincidentally enough, about a year ago.




I fail to see how anyone could look at that Manticore and say it isn't objectively bad. The pose is laughable, the face is flat and frankly comical, the legs break even the most basic anatomical laws, and being pot-bellied doesn't exactly lend it any kind of threatening appearence. I won't even mention the conspicious hair tuft.

The Chimaera is better, but not by much. The pose, again, is uninspired and unthreatening, the dragon head looks more like some kind of frog, and the third head is just a goofy mess - I can't even tell what it's meant to resemble.

The Sorceress, which everyone seems to be going nuts over, is horrific. Female Elves, and DE Sorceresses in particular, are supposed to be beautiful and feminine. The 'Storm in a Teacup' one is neither, with the worst female face sculpt I have ever seen.

The Chaos Sorcerers are alright, but decidedly average, and given the 'premium product' advertising and pricing, I hold them to very high standards which they do not meet.

Ditto on the Dragon, though it's certainly better than the atrocious 'tripping over' HE Dragon.

The Necromancer and the Cockatrice are both much better.



Again, I fail to see how anyone can look at these pieces and not find them laughable. As I've said, they'd look more at home with a childs toy than on a wargaming table, as they are overly exaggerated and comical. The giant skulls and grim reapers look cheap (there's irony) and tacky. The kind of thing that's continually making WH look like a parody of itself, albeit without the self-awareness.



The quality of the products should speak louder than the hype generated. With 'Storm in a Teacup', it is not.
I see nothing but a desperate attempt to offload gimmicks and poor sculpts. Which sadly seems to be working.




Only for the armies that have said options. The very idea behind 'Storm in a Teacup' is to provide these monsters for every army, and is promoting that idea. What do you think will happen to players who are convinced to buy these monsters for an army that cannot usually use them when the hype dies off and 'Storm in a Teacup' becomes the rare LGS event?
I expect they'll feel a little silly for spending cash on a subpar monster, then.

Man, how many times are you going to post you don't like SoM. Really we get it....

[Hashulaman]

That's pretty sick. Even with empire cannons (my usual strategy for dealing with large monsters) you'd a ton of them to kill him: you'd need 3 to get through to kill him on average multi-wound rolls, you'd need 9 wounding to get three through the ward, which means you'd need 11 shots to hit him, and best results with the cannon shot means that you will hit a single 2" deep base model 2/3 of the time, so (ignoring the potential for engineer rerolls you'd need 17 cannon shots to take him out.

What's his Init? is purple sun or pit of shades the answer?

Ben

A GUO's Initiative is 4, so while poor for a DoC Lord or hero choice, it gives you a fighting chance. The bell is a bit situational, as is Crack's Call. The best way to take him out is hoping for a miscast and that your side has the puppet and his doesn't. Speaking of, imagine how much more broken the Puppet will be, I've heard talk of vortex shard spam, but that doesn't affect Dwarfs. Since Dwarfs can miscast now, the puppet can ruin their day. Am I the only one who thinks that this is even more of an asset to WoC? At the first team SoM game my store has, I intend to modify the miscast to turn every caster into a frog. I'ts worth it to see the look on everyones face, plus it is Tzeentchy.

As for a wizards duel....Yea, that would be interesting to see. You can imagine this High Elf Archmage trying to fight this GUO.


Elf: YOU....SHALL NOT....*squish*

[Deaceased]

Geekiness and childishness are different things. I can only assume the 'LI' there is 'lacks imagination', which I feel is itself rather an immature jab. Because I don't like the idea of wizards climbing on platforms made of skulls to hurl the latest UberMegaDeath spell at enemies means I have no imagination? It's the kind of thing a child under 10 would come up with.



I disagree. Wargaming is largely not a children's hobby (given the nature of some of the materials used, neccesity for knives/drills/other dangerous tools, the patience and time required for assembly and painting etc), and WH certainly was not this child-friendly not that long ago. Designing 'terrain' that makes no attempt to look remotely serious (have you *seen* the comical reapers on one of these new 'fulcrums'?) goes against what I have always percieved WHFB to be.



Not among actual wargaming terrain, no. If I went looking in a toy shop, however, I almost certainly would find comparable pieces.



I certainly used to before I stopped playing it. Which was, coincidentally enough, about a year ago.




I fail to see how anyone could look at that Manticore and say it isn't objectively bad. The pose is laughable, the face is flat and frankly comical, the legs break even the most basic anatomical laws, and being pot-bellied doesn't exactly lend it any kind of threatening appearence. I won't even mention the conspicious hair tuft.

The Chimaera is better, but not by much. The pose, again, is uninspired and unthreatening, the dragon head looks more like some kind of frog, and the third head is just a goofy mess - I can't even tell what it's meant to resemble.

The Sorceress, which everyone seems to be going nuts over, is horrific. Female Elves, and DE Sorceresses in particular, are supposed to be beautiful and feminine. The 'Storm in a Teacup' one is neither, with the worst female face sculpt I have ever seen.

The Chaos Sorcerers are alright, but decidedly average, and given the 'premium product' advertising and pricing, I hold them to very high standards which they do not meet.

Ditto on the Dragon, though it's certainly better than the atrocious 'tripping over' HE Dragon.

The Necromancer and the Cockatrice are both much better.



Again, I fail to see how anyone can look at these pieces and not find them laughable. As I've said, they'd look more at home with a childs toy than on a wargaming table, as they are overly exaggerated and comical. The giant skulls and grim reapers look cheap (there's irony) and tacky. The kind of thing that's continually making WH look like a parody of itself, albeit without the self-awareness.



The quality of the products should speak louder than the hype generated. With 'Storm in a Teacup', it is not.
I see nothing but a desperate attempt to offload gimmicks and poor sculpts. Which sadly seems to be working.




Only for the armies that have said options. The very idea behind 'Storm in a Teacup' is to provide these monsters for every army, and is promoting that idea. What do you think will happen to players who are convinced to buy these monsters for an army that cannot usually use them when the hype dies off and 'Storm in a Teacup' becomes the rare LGS event?
I expect they'll feel a little silly for spending cash on a subpar monster, then.

...My question is, since you stopped playing WHFB a year ago...why are you here again?

[MalusCalibur]

Man, how many times are you going to post you don't like SoM. Really we get it....

I'm merely responding to replies and criticisms at this point.

...My question is, since you stopped playing WHFB a year ago...why are you here again?

Because while I stopped playing I still have a great deal of invested time and interest in the WH universe, and would like to see it develop in a positive way.
This is not happening, so I decided to add my opinion to the discussion.

If one can call it that, since any attempt to discuss it beyond 'wow this looks so fun I'm going to buy everything' seems to be rejected.

[ihavetoomuchminis]

Only for the armies that have said options. The very idea behind 'Storm in a Teacup' is to provide these monsters for every army, and is promoting that idea. What do you think will happen to players who are convinced to buy these monsters for an army that cannot usually use them when the hype dies off and 'Storm in a Teacup' becomes the rare LGS event?
I expect they'll feel a little silly for spending cash on a subpar monster, then.

This. Just like when they told that you could use the giant in many armies. Staffers saying "oh yes yes, you can fit it in a skaven army". And then, not anymore, since books don't include the mercenary option.

I like the SoM release but only for the new models. I'll give it a try, but i'm sure that it'll be like apocalypse. I have an Stompa, but at least it fits well in my ork army when i want to show my army to friends. It's not like buying a manticore to fit in a High elf army.

[Darnok]

This. Just like when they told that you could use the giant in many armies. Staffers saying "oh yes yes, you can fit it in a skaven army". And then, not anymore, since books don't include the mercenary option.

And now you can use that giant again, so where is the problem?

SoM is a nice opportunity to get models you like, but would otherwise not be able to use. If you want to have the model and play with it, this is for you. Otherwise, where is the issue again? Simply don't buy it.

As far as I see it, there really is nothing to complain about. You get more options, which are by no means mandatory. Plus there are new models, which you can buy if you like them, you don't have to.

[75hastings69]

Geekiness and childishness are different things. I can only assume the 'LI' there is 'lacks imagination', which I feel is itself rather an immature jab. Because I don't like the idea of wizards climbing on platforms made of skulls to hurl the latest UberMegaDeath spell at enemies means I have no imagination? It's the kind of thing a child under 10 would come up with.



I disagree. Wargaming is largely not a children's hobby (given the nature of some of the materials used, neccesity for knives/drills/other dangerous tools, the patience and time required for assembly and painting etc), and WH certainly was not this child-friendly not that long ago. Designing 'terrain' that makes no attempt to look remotely serious (have you *seen* the comical reapers on one of these new 'fulcrums'?) goes against what I have always percieved WHFB to be.



Not among actual wargaming terrain, no. If I went looking in a toy shop, however, I almost certainly would find comparable pieces.



I certainly used to before I stopped playing it. Which was, coincidentally enough, about a year ago.




I fail to see how anyone could look at that Manticore and say it isn't objectively bad. The pose is laughable, the face is flat and frankly comical, the legs break even the most basic anatomical laws, and being pot-bellied doesn't exactly lend it any kind of threatening appearence. I won't even mention the conspicious hair tuft.

The Chimaera is better, but not by much. The pose, again, is uninspired and unthreatening, the dragon head looks more like some kind of frog, and the third head is just a goofy mess - I can't even tell what it's meant to resemble.

The Sorceress, which everyone seems to be going nuts over, is horrific. Female Elves, and DE Sorceresses in particular, are supposed to be beautiful and feminine. The 'Storm in a Teacup' one is neither, with the worst female face sculpt I have ever seen.

The Chaos Sorcerers are alright, but decidedly average, and given the 'premium product' advertising and pricing, I hold them to very high standards which they do not meet.

Ditto on the Dragon, though it's certainly better than the atrocious 'tripping over' HE Dragon.

The Necromancer and the Cockatrice are both much better.



Again, I fail to see how anyone can look at these pieces and not find them laughable. As I've said, they'd look more at home with a childs toy than on a wargaming table, as they are overly exaggerated and comical. The giant skulls and grim reapers look cheap (there's irony) and tacky. The kind of thing that's continually making WH look like a parody of itself, albeit without the self-awareness.



The quality of the products should speak louder than the hype generated. With 'Storm in a Teacup', it is not.
I see nothing but a desperate attempt to offload gimmicks and poor sculpts. Which sadly seems to be working.




Only for the armies that have said options. The very idea behind 'Storm in a Teacup' is to provide these monsters for every army, and is promoting that idea. What do you think will happen to players who are convinced to buy these monsters for an army that cannot usually use them when the hype dies off and 'Storm in a Teacup' becomes the rare LGS event?
I expect they'll feel a little silly for spending cash on a subpar monster, then.

I agree with everything you wrote 100%.

[RanaldLoec]

I don't mind people saying that model looks awefull.

My issue is with

SoM is a waste of time
SoM is boring and not worth the time or money

YET no ones played it yet

Or

I'm so well versed in the warhammer universe that my opinion carries more weight than every one else's

[Satan]

I don't mind people saying that model looks awefull.

My issue is with

SoM is a waste of time
SoM is boring and not worth the time or money

YET no ones played it yet

Or

I'm so well versed in the warhammer universe that my opinion carries more weight than every one else's

I think you misunderstand - for alot of people (but then again, for some) it is not the concept of SoM that makes it the things you just listed, but rather the subsequent actions of GW and treatment of it that makes it so, and just like with the giant, ogres army book, dogs of war, apocalypse and cities of death it is prior experience that tells us this.

I still think GW are non-commital and not a serious player for not including stuff like apocalypse datasheets or CoD stratagems in the codexes (FOR EXAMPLE). That's fine, they can act however they want, but I have no consumer obligation to commit to their products or line of thinking either.

That said, I have pre-ordered the magic cards to use for transporting my regular ones and the cockatrice to use as a jabberslytge, unit filler or possibly future great eagle.

I'm not buying into SoM due to previous experience. That's my entirely personal opinion and prerogative however, just like you've got yours.

[DjtHeutii]

To me it sounds childish. YMMW.

It's a game of toy soldiers.

Get over it.

[Urgat]

On another hand... this is the rumors forum, how about keeping the news here and share all your opinions over in general?

[Scammel]

Tempted by the Chimera, but I'm a little concerned as to it's longevity. I can't seriously imagine casual opponents stopping me from using one however. The only other slight issue is the impending Ogre release, which will no doubt violate and leave my wallet for dead on the side of the road bearing mental scars for life.

[Lars Porsenna]

It occurs to me it might be possible to play SoM without the crazy magic, magic focii, etc. if for no other reason than to use monsters in your army, and get the rules for 45 of them, or at the least have solid ally rules in the game...

Damon.

[Spider-pope]

Tempted by the Chimera, but I'm a little concerned as to it's longevity. I can't seriously imagine casual opponents stopping me from using one however. The only other slight issue is the impending Ogre release, which will no doubt violate and leave my wallet for dead on the side of the road bearing mental scars for life.

The Chimaera is one of the monsters that'll still be useable even if the naysayers are right, since it's one of the monsters in the Transformation of Kadon spell.

[Avian]

i've just noticed something weird looking like some kind of monster in one of battle shoots on GW site. any ideas what that might be?

It's just a converted Giant. The kit comes with a large skull which it is using as a helmet and you can see that the shape of the leg is the same, it has just been glued on at a different angle. I think the rock is part of the Arcane Ruins set.

Behind it is another converted Giant with what appears to be a peg leg made from an Irongut club.

[Schelle]

Ok, my two cents.

I am most likely getting the Chaos Lord on Manticor for my Chaos Army and will also get the magic card holder and the Storm of Chaos book, not sure if I will get anything else.

I actually do not think I will play the Storm of Magic ever, especially since Magic is quite iffy in the new edition, obviously SoM was created to tackle this.

Anyway, more looking forward to the upcoming VC release and SoB for 40K

[Scammel]

The Chimaera is one of the monsters that'll still be useable even if the naysayers are right, since it's one of the monsters in the Transformation of Kadon spell.

Hmmm, granted I have some Beastmen, but I'd rather ask nicely and throw it on the table from the off than rely on ToK.

Magic is quite iffy in the new edition, obviously SoM was created to tackle this.

I'd say the opposite - SoM was created to take the lunacy a step further. At least it's balanced lunacy to an extent, don't expect any of the really big spells unless you were winning to a considerable degree already.

[Belakor]

I agree with everything you wrote 100%.

I couldn't care less about your opinions about this product, especially in a rumour thread. So please let this old man read about these new rules and models you obvious rock stars find childish.

Anybody know if there are some nice Ogre stuff in there somewhere?

[Lorcryst]

Anybody know if there are some nice Ogre stuff in there somewhere?

I think that they get 3 MegaSpells, like everyone else, still use their own miscast table but must roll on the SoM miscast table on top of that if they miscast on a Fulcrum ...

Those spells could be a hint of what's to come in the future Army Book too (rumoured for Octobre ?).

[Belakor]

Most excellent! Thanks.