More the latter I think to be fair. My elf and orc armies for kow are all gw models because I already owned them.
More the latter I think to be fair. My elf and orc armies for kow are all gw models because I already owned them.
It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye... and then it's just fun!
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So, then it says that you are fine using free rules but don't feel that you should spend money on Mantic minis? Are you saying that Mantic's non-trivial prices can't compete with "using models I alrready own"? Is there some price point at which you would consider "updating" your armies for KOW by buying minis from the people who provide you with free rules?
Is this a case of the cow giving the milk away for free, or are you just not into Mantic minis? I'm just curious.
Originally Posted by The Dude
Bob wins!
To be clear..
My elf army is all GW. I might add the Mantic dragon and drakon riders to it though.
My Orc Army is currently all GW. However, I have a whole shelf of Orc Mantic models waiting to add to it but they are currently unassembled and thus also unpainted.
My undead army is probably 70% Mantic and 30% GW and about 4000 points at KoW values.
I started playing KoW with the armies I had, like most people. Those were heavily GW focused. I think this is true for a lot of gamers getting into KoW: that was my point
3 of the Mantic boys at the Invitational last weekend had all-GW armies. Ken was the exception with mostly Mantic orcs but had a finecast model for his krudger on winged slasher.
It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye... and then it's just fun!
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I think it's a fair cop that there will be a bunch of veterans crossing over into a new system and bringing their already paid for miniatures that they have lovingly painted.
That has been the same case for Fantasy Warriors and Armies of Arcana, players drag their models across from warhammer and other systems to play the new systems without the big set up cost of buying a whole bunch of new miniatures and then having to assemble and paint them. Then they get to try out the new system for size before deciding how they feel about it. If they like it they can invest etc.
In Mantics case the new miniatures are so nice and so cheap many gamers have taken the plunge and bought at least some of the miniatures before trying the game system.
Either way you know that there will be a fair bunch of older gamers like Matt who have tried the system out with their existing miniatures before they have looked to splash out on the brand specific miniatures from Mantic.
I wouldn't say it is exclusively older gamers taking their existing miniatures that are trying out KoW, but I'm sure they represent a good sized chunk.
The fact that most older gamers are also shocking miniature hogs and model junkies, they will be lured to buy some or even a lot of the very reasonably priced and nicely sculpted new miniatures on offer.
Well for me it's a little of both, which is why I was curious. Like matt, I have an Undead army which is mixed between GW, Mantic and a few Reaper. I also have Dwarfs from both. But for Elves, I decided to make a KoW army using GW High Elves (albeit mostly the IoB ones). Not really interested in either company's Orcs right now, though.
I forgot reaper! My werewolves are reaper ones
It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye... and then it's just fun!
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Seriously? If you already own models, chances are you would have spent a lot of time, effort and money on the army so why would you then just push them to one side and buy the official mantic version of the army? It makes no sense. I may start to add to my army using Mantic models (like adding Mantic elves to my GW WE) but just starting fresh, no way. I have a horde of GW WE, to replace the models I can with Mantic models would cost me over £100. I frankly don't have the cash to warant that just to play with the "official" models and I have spent far too long painting them all up to just throw them to one side. It has nothing to do with the style of the models and I'm in no way saying Mantic are expensive, it is down to being proud of the work I have done on my WE army and also being sensible with my money.
In anycase Mantic have said that they are fine with people using other companies' models so I don't see any problem to carry on this way.
My Wood Elf painting log
Build Me an Army Worthy of Mantic
Agreed, I have minatures that I bought and painted when I was 14 (28 years ago if you must know) and they still see service today from the occassional RPG to bulking up one or other of my armies.
Yes I would like to re paint some ....... well most of the older ones but I have far too many other minatures from other companys like GW,grenadier,reaper,folio works,inquisition,hasslefree and too many others to remember, that are still in boxes that need painting before I can justify stripping and painting the older ones that I have.
I dont understand WHY people think "oh theres some new clanrats, skeletons, orcs out, so I must get rid of my old versions and "update" my army". Seriously you are a tool of the games companys, just add them to your existing armys if you HAVE to buy them. After all ask yourselves do you really NEED more standard skeleton infantry when you already have 200 painted, yes the new ones might be the best looking and most detailed ever, but whats the point of buying them when you can just as easily use the ones you have already, and spend the money on a different army or game?
Yes I have some....ok a lot of mantic minis but that primarily down to the good deals I got on buying them and the fact that I liked the look of some of the charicter minis. I buy from whomever I like the minatures that I like / need. I dont tie myself to one company as the range is the "offical" one to play with the game. At the end of the day is my army and my table (or my friends) and if I like something in it why shouldnt I use it just because it isnt the newest or offical version.
ttfn
Another proud member of the Mantic Fanaticshttp://manticfanatics.smfforfree3.com/index.php
"Mantic: like GW, minus the GW-ness".
I didn't like the recent edition of GW plastic Dwarves so I sold off all my core GW (undersized if you ask me) plastic dwarf troop options and replaced them metals from the westwind dwarf range, which I adore, (scottish dwarfs in kilts mon, ye cannae beat it)
Cost me very little after cashing in on ebay and I got all those lovely metals from westwind
I kept all my metal dwarfs from GW as well from previous editions and I play mix and match, next up I'm adding Mantics drillers, 2 of them, one already purchased, I have a unit of dwarf halberdiers, the fat ones from Foundry and I'll pick up a box of the AoW slayers which look very nice and put them in with my 250 metal GW slayers. I like the Mantic dwarfs but not enough to invest in them.
Their undead and Orcs have got me though...
Last edited by Autumn Leaves; 27-02-2012 at 22:24.
My undead army, which sits at around 300 models currently has 35 GW miniatures in it, and I already owned those. Granted, I didn't have an undead army to begin with, so brought mantic from the get go. But I'm pleased I did, as it allowed me to build a massive army for a relatively tiny amount of money (army box, zombie horde and what I got in the xmas bag, so less than £100 in total [brought from wayland games except the bag)
I'm picking up some army of the dead models from a retailer to use as wraiths because I love the sculpts and because I can get more for less (20 for £18 instead of 10 for £14) And I may in the future get some morgul knights to use as soul reavers (Because I don't like the mantic sculpts)
But in general, unless I hate the sculpt, or I can get a better deal, I'll always buy mantic for my undead needs.
So then you agree that the free rules are not actually selling Mantic miniatures?
Bob wins!
I dunnno, that seems a bit of a jump from what he said.
I read him as saying that starting a new system doesn't automatically buying new models.
The issue of if the rules beign free help selling mantic minatures is a different thing again. For what it matters I think the free rules help.
I'm sorry where in my post did I agree to that?
This ^ is what I was trying to say. At the very moment I personally am trying as many new games and as many new model companies as I can. For instance I have just started playing Warmachine. Now I honestly have no clue what is good or what I like to play with as I am a complete n00b and have only played a few games. I haven't rushed out to buy a gang as I don't have the cash to spend on something only to find I don't like playing with it. Instead I have used the few pp models I have, nicked some stuff off my mate when I play him and then proxied the rest.
And did you just miss the part where I said I have added Mantic elves to my collection? So far I have added a dragon lord, 2 drakon riders, 60 spearmen, 2 bolt throwers, 40 archers and 20 scouts (the last two were there just because they were dirt cheap on the Christmas sale). Then there is also the 500 point Mantic only orc and dwarf armies I have and the 99% 1000 point Mantic undead army I have amassed in the last couple of months. All of these models were bought primarily for KoW.
If you have the money to buy a whole new force as soon as you start a new games system then good for you but I personally can't justify just splurging on every new game system as soon as I start playing.
My Wood Elf painting log
Build Me an Army Worthy of Mantic
I own 15,000 points of GW High Elves and I just bought about 2,000-2,500 of Mantic Elves *shrugs*
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"The Emperor is obviously not a dictator, he's a couch."
Starbuck: "Why can't we use the starboard launch bays?"
Engineer: "Because it's a gift shop!"
We are miniature junkies, we cannot help ourselves.
Have another look at the pricing on the GW army of the dead, they're now roughly the same price as mantic wraiths.
GW raised prices on the entire range of LotR plastics by 35% this month.
If you play any of Mantic's games, check out my Battlescribe project for KoW and Warpath.
Nope, its all about the quality. Mr Blanche, for the mumblings I heard last time I visited GW HQ, is on quite a tidy wage.None, he's rubbish. ;-)
But he was cheap and thats why GW keep him on.
It's all about the money, money, money...
Its not an argument thread, its a discussion thread, and its a shame that you don't see that.So you write an incredibly long post and I take the trouble to respond to it but you can't handle the depth of factual material encapsulated within it so you strum up some nonsense about length of material etc to side step answering any of the facts, because you don't have an argument to stand on against it or any of the material put up by the other posters on the thread.
The reason why I threw in the towel was simple. I couldn't be bothered replying to a dozen points that have no basis in facts, in a post that has so little regard for sentence and paragraph structure that I have to tackle every single line individually, and when I do get a reply from yourself, your selective in what it is you reply to - I honestly have better things to do then that, and if your happy going on like that then thats fine, but don't expect replies from myself any more
Two posts. I posted, people replied, I replied to them. Welcome to forums!I also note that on this page alone you have two posts that when combined are larger than my single post answering your queries, allegations and fallacious statements.
I'd also like to point out that using language such as that isn't helping your case. You can't say 'He told lies!' and not actually state what lies I've told because it undermines your own credibility. Go ahead, feel free to quote me line for line on what allegations I've made against.. whoever or whatever. If you can't do that however well..
Let me be clear. I've had discussions with Emperor Norton, Redben, and Shelfunit - some positive, some not so much, but every time I've replied to them or vice versa theres been a discussion, a raising and countering of points. I might not agree with them, but I respect there postings and will happily reply to them if they want me to (send a PM guysAlso, on the subject of you actively side stepping other members posts because they are too difficult for you to deal with, how about doing Shelfunits excellent offering justice and offering a response in kind?
If I haven't replied to them its not because I'm dodging there points, but because I'm having to reply to posts from yourself, which have chewed up far too much of my time of late. Like I said, you've won this one through attrition, so grats etc. I'm sure one of the other 'heretics' will be along shortly for you to shout off as well
Well if you know anything about Benin art and history you're quiet welcome to take over from me (its only a introduction course, so its light, but after a few years off from anything academic its proving... tricky).I wish I was doing your course lol
Last edited by GomezAddams; 28-02-2012 at 22:00.
[Gomez and Jihad shoot some Zeds] [The Addams go to Malifaux]Currently taking on commission work
I picked up one of the 20 man boxes from firestorm games
I was interested in Mantic before they released Kings of War. Now that I've played it I will probably never buy an army from anyone else. I've already bought minis I didn't need.
They've won me over with the ruleset, and I know I'm not the only one.
I'll still buy and play Warhammer and the other GW games, but personally I'm never touching a Warhammer rulebook in a competitive environment when I can use KoW or Warpath. While neither is perfect, the stark difference in balance, tactics required, and cost-effectiveness really relegates GW games to occasional once-offs for fun for me instead of as a benchmark tournament-worthy game.
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