Vehicle movement (Pivoting answer?)

[TAU AIR CASTE]

As of Late I have seen a lot of threads on various forums about so called pivoting shenanigans, I have not read through every page of every thread but the general argument comes down to 2 ways of thinking with regards to the wording of "pivoting on the spot alone does not count as moving:

1: Pivoting doesn't count towards movement and as such should not be measured.

2: Pivoting doesn't count towards movement if just pivoting alone however if moving forwards or backwards and pivoting the pivot should be included in the measurement.

I personally am in the group 1. And I am wondering are all the people in group 2 missing the section on tank shock? it is listed as a vehicle move, and it even has a diagram. 3 very important things here which imo make it crystal clear that pivoting should not be measured.

1. Page 68 (I have the mini rule book) say when moving a tank, the player may declare they are going to attempt a tank shock. (so it;s clear this is part of moving and not some oddball rule or different way of moving)

2. same page it says turn on the spot and declare how far you want to go in inches and that is must move at least 6" it then says note that because pivoting on the spot alone does not count as moving, this is not enough for a tank shock (nothing changed there with regards to arguments as both people will have their valid arguments still)

3. This is the important bit and imo what completely solves the issue and ends the debate. Look at the picture on the bottom of page 69 named ramming! (Ramming is a type of tank shock and tank shock is a form of moving just in case anyone want's to argue "but that is ramming") it shows a vehicle pivoting on the spot and then moving 10" after the pivot, underneath is says it inflicts a str5 hit 1 for tank + 1 for armour + 3 for speed (10") if you counted pivoting towards the measurement of movement then it would not be 10" it would be 10" plus the distance of the pivot.

For me this is an end to the argument, I always interpreted it as the pivots do not count, and I believed gamesworkshop intended this too but with the added fact that they even drew a diagram and wrote it out.... I think that kinda puts it to bed.

[Fithos]

This Topic has been beaten to death. Can we just let it die and stop pretending that the twitching of the corpse as we beat it further is actually some remnant of life in the topic?

In answer, Discuss it with your opponent before the game.

[TAU AIR CASTE]

Well the reason I brought it up is 1 I clearly think the move is ok and 2 I have not seen anyone point this part out before also with the diagram on page 69 (I did however mention I have not read every page of every thread).

[lantzkev]

that and the pivot only added a inch... which still puts it at +3...

[TAU AIR CASTE]

Well clearly not! The pivot did not add an inch as it says the tank moves forwards 10 inches after the pivot and it also says only 10 inches are counted for the speed distance of the ram (hence +3 for 3x 3 full inches) not 11 inches or 10.5 inches or any other amount so clearly the pivot is not counted towards movement measurements in movements made by vehicles, added to this they even made a diagram to show this.

[Archangelion]

I'm assuming that you are referancing the second image, not the first image, where it shows the tank actually pivoting.

Yes, we disscussed that image. Right here, on this very form. The diagram that you referance shows just how little even the authors/editors/illustrators knowledge of the rules is. The vehicle doesn't even pivot about the center point. Not to mention, if you look at the front right armour of the 'before' underlay of the rhino, it is the exact same distance from that corner to the target than the distance is from the target to the front armour of the 'after' overlay of the rhino. So the image itself isn't usable as an argument.

As for them telling you to to pivot then turn, note that the entire section is definined as additions and exceptions to the rules. So anything that cannot be proven outside of these pages cannot be proven within them, as for all we know, the change is an exception.

@Fithos. I'm not dead. I'm not beaten. You, and those who agree with you, have proven nothing to me that supports your view of the rules in this matter. So no, there is no corpse, and yes, I am still standing, still breathing, and my heart is beating just as loud.

@Tau Air Caste, This is the thread on this very topic, it was closed by a mod (as it was just going round and round with nothing new, including your points). As this is the case, and that the thread was only closed probably not even a week ago, I would humbly suggest that you close this thread. (If a Mod doesn't do it for you first that is!)
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showth...s-and-pivoting

[DoctorTom]

Do we really need another thread on this now? It seems that this is getting to be the equivalent of picking at scabs.

[Archangelion]

There was even a poll thread (it's still on the first page of the rules section to boot!), that was also closed.

[TAU AIR CASTE]

I didn't realize that had been brought up hence the comment about not reading all the way through the threads, The picture shows a pivot and clearly doesn't include that pivot in the movement measurement.

As this example has been brought up before I will close the thread but I find it hard to believe that people even after seeing that wish to still argue on the rule and try to change it to be how they think it should be as opposed to how it is.

[TAU AIR CASTE]

Thread closed.