Alliances between Order and Destruction?

[Craze_b0i]

In the fluff are there any examples of cooperation between Forces of Order and Forces of Destruction?

The only one I can think of is Skavenslayer [[[SPOILER]]] where Thanquol sends messages to Gotrek and Felix to tell them what his adversaries are planning. Even then that is not really direct cooperation, more a case of Thanquol using them as his pawns.

[Jack of Blades]

I'd say any fool of Order who allies with Destruction is no longer Order's fool

[m1acca1551]

No i cant really see it happening to the extent of say dwarfs and orcs joing up to fight chaos etc.

Storm of chaos had Manfred von carstein not attack the empire after having a parlay, more so because sylvania had chaos warbands running through it.

GW have written the fluff in such a way that alliances are really impossible in the long term as all the factions hate or distrust the other. The forces of order are only allies when united against a common threat, at all other stages they resort back to there bickering nature. The forces of disorder being allies is extremely rare and even when "chaos" (daemons, beasts and mortals) unite it is a very fragile alliance based one once we smash these guys im gonna get you next.

so alliances between the 2 forces?? Highly unlikely but in your own games and fluff go nuts.

[Leogun_91]

Sylvania is a part of the empire and far from every person there is positive to the idea of vampires, the majority sees them as monsters even though there is a relatively large minority who likes them. Still the undead hordes of the Von Carstein have been seen fighting alongside the imperial troops of Sylvania, and not in a small, volunteer scale either.

Both Bretonnia and the Empire has chaos cults so I guess alliances with chaos led by a corrupt noble from either could be possible.

[Kayosiv]

There is direct fluff in I believe the 5th edition book of Vampire counts book that says the King's of men would come to the great necromancer Heinrich Kemmler's tower and grovel at his feet begging for his aid in times of war.

Skaven directly help the Tomb Kings destroy the great wizard Nagash because they do not themselves wish to be destroyed.

Ogres will help anybody if the price is right and there is enough meat involved.

Chaos warriors and demons could help the forces of order for numerous reasons as the 4 great powers fight each other constantly and love to toy with mortals and use them as pawns.

[Artinam]

Some forces of Destruction are more 'lawful' as mentioned before I can see Vampire Counts, Tomb Kings setup temporarily Alliances or truces which suite their interests. Whereas Ogres, Orcs can probably be bribed with shiney stones untill they backstab you after the battle.

[Harwammer]

I agree with the others that Vampires are the ones to ally with order most as 1) they like to politic and 2) they play the long game. Cue Super-Manfred setting out to save the Empire in SoC (but being beaten to it by Mr. Headbutt).

[redshylock]

Skaven also allied themselves with Araby and Nippon

[Craze_b0i]

I don't think skaven were ever fully allied to Araby, iirc they were secretly passing information/warpstone to the Sultan but they never actually fought together.

Alliance with Nippon - I have no idea, did not read that before.

[Jack of Blades]

Skaven also allied themselves with Araby and Nippon

They didn't ally Araby, they manipulated Araby and Bretonnia into fighting each other. Never read anything about Nippon, where'd you get that from?

[Grimgormx]

TK and OK are neutral....

[Leogun_91]

They didn't ally Araby, they manipulated Araby and Bretonnia into fighting each other. Never read anything about Nippon, where'd you get that from?

Confusion, Eshin has connections in Cathay but their Ninja style makes people think Nippon.

[The bearded one]

skaven have had several 'deals' with other factions. I wouldn't really call them alliances, as much as alliances of convenience. Skaven have "allied" with Araby, providing information for warpstone. They also allied with Nagash in return for warpstone, and in Skavenslayer they allied/manipulated an empire official in Nuln (they provided information).

[Craze_b0i]

So it seems no-one can name any outright alliances where the two sides fought together. As I was reading the replies above I was trying to think what hyperthetical Order-Destruction alliances could happen...

Had SOC invasion not been such an abject failure and had Archeon occupied the majority of the Empire then it is interesting to speculate what alliances might have taken shape. If Chaos was poised to overrun the Old World then the Council of 13 could have offered an alliance to the surviving humans - of course such an alliance would only be temporary until Chaos had been routed.

[Leogun_91]

So it seems no-one can name any outright alliances where the two sides fought together. As I was reading the replies above I was trying to think what hyperthetical Order-Destruction alliances could happen...

Had SOC invasion not been such an abject failure and had Archeon occupied the majority of the Empire then it is interesting to speculate what alliances might have taken shape. If Chaos was poised to overrun the Old World then the Council of 13 could have offered an alliance to the surviving humans - of course such an alliance would only be temporary until Chaos had been routed.

It need not be temporary. It could be extremely one-sided instead.
If one is desperate for one such alliance, throw a dark emissary into it. The Dark Emissaries are good at making people think they do the right thing although they aren't and the Albion campaign booklet gave the advice for either order or destruction armies to ally with either side as Dark Emissaries won't tell the truth and Truthsayers are far more concerned with preserving Albion than giving a deal to someone who deserves it.

[Craze_b0i]

It need not be temporary. It could be extremely one-sided instead.

You mean the Skaven force the humans to carry on fighting as their ally after Chaos has run away? But if the skaven were the more powerful partner wouldn't they just enslave the humans instead.

[Leogun_91]

You mean the Skaven force the humans to carry on fighting as their ally after Chaos has run away? But if the skaven were the more powerful partner wouldn't they just enslave the humans instead.

Nationwide enslavement in return for protection is a one-sided deal.

[Craze_b0i]

Nationwide enslavement in return for protection is a one-sided deal.

Yes. But that also means you could no longer call it an alliance.

[Col. Tartleton]

Confusion, Eshin has connections in Cathay but their Ninja style makes people think Nippon.

Cathay is apparently the "Asia" China-Korea-Japan. It's pretty unclear what Nippon is like. After all, Cathay is home to ninjas and the Cathayan long sword is a katana. Khuresh is Indochina. Ind is India. The Lost Isles of Elithis or whatever are Australia, Tasmania, and New Zealand.

Perhaps Nippon is Indonesia? That would be interesting and make the blatant name a bit less painful.

[Craze_b0i]

In real life Nippon is another name for Japan. Like in real life Cathay is another word for China.