Does anyone else hope Extra Armor gets reworked?

[Chapters Unwritten]

I haven't taken extra armor on a vehicle since the old marine codex, and the more I think of why, it just keeps coming back to the same thing: Shaken is almost just as bad as stunned, the only real difference being for transports with a YOU MUST GET THERE NOW type of payload. But that honestly rarely comes up in my games, if at all; most of my troops are where they need to be when their tank finally goes down, or close enough to get there on foot reliably. I've never had a situation come up that made me go "Aw, if only I had taken extra armor!" Have you?

[Jericho]

It has another purpose, too... if you get stunned and a big nasty guy with a powerfist/melta bomb is waltzing up to your tank, you want to be able to move and avoid being auto-killed next turn.

Extra armor has its purpose, but I just think it's a bit pricey now as the prices of vehicles has come down in recent editions and the cost of extra armor went from a nickel to ... several nickels. In the era of vehicle spam, it's hard to afford it on a half dozen or more boxes.

[AlphariusOmegon20]

I'd like to see Extra Armor do what it really should do-add +1 value to your armor.

[toonboy78]

the problem i have with it is how often is it used??

say on a landraider, after your opponents hit, pen roll he stilll has to roll a 1in6 on the damage chart for it to be used.

if it always modified the damage result or you could always roll against the damage result then it may be better.

as it stands it is not that useful (other then when you need it!)

[Theocracity]

I haven't taken extra armor on a vehicle since the old marine codex, and the more I think of why, it just keeps coming back to the same thing: Shaken is almost just as bad as stunned, the only real difference being for transports with a YOU MUST GET THERE NOW type of payload. But that honestly rarely comes up in my games, if at all; most of my troops are where they need to be when their tank finally goes down, or close enough to get there on foot reliably. I've never had a situation come up that made me go "Aw, if only I had taken extra armor!" Have you?

Maybe it's only intended for vehicles that want to keep moving, then? Not everything has to be multipurposed.

Besides, vehicles are already really powerful. Making them more resilient would just add to the current metagame problems.

[Chapters Unwritten]

I'd like to see Extra Armor do what it really should do-add +1 value to your armor.

For balance reasons, I doubt that would work, but I wouldn't mind it, for example, downgrading a pen to a glance on a roll, or even granting a save of some kind. What it does now is not a 15 point effect, honestly, at least as far as my games dictate. Especially when you can just disembark from a stunned vehicle and walk+run almost the same distance the "stuck" tank would have gotten you.

It is true that vehicles are more powerful but I'd almost rather the option just not be there, it has such a small role in the game.

[Kevlar]

Imperials do get screwed here. Most armies have armor upgrades way better than EA. Flicker fields, living metal, potms, dispruption pods, demonic possesson...

[Cthell]

'Cept for the eldar, who get exactly the same effect for a different name. Mind you, it's cheaper for us at least

[meltedwing]

I, for one, think extra armor costs way too much for way too little benefit. If it remains the cost it is, I would like to see it either grant a -1 to the chart roll or add 1 point of armor.

-1 to the chart roll would be my preference I think. Guaranteeing that a regular (read as not AP1) shot can't explode your tank would be nice. Also having glancing shots be at -3 (with extra armor) would be good as well. I think that would be well worth the points. Even just negating those AP1 bonuses would be pretty cool.

+1 to armor would be awesome as well, especially if it's all around as that would make transports armor 11 in the rear instead of armor 10, thus making them a little sturdier if they get assaulted.

As is, I never buy it.

[MajorWesJanson]

Just drop it in price to 10 and call it good.

[Theocracity]

Imperials do get screwed here. Most armies have armor upgrades way better than EA. Flicker fields, living metal, potms, dispruption pods, demonic possesson...

Imperials get smoke launchers too. Not to mention all the vehicles that get EA built in (Valkyries, for example).

-1 to the chart roll would be my preference I think. Guaranteeing that a regular (read as not AP1) shot can't explode your tank would be nice. Also having glancing shots be at -3 (with extra armor) would be good as well. I think that would be well worth the points. Even just negating those AP1 bonuses would be pretty cool.

Do you love that feeling you get when your last 'this needs to work' anti tank shot rolls a 1 on the damage chart? Now you can get that feeling on even more dice results! :P

Frankly I think vehicle resilience, and its associated effect on the metagame, is already over the top. Let's not make it worse.

[Ozendorph]

The Extra Armor effect is fine (imo, obviously), as the ability to move is a big deal in most cases. Transporting troops? Want to find cover? Rather not be thunder hammered into oblivion? And so on.

The 15 point standard was an overreaction to every single vehicle having EA at 5pts. GW would have done well to take a baby step and settle at 10 points...maybe they'll adjust in 6th

[Konovalev]

I'd like to see extra armor work something like modern ERA panels to become reactive armor. 15pts lets you ignore the first penetrating/glancing hit the vehicle takes with a caveat that it doesn't ignore ordnance(though it will still be used up if penned/glanced by ordnance.)

[Theocracity]

I'd like to see extra armor work something like modern ERA panels to become reactive armor. 15pts lets you ignore the first penetrating/glancing hit the vehicle takes with a caveat that it doesn't ignore ordnance(though it will still be used up if penned/glanced by ordnance.)

That's already in effect for Necron in the form of Quantum Shielding. I doubt the Imperium is savvy enough to use reactive armor anyway; they're more in the business of big heavy plating.

[meltedwing]

Frankly I think vehicle resilience, and its associated effect on the metagame, is already over the top. Let's not make it worse.

I definitely do not share this perspective. Especially when Thunderhammer/Stormshield Terminators have a greater survivability than a Land Raider when hit with a melta shot at close range. Especially when someone drop pods in a group of guys with combi-meltas and turns your "high resilience" tank into a pile of slag, while a unit of the aforementioned Terminators would just kind of laugh it off 2/3's of the time. If anything I think vehicles are too easy to pop, rather than too difficult.

[Konovalev]

I definitely do not share this perspective. Especially when Thunderhammer/Stormshield Terminators have a greater survivability than a Land Raider when hit with a melta shot at close range. Especially when someone drop pods in a group of guys with combi-meltas and turns your "high resilience" tank into a pile of slag, while a unit of the aforementioned Terminators would just kind of laugh it off 2/3's of the time. If anything I think vehicles are too easy to pop, rather than too difficult.

What do you think happens to the squad carrying that combi-melta though? Killing higher AV vehicles tends to be a KP trade and I think that is the issue many people have with current vehicles.

[Ozendorph]

I doubt the Imperium is savvy enough to use reactive armor anyway; they're more in the business of big heavy plating.

They used to be savvy enough, but that was a few editions ago (ablative armor)

[Jericho]

+1 armor saves? For reals? People want to see AV13 Dreads, AV14 Ironclads, and AV15 Land Raiders/Leman Russ? You gotta be kidding me

A save against glancing hits or shaken/stunned results could be an option, I suppose, but realistically I don't see them making a drastic change like that, which would impact at least a half dozen books. I think the slightly more expensive transports with slightly cheaper options (the old 50+5 recipe) made sense, the current price model not so much. But hey, transports are a good money sink so why not keep them cheap in 6th...

[Toadius80]

I'm in the view, as others have mentioned, it should ignore the first pen/glance. After all, it is supposed to be extra plates an what have you attached to the exterior thus its effect would be consistent to the fluff unlike the current.

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[Lord Damocles]

It's fine as is.

A little too expensive on things with Power of the Machine Spirit and/or Fortitude, but then they've got Power of the Machine Spirit and/or Fortitude, so who the hell cares?


Downgrading Stunned to Shaken is extremely useful in quite a number of situations:
- Countering first turn traffic jams
- Tank Shock!
- Getting out of assault [range]
- Making sure that your transport can actually transport it's contents rather than sitting unable to move all game