Thoughts on Betrayer's plotline

[shadowhawk2008]

That's Lorgar btw, who has just used his crozius to open up TWO Ultramarines who are themselves flooding their guts out. Angron is watching, no doubt salivating at the murder, and wielding his infamous twin chainaxes. Meanwhile, there is a legion war going on abouts and there are THREE titans in the picture, all with almost different loadouts. Lorgar has a HUGE cape and you can also spot some Chaos Space Marines. Plus what MvS said.

[Londinium]

To be fair it's more of a picture of 2 Primarchs standing atop a hill of dead Ultramarines that they've already killed...

Indeed. Pretty awesome. Even if Angron looks like a circus clown.

[Duke_Leto]

Is it my eyes or are the Ultramarines wearing lilac/purple armour?

[shadowhawk2008]

Is it my eyes or are the Ultramarines wearing lilac/purple armour?

Looks like dark-ish blue to me.

[Wazzahamma]

Even though we can ascribe some sort of "OMG" expression to the Ultramarine facing us, it's more a compositional decision than anything else. This artist always has a marine or two looking back in the direction of the "camera", which makes sense from a design point of view, otherwise almost all the ultras would have their backs to us.

My favourite bit is the Ultramarine flying through the air, after being clobbered by Illuminariwhatsis. The sense of motion and power is nice to look at.

Other than that, it's pretty standard stuff from this artist. One Space Marine side in the foreground, another approaching in the background. Big titan war machiney things looming over the background. At least one marine of the foreground force looking back towards us. He usually throws in a helmetless marine or two, but that's lacking here. I don't mind Lorgar but I find his expression to be less 'grim determination' and more 'bland determination'. And Angron does look like a clown. Every HH book cover with this primarch has always made him look the most underwhelming of the fraternity. The 'Primarchs' cover, the Butcher's Nails and that "grr arrgh" one from Tales of Heresy; all with an unimpressive Angron.

I don't think it's a bad cover though, just generic.

[shadowhawk2008]

Illuminarium.

[Vaulkhar]

Is it wrong that my first thought on looking at that artwork was "Warhounds don't have chin and thorax bolters"?

[Londinium]

And Angron does look like a clown. Every HH book cover with this primarch has always made him look the most underwhelming of the fraternity. The 'Primarchs' cover, the Butcher's Nails and that "grr arrgh" one from Tales of Heresy; all with an unimpressive Angron.

I don't think it's a bad cover though, just generic.

It's a shame really, as I actually like Robert's artwork on most of the Heresy covers but his Angron has never worked for me. The single best piece of Angron artwork is the Daemon Prince picture in Collected Visions; other than that most of the GW/BL artwork has struggled to capture him properly for me. I especially dislike the John Blanche sketch in CV but que sera, everyone has different views of what these characters look like.

[Dogface]

Is it wrong that my first thought on looking at that artwork was "Warhounds don't have chin and thorax bolters"?

I think those are supposed to be search lights

[Grimbad]

I think those are supposed to be search lights

My understanding of searchlights is that mowing down space marines is not one of their intended uses.

[Wyrmwood]

My understanding of searchlights is that mowing down space marines is not one of their intended uses.

The searchlights are coming from the Titan's muzzle, the heavy bolters or assault cannons are mounted in it's chest; they're simply creating muzzle flashes.

[MajorWesJanson]

The heavy bolters look to be chin mounted to me. I like the idea a lot, actually. Helps a bit against infantry. We know Emperors have autocannons, battle cannons, and heavy bolters for close defense, makes sense that smaller titans have the same.

[MarcusAurelius]

It's a shame really, as I actually like Robert's artwork on most of the Heresy covers but his Angron has never worked for me. The single best piece of Angron artwork is the Daemon Prince picture in Collected Visions; other than that most of the GW/BL artwork has struggled to capture him properly for me. I especially dislike the John Blanche sketch in CV but que sera, everyone has different views of what these characters look like.

This is pretty decent



I like this mini based on it

[Grimmeth]

My understanding of searchlights is that mowing down space marines is not one of their intended uses.

Obviously you weren't involved in writing the Imperial Guard's tactical doctrine.

[shadowhawk2008]

This is pretty decent



I like this mini based on it

ok.... that's a REALLY cool mini! Damn.

[Compel]

I wonder if it will be set before or after 'Rebirth,' from Age of Darkness.

There's quite a lot about Kharn in that short story that foreshadows his craziness... And suggests a source for it...

[Jericho]

My understanding of searchlights is that mowing down space marines is not one of their intended uses.

Well spoken, my good man

[shadowhawk2008]

According to the prologue on Aaron's blog, it is set right after Galaxy in Flames. That's my interpretation anyway since a Land Raider and Kharn himself are both mentioned.

[Sandlemad]

I wonder if it will be set before or after 'Rebirth,' from Age of Darkness.

There's quite a lot about Kharn in that short story that foreshadows his craziness... And suggests a source for it...

Maybe, but ADB has stated elsewhere that that portrayal, and how it differs from Kharn's other depictions, is down to himself and Chris Wraight getting their wires crossed and not realising that another BL writer was doing stuff with the character in the period immediately after Prospero.

Which is not to say that he won't resolve it in this, just that it was a genuine 'whoops' moment, unlike some other HH stuff.

[Dead.Blue.Clown]

Maybe, but ADB has stated elsewhere that that portrayal, and how it differs from Kharn's other depictions, is down to himself and Chris Wraight getting their wires crossed and not realising that another BL writer was doing stuff with the character in the period immediately after Prospero.

Which is not to say that he won't resolve it in this, just that it was a genuine 'whoops' moment, unlike some other HH stuff.

Not entirely. It wasn't crossed wires between me and Chris; it was more an editorial error. Here's the skinny, cut and pasted from B&C:

"I don't want to go too deeply into this, but part of the problem is that we saw the World Eaters ostensibly fine in False Gods, and then ten minutes later in Galaxy in Flames, Kharn was shouting "I AM THE EIGHTFOLD PATH", and people who'd seen him a few weeks ago barely recognised him.

For me, personally, that was one of the least-convincing moments in the Heresy. I thought it was very... gamey. Very, um, unsubtle and rapid "Chaos Corruption" in a tabletop sense. It came out of nowhere, with no foreshadowing, suddenly suggesting the World Eaters were one of the Legions deepest in thrall to Chaos already, practically before the first shot was fired, before any of the series' main characters - even the Sons of Horus - had any real idea what Chaos was. And, again, that stole any credence I had of the moment. I understand it's a popular scene in the Heresy because of the event itself, but you'll have a difficult time convincing me it rocked with how it was done.

Then you have Rebirth, which is trickier. It's excellently written, and by one of my friends, no less. But it was written on editor request, without the Powers That Be checking the timeline properly (We'd lined up Isstvan III and Prospero roundabout the same time; now Kharn is somehow at both); coupled with the fact I'd already said I was sending the World Eaters with the Word Bearers, so Kharn was technically off the table post-Isstvan V). A a minor note/change, it took the Chaos taint in the Legion much further, faster, than I'd been planning for months. But again, tiny changes - only stuff you notice behind the scenes.

So to be blunt... we'll make sure nothing openly conflicts to the point of ending the world, but the license itself is set up specifically to offer different authors' perspectives. I don't feel beholden to anything that came before when it comes to the minutiae, just as no other BL author feels particularly beholden to anyone else. It's like Scions of the Storm. There are parts in that which don't match up to The First Heretic perfectly, but at the same time, it hardly matters. They both cover the same ground, with slightly different points of view. One lacks the same details because it was written first, though. Nothing game-changing. It's two people writing about the same moment of lore.

Anything in Betrayer will basically be the kind of differences people don't notice unless the author points them out, like... here."