Codex Adeptus Arbites

[jt.glass]

Updated Webbers/Web Cannons to have the Pinning rule, but lowered their Strength by 1 point each to keep them from being too powerful or too expensive.

I can't remember where I saw it, but recently I've seen "Entangling", which is like Pinning except that it doesn't care about Fearlessness - seems like that'd be appropriate for a webber.


glass.

[Ambience 327]

I have considered the thought of making some of my pinning rules ignore those who ignore pinning (since there is obviously precedent for things like that - I'm looking at you "Instant Death", "Eternal Warrior" and "Removed from Play"), but I don't want to overemphasize the pinning aspect of the army so much that the enemy basically doesn't get to take a turn.

What do others think? Now that Suppressive Weapons have gone away, is Suppression Tactics good enough on its own, or do I need to allow the Webbers the ability to bypass Fearless and require a pinning test? One thought - instead of a normal pinning test, they could require a check against Strength, and force the unit to go to ground. If so, what Strength would I use - base strength only? Majority strength of CC attacks? (i.e. SM Terminators with Power Fists would be testing on an 8, so only 6's would fail.)

It could be very characterful, but might require a slight points hike. Also, I don't want to venture too far into OP pinning as I said. If the enemy never gets to move or shoot, and only fights in close combat when and where the Arbites dictate, I don't think it would be much fun for them.

[xavos]

I think the 0-1 restriction on Defensive Measures should be removed to give a bit more freedom of choice.

[Ambience 327]

I am thinking of moving the Response Team to Elites instead of Fast Attack, as right now the only Elites are Suppression Teams and the Special Character/Unit Detective Nash and her Untouchables. Aside from the Response Team, Fast Attack has Pursuit Teams (plus the special characters), Sentinel Pursuit Teams and the Castigator. With the Response Team now being a combination of the old Response and Shock Teams, I thought it might do well to move it to Elites for a more balanced Force Organization Chart.

[burning crome]

I'm reading though the list now and will leave more detailed comments later. My first impression is that it pretty good but you've fallen into the trap of giving to many choices. Some of the units could be easily combined into one entry with the upgrades making them more specialized like doctoring for venten guards squads (this is more aimed at the auxiliary units where you have four entry’s with very little differences between them gangs/penal and rebel/mutants ) . Also you included a lot of unit types that don't really fit. I'm thinking here the Leman russ and Valkyrie. Personally I’d like to see something like the SM storm be substituted here instead. I really like the halligan but it just not workable it its current form. Either boast it AV up to 13 or give it some sort of ability to fire though cover like hive guards. Also the role 3D6 is a little cumbersome where ever possible you should try and stick to using existing rules so just make it s10 and ordnance.
The last point is that I think over all the point cost are a little bit on the step side which is normal quite the opposite with most fan dex’s.

[Ambience 327]

The redundancy in the Auxiliaries list was kind of intentional. The Auxiliaries list exists mostly to allow Arbites fans to tailor their personal Precinct to their personal view on the Arbites and what they can and should use. They are limited (by the rules stating how many Auxiliaries you can take depending on your HQ choices) and they are also free to be ignored entirely. Keeping things like mutants/gangs/penal legions/pdf squds/etc separate means I don't have to have tons of special rules and options for them, and limits min/maxing and abuse, but still allows you to take the kind of supporting troops you thionk your army should have.

The Russ exists in the Auxiliaries list because it exists in the Arbites armoury in at least one Black Library novel. I personally agree that it shouldn't be part of the Arbites, but it is officially available to at least some of them, and some people feel very strongly that it should be included. That is why it is in the Auxiliaries list, so it can be easily ignored by those of us who don't want it.

The Valkyrie is currently being considered for replacement, possibly with Landspeeder Storms and possibly with an "Eagle Shuttle" mentioned in Execution Hour which may bear some resemblance to the Storm Raven.

I also really like the Halligan, and an armour increase and changes to the weapon are both being considered. Your input is noted. THANK YOU!

You are the first one to state that you think things are overcosted. (I boosted Patrol, Combat and Response Teams by +1 point per model in the first update due to people saying they were undercosted.) Would you care to elaborate on that a bit?

[burning crome]

The redundancy in the Auxiliaries list was kind of intentional. The Auxiliaries list exists mostly to allow Arbites fans to tailor their personal Precinct to their personal view on the Arbites and what they can and should use. They are limited (by the rules stating how many Auxiliaries you can take depending on your HQ choices) and they are also free to be ignored entirely. Keeping things like mutants/gangs/penal legions/pdf squds/etc separate means I don't have to have tons of special rules and options for them, and limits min/maxing and abuse, but still allows you to take the kind of supporting troops you think your army should have.

Still think it overly complicated and most of these are way overcosted and really don’t do anything different to each other. There must be some way of cutting them down to something more manageable option but that my personal option there.

The Russ exists in the Auxiliaries list because it exists in the Arbites armoury in at least one Black Library novel. I personally agree that it shouldn't be part of the Arbites, but it is officially available to at least some of them, and some people feel very strongly that it should be included. That is why it is in the Auxiliaries list, so it can be easily ignored by those of us who don't want it.

Well the list doses need some sort of anti-tank. How you get it in that fits with the fluff is a difficult question. Having something that they can “call in” might be one way of getting around this. Sort of like a vulture gunship or the like to fill this role. I also think the land speeds should get something a little more power full since even in a peace keeping role they must encounter rogue vehicles that need to be stopped! And I don’t think restraint play a big part in the mind set of 40k. Another way of doing this would be to give virtual everything the option of taking hunter killers (which you sort of done) at a reduced points cost. Justifying it as in “there not normally equipped but when the need press the arbites are not found lacking”.

The Valkyrie is currently being considered for replacement, possibly with Landspeeder Storms and possibly with an "Eagle Shuttle" mentioned in Execution Hour which may bear some resemblance to the Storm Raven.

Having the arbites acting like storm troopers really interests me. As in them jetting in with a dedicated job to do, like a modern day swat team special unit. It just the use of the Valkyrie is a little mundane I suppose. Something a little stealthier like the storm seems more fitting.
I also really like the Halligan, and an armour increase and changes to the weapon are both being considered. Your input is noted. THANK YOU!


You are the first one to state that you think things are overcosted. (I boosted Patrol, Combat and Response Teams by +1 point per model in the first update due to people saying they were undercosted.) Would you care to elaborate on that a bit?

Many be 9 or 10pts is justified after reading the special rules (defence grenades and fire modes) it just did seem that you couldn’t get much into any list. One of the main draw back of the current sisters of battle list is whist is not really that bad over all, every thing is a wee bit overpriced giving the feeling that your playing a unit or two down from what you should have.
Will have to come back to this one, you’ve added in a lot of ability’s into the special and wargear rules which I personal think need trimming. Whist there great fluff wise that should always mean they get translated onto the table top. For instance you would want SM players using their spit acid or eat brains special rule every other turn.
The other thing to remember here is that 40k is really a game of pitting elite against each other. Whist your factions fluff might be that there “train from birth” or “schooled in the way of law and order above all other concerns”. What you going to be facing are 8foot tall super humans warrior monks, the decipals of a dyeing but long lived race, super evolved killing machines ect. My point is if these don’t get given perk then why do the arbites?
I’m looking at the power maul with it’s +d3 and rerolls. The d3 I don’t really see the point of since even against AV10 that a pretty slim chance of doing anything. And the rerolls is something most army have to pay a lot of points for such as the DE agoniser which I believe is a good 10ps above that of normal PW for wound rerolls (going form memory there so could be very wrong). My point being that, if it is this supper awesome weapon then surely every imperial force in the galaxy would be equipped with it? It just one of those thing SM are armed with diamond tipped chain sword but still count the same as regular knife.

[Haravikk]

Really loving this codex!

I'm uncertain about a few things, mainly I agree that Auxiliaries may be too complex; in particular I'd consider dropping mutants and local gangs, or somehow rolling them into upgrades for the citizen levies. Likewise with inquisitors, it might be better to just tweak one of the Arbites characters into something that can count easily as an Inquisitor, but that may be mostly my opinion since I don't think Inquisitors should be included in individual codexes at all (they need their own supplement).

That aside, I'm also unsure about the Repressor, it just seems… well, boring. It's just a Rhino with extra firing points and a webber as standard, I think that really its role in urban warfare should be further emphasised. In particular I'd consider making the Riot Plough for the Repressor only, roll the armour bonus into the vehicle's profile, and simplify the war gear item to be a dozer blade with Pinning from tank shock. Rhinos and Chimeras are the standard personal carriers focused on getting people about quickly, while the Repressor is the one that can slug it out through the streets if it has to, herding rioters away from key areas or into a mass round-up.

[Ambience 327]

I really like the differences between the various Auxiliaries - i.e. the Mutants, Local Gangs, Penal Legion, PDF Platoons and Citizen Levies. Though largely similar, each has a specialty

Mutants have their mutations, which can help them be fairly decent in CC without spending too many points.

Local Gangs can Infiltrate and can be a very cheap source of special/heavy weapons (60 pts gets you five gangers with 2 Meltas, Plasmas, AC's or HB's).

The Citizen Levy can act as a tarpit unit, and in non-killpoints missions can keep coming back over and over, giving your opponent something to worry about. (This can be especially effective in missions with unusual deployment rules that might allow the Citizens to come on fairly close to the enemy).

The Penal Legion can be fairly hard to shift (since they are Stubborn) and potentially dangerous due to their Desperadoes rule. However, add in a Martyr and they can be truly threatening.

The PDF Infantry Platoon can be a fairly cheap source of bodies if you want to form a solid gun-line, though they have less options than their Imperial Guard counterparts.

As to the Repressor, it is what it is because I based it on the current Forgeworld rules. The same goes for the Inquisitor. When something I put into a Codex already has official (or fairly official in the case of FW stuff) rules, I try to at least base my version on them, if not keep them wholly. (See my Tarantulas - they are largely based on the FW version, but with a few minor tweaks to make them work a little better as part of the Arbites army list.)

[burning crome]

the repressor is a fine tank (personal fav) and very in keeping. It got a odd rule that its fire points can only be used by basic weapons to stop it being used as a fire base for multi- special or heavy weapons troops. Which you might have not included in the pdf and i think it come in at 55pts not 45. That going off the IA 2 updates so there may be a more current rule set floating around that i'm not aware of.

edit. ok should really check stuff before post. The repressor has seven total fire points. One normal top hatch and six basic weapon points and come it at 50pts and come with search light (which you've got listed) smock launchers and dozer blade as standard (which you've not).

[Haravikk]

As to the Repressor, it is what it is because I based it on the current Forgeworld rules.

As burning crome points out it should really come with the dozer blade at least; I still think that the riot plough idea makes most sense specialised for the Repressor rather than other vehicles, as this helps to distinguish it from them (plus I think the Rhino and Chimera are better off with regular dozer blades anyway).

[Ambience 327]

I've now uploaded version 1.2 - links in the first post of this thread.

Change Log 4/16/2012:

Increased the cost of the Riot Plow to 15 points, and changed it to simply be a Dozer Blade with additional rules.

Updated the Repressor to come with the Riot Plow standard. Cost updated to reflect this. It was suggested that I alter the "Fire Points" to reflect the Forgeworld version, but in my opinion, if Chimeras can do it, so can Repressors. (Note that I only allow 6 models to fire, rather than the 7 total the FW Repressor allows.)

Limited the Book of Precepts and Icons of Judgement to vehicles selected as transports for a Personal Staff only. The army-wide usage of the Stubborn and Re-rolling To-Hit was just too good. Limiting them to a single command vehicle like this will help them to seem more special and less overpowered.

Moved Response Team from Fast Attack to Elites to help balance out the number of choices for these slots.

Increased the Front Armour on the Halligan to 12, and changed the Halligan Missile Launcher to S9, AP3, Ordnance 2, with the special +D3 AP only applying to Buildings and Fortifications, which it should now tear through like tissue paper... Points increased slightly to compensate.

Added the "Entangling" rule to Webbers (replacing the Pinning rule), allowing them to pin units normally immune to pinning in some way, and bringing back the Strength test that just feels so right with webbers.

Added the Land Speeder Storm as a Fast Attack choice. Several people suggested it, and I liked the idea so much that it got included in the primary army list. It is slightly modified from the Space Marine version. The BS is increased to 4 to represent the Arbites Crew rather than Space Marine Scouts, but it lost the "Jamming Beacon" rule to indicate that the Arbites version is slightly lower on the technology scale.

Added the option for the Leman Russ to be upgraded to either an Exterminator or a Punisher. (None of the other variants seemed to fit the Arbites well.)

Increased the upgrade cost of the Land Speeder squadron's Autocannons to 10 pts - it was noted that LS's with AC's and 2 HK missiles were very good at bringing down transports and other light to medium vehicles, and as such they were just a bit too cheap.

Replaced the Valkyrie with the Eagle Assault Shuttle (based on references from Execution Hour). I designed it as a hybrid between the Valkyrie and the Stormraven/Storm Eagle, and its armament is based largely on the descriptions in Execution Hour. It was also moved to Heavy Support due to its high levels of anti-tank ability, and to provide greater contrast between it and the Land Speeder Storm. (You can still get these in larger numbers as dedicated transports using Judge Schindler's Spacebourne Precinct rule.)

Cleaned up a few straggler issues related to removing the Patrol Vox, as well as some issues resulting from combining a few units from V1.0 to V1.1. (i.e. references to shotguns in the the Combat Team options.)

Modelling & Painting section updated with many new, better images thanks to ArbitorIan.


Other Notes:

Still need a better name for the "power ram".

Does the new "Entangling" rule work for you? Is it straightforward or confusing? Is anything about it ambiguous? Are there any "Strength bonuses" which exist that you are unsure whether they would count or not?

[Ambience 327]

Stealth edit - I had forgotten to update the cost on the Land Speeder Storm's Autocannon to match the Land Speeder Squadron. This is now updated. (I won't be changing the version number for that little edit!)

[folketsfiende]

Having read through the dex just once I would like to start off by saying that you've done a really good job. Over all it seems pretty balanced, and there are many different units with unique roles. At first I wasn't sure about the overall BS4, but I think it works, although I wouldn't have given Troops anything but BS3. The high amount of Auxiliary forces is confusing at first; why not include a paragraph or two right before their first appearance in the dex explaining their role? I do think that they serve a purpose in the dex, allowing players to use their existing armies to make an easier shift to an Arbites army.

The layout of the codex could be clearer, with more visible Headers, unit names and so on, making it easier to find the information you're looking for.

All in all, I would say that this is a very good effort, and I have already incorporated some of your ideas in my own Arbites dex.

[folketsfiende]

Still need a better name for the "power ram".

Personally I think Power Ram works well. You might go for Thunder Maul or something like that, but it might be confusing.

Does the new "Entangling" rule work for you? Is it straightforward or confusing? Is anything about it ambiguous? Are there any "Strength bonuses" which exist that you are unsure whether they would count or not?

Entangling is very understandable. Perhaps it could be clarified that the strength test has to be taken regardless of the enemy unit suffering any unsaved wounds.

[Ambience 327]

Having read through the dex just once I would like to start off by saying that you've done a really good job. Over all it seems pretty balanced, and there are many different units with unique roles. At first I wasn't sure about the overall BS4, but I think it works, although I wouldn't have given Troops anything but BS3.

I think the simplicity of very few standard statlines is useful. The fact that most of the Task Teams (with the notable exception of the Suppression Team) share the same basic profiles means there is less to remember in the heat of battle. Also, it helps show that even the lowest rung Arbites are highly trained and, individually at least, more than a match for a PDF trooper or Imperial Guardsman - as they should be according to the background info.

The high amount of Auxiliary forces is confusing at first; why not include a paragraph or two right before their first appearance in the dex explaining their role? I do think that they serve a purpose in the dex, allowing players to use their existing armies to make an easier shift to an Arbites army.

I agree that the sheer quantity can be overwhelming, but I think the intro that I give to the Auxiliaries section, coupled with their limited nature and the fact that you can even outright ignore them if you like, means that they can serve useful roles (to help further define your ideal of an Arbites Precinct, and/or allow you to use models you already have) without muddying up the main list with lots of complicated units and additional rules.

The layout of the codex could be clearer, with more visible Headers, unit names and so on, making it easier to find the information you're looking for.

I am not sure I quite follow you here. My Codex has at least as many headers, unit names, etc as the standard GW Codex books. Granted, some of my unit entries occupy shared space on a page rather than taking up a whole page per unit - but I really didn't feel like writing up enough fluff to fill a full page for each unit. I don't think it is really all that difficult - especially with the Table of Contents at the front and the page references in the Army List section - to find what you are looking for.

All in all, I would say that this is a very good effort, and I have already incorporated some of your ideas in my own Arbites dex.

Thank you. Is your Codex posted anywhere? I would love to take a look at your efforts as well.

Personally I think Power Ram works well. You might go for Thunder Maul or something like that, but it might be confusing.

It works, I just keep getting this nagging feeling that there is a cooler name out there that I am just not thinking of. I don't know what it could be, but if I ever stumble across it, I'm sure it will just click.

Entangling is very understandable. Perhaps it could be clarified that the strength test has to be taken regardless of the enemy unit suffering any unsaved wounds.

I will look into that. Thanks.

[folketsfiende]

I I am not sure I quite follow you here. My Codex has at least as many headers, unit names, etc as the standard GW Codex books. Granted, some of my unit entries occupy shared space on a page rather than taking up a whole page per unit - but I really didn't feel like writing up enough fluff to fill a full page for each unit. I don't think it is really all that difficult - especially with the Table of Contents at the front and the page references in the Army List section - to find what you are looking for.

I meant the visual layout of the pages. IMHO there is too little difference between different types of text, and the way the different text types are oriented on the page. There's some difficulty finding the kind of text (Name, statline, equipment options, rules etc) you're after. That said, your dex is quite an achievement. As a matter of fact, I think it is just the professionality of the effort that makes me expect a more GW-like layout.

Thank you. Is your Codex posted anywhere? I would love to take a look at your efforts as well.

It's very much unfinished. I'm playtesting units as I finish painting them, which really is doing things backwards. It will just be a rules set, without fluff, and it will be geared against what units I wanted to include in the army. All of this limits the possible usefulness of my efforts severely. Anyway, when it's in a more finished state I can drop you a PM.