Disappointed with new GW direction for Empire

[draccan]

Now that the look of the new Empire releases have been published here and none of this is a secret any more, I would like to take a moment and dwell on what I think about the new direction GW is taking with the army.

I am saddened to say that all the decisions they seem to make lately are made from a pure business decision to make more money. Sure it is a business driven by revenue and they have to make sound business decisions. But there is a line between good business practices and pure unadulterated greed.

Looking at the new Empire models they release three "large" pope mobile kits, which essentially is the same kit construction varied in three different ways. That makes it easy to produce and at the same time they can sell these large easy to produce kits to maximum prices.
And then they add some monstrous cavalry that to me at least does not look that good either, but is a whole new unit = more dough.

Now I applaud new models and new army entries. But the pope mobile kits are so poorly done and so non-sensible and boring. And I hate to think about all the cool things they could have included instead incl. upgrading existing kits. Also the idea of wizards with weird contraptions on tall chariots look vulnerable and silly on a battlefield. What do they really add to the game?

I would much rather that GW had gone back to Empire's xenophile roots and included ogres, halflings, giants and hell even dwarfs. This whole frantic religious xenophobe thing they have going on is boring. The army is becoming more and more bland with each new edition.
A contingent army of Halflings would have been so much more cooler if included as a sub list.

There is just so much wrong with the new models..

[Waagh Rider]

Disagree with every single word of this. But then that's the sort of response you were hoping for I dare say. Warseer - never knowingly positive!

[Ivellis]

The only thing I'm not a fan of is that giant 'laser' it just looks out of place. Absolutely love the demigryph knights though. Possibly my new favorite cavalry in the game.

[Malorian]

The only thing I'm not a fan of is that giant 'laser' it just looks out of place. Absolutely love the demigryph knights though. Possibly my new favorite cavalry in the game.

Really? I think the idea of the magic laser thing is so insanely awesome that I can't help but like it. Kind of like a goblin holding a hammer being tied to an orc's battle-axe

You just know at some point some wizard acidently fired a fireball through a looking glass and then got the idea of lining 10 in a row

[enygma7]

Empire were too much a historical army before, lacking an obvious fantasy theme. I can see valid design reasons for what they've done - they want to play up the faith/steampunk and renaissance angle to emphasise the empire's character and they want to include more obviously fantasical units like the demigriffons, which also fit with the heraldic imagry the empire have.

As to the inclusion of large plastic kits that can be assembled as multiple different units, this is hardly a sudden new direction for GW. I think the OP's assumption that this is all purely money driven is overly cynical and ignores the obvious theme GW are trying to give the empire.

However, I have to agree I'm not really a fan of the new models. They seem overly blocky and absurdly charicaturish. The griffon is clearly posing heroically as if it was in a renaissance painting but its just a bit too overdone. Sometimes less is more.

[Von Wibble]

Really? I think the idea of the magic laser thing is so insanely awesome that I can't help but like it. Kind of like a goblin holding a hammer being tied to an orc's battle-axe

You just know at some point some wizard acidently fired a fireball through a looking glass and then got the idea of lining 10 in a row

Agreed. We have GIANT FRICKIN "LASERS" now.

I don't know whether or not I agree with the op. It actually isn't difficult to add dwarfs or halflings to a list anyway - I use them as counts as crossbowmen and archers respectively. If allied rules and DOW were ever sorted you'd be fine. But adding new models and units provides options we couldn't have had before.

[Ivellis]

I hope Bretonnia gets an overhaul that focuses on stronger fantasy aspects. And also makes Grail Knights monsters. More Fantasy in my Warhammer Fantasy is always good.

[Odin]

I think the variety of responses on this thread and the main rumour thread show why GW is right to expand the Empire in this way. Anyone who wants the traditional army, most of what you need is still going to be there (yeah, I'd like Ogres and Kislev too). But big weird machines are definitely an idea that belongs in an Empire army (not convinced by the execution though).

More options is a good thing. Empire armies can be a bit too samey otherwise.

[The Low King]

By releasing new kits, including giant LASERS empire are getting more bland?.....right...

Also, this is why leaking this stuff is bad; Stop complaining and wait for the book, the rules and whatever else there is before you judge the entire army. Before VCs were released i saw thred of people moaning about how zombies were still useless etc.....just shut up and be patient.

[noneshallpass!]

"Anyone who wants the traditional army,[...]"

I wonder if the new kits will be possible to do without.. I have a hard time building something I believe will perfrom without buying these news statues for my TK army, and this there is no way I will do..argh! I want a game of miniature soliders, not big toys.

[Myrmidon616]

Far from it. The plastic griffon, from what I've seen, beats even the Contemptor Dreadnought in terms of coolest model ever produced by GW as far as I'm concerned (although admittedly, the head is rather small looking). When I heard about the Demi-griffons, I inwardly moaned but having seen a piccy, I'm rather impressed (they remind me of Buckbeak from the Harry potter films, minus the wings and with barding). What's more, how is having special characters in plastic a bad thing?

I also quite like the contrast between the lithe, hawkish griffon you get in IoB and the large, brash griffon the new Empire has.

[DruidNei]

First post @ warseer and I'm already hating something, namely War Altar and all the wizardy stuff. They look so out of place in empire army. It feels like GW needed to add some "new big shiny dual kit". I'm waiting for someone to start shouting "IMMA FIRING MY LAZOR".

Empire was always known for mechanical contraptions, not for putting out some weird magical device on a carriage too small to safely carry it and sending it to battle like it was the best of ideas. Those things should be left in wizard towers where they belong. Pidgeon bombs were not silly enough?
I hope they won't be autoinclude type of units, or we will be seeing armies with the only war-altar in the Empire, few of the oh-so-rare 12 steam tanks, and one-and-only Magnifying Glass Death Ray. All those in every border skirmish.

One thing in which I disagree with OP are the Demigryph Knights. They look good, they add needed diversity without killing overall empire theme. It's a shame that GW created the new big thingy instead of upgrading old knight models. Those guys really deserve it.

[Rosstifer]

Pic's have been up for a few hours and already a thread like this? Seriously though, if you don't like the new direction, I'm sure you will be able to field an old style Empire army to great effect.

[Nubl0]

You know what, that's fine... the op sounds a little paranoid but who cares. The great thing is, if you don't like the model you don't even HAVE to include it in your army! You can convert your own or just completely ignore their existence. Also you got possibly the best looking griffon ever and some really awesome not OTT demi knights. I have always looked at empire and loved the ordered theme but found it a tad dull, now with this new book and new kits I'm considering starting a small force.

[DareX2]

I hope Bretonnia gets an overhaul that focuses on stronger fantasy aspects. And also makes Grail Knights monsters. More Fantasy in my Warhammer Fantasy is always good.

Stronger fantasy elements? A mobile magic death ray, knights riding wingless griffins, and a wizardmobile called the "Celestial Hurricanium" sound pretty fantastical to me. I much prefer this direction to the generic history-gone-fantasy style the previous books were pursuing.

I also hope Grail Knights become monsters. Literally.

[DaemonReign]

The DemiGryphs were actually alot better than they could have been. If Empire necessarily has to have MC then this would be the way to get away with it.
About the pope-mobile 'kits' I actually like them in theory, but you gotta hand it to the OP that he's got a point about the execution: In our group we have a homebuilt Waltar already but I almost feel sorry for all the people who'll have to make do with 3 near identical Empire versions of the Black Coach.
I was expecting the Luminark etcetera to be alot Bigger to be honest. Hell if they put the Terrogheist on that huge oblat of a base then why not these.. So yeah that's sort of surpricing and sort of dissappointing I guess but what the hell..
The "little models" are all great. Karl Franz Gryphon looks all right as well. The ultimate score of this release will be in the actual rules inside the new army book.

But yeah, perhaps slightly too much business orientation when it comes to the execution of those 'wagons'. That can't be denied.

[The bearded one]

I like the demigryphs quite a lot, as they look a lot like horses with a bird's head but it does not look akward. Concerning the multikit wagon, personally I rather have GW make 1 kit with some compromise to service 3 options like they did now, than just a single kit for a single option.

[Sexiest_hero]

Everything looks great.

[DareX2]

I am saddened to say that all the decisions they seem to make lately are made from a pure business decision to make more money. Sure it is a business driven by revenue and they have to make sound business decisions. But there is a line between good business practices and pure unadulterated greed.

Looking at the new Empire models they release three "large" pope mobile kits, which essentially is the same kit construction varied in three different ways. That makes it easy to produce and at the same time they can sell these large easy to produce kits to maximum prices.
And then they add some monstrous cavalry that to me at least does not look that good either, but is a whole new unit = more dough.

So you say you're all for new models and new entries, but then say that making new units is just an attempt at generating sales, which is bad business. Nevermind that generating sales is the point of business, nevermind that generating sales requires you to make a product people either need or want (and this hobby is a luxury; not only do people not need to buy these models at all, they most likely don't even need to buy them to play the game at all). Making a kit that can become made into different units doesn't indicate "pure, unadulterated greed." It's smart. It makes it easier for small stores to stock on the shelves and to keep stock moving (ie not having one unit constantly out of stock while the other unit never sells at all). It's easier to produce, with less overhead. It offers options to the player by allowing them to play with all the pieces before deciding which to build, and gives them leftover bits for other projects.

It's not about greed, it's about being concise.

Also, you can have an opinion without tacking "GW = greedy" onto your post.

Also the idea of wizards with weird contraptions on tall chariots look vulnerable and silly on a battlefield. What do they really add to the game?

See, I think they look awesome. They are convincing me to make an Empire army. As for what they add to the game, I have no idea, but my guess would be pure, unadulterated fun. Also buffs and lasers, which sounds absolutely fantastic.

[I3uLLioN]

and it begins....

How long until... "Over-powered!", "Nerfed!", "What tier?" threads appear.