Forgeworld Newsletter #302:- Stormeagle, Decimator Weapons

[Draconis]

I understand that, but settling for less just because its better than what you currently have is like enjoying a rotten sandwich just because you don't have one. Why can't we ever have equivalent instead of loyalists just having to have better just because they are loyalists.

[The Marshel]

problem is demonic possession overal is a tad lack lustre really. Hopefully next book will make it interesting and useful without just directly porting loyalist rules, and given the next book is rumoured to be close, ya never know

[Killgore]

Why are people crying over Daemonic Possession being worse than Potms?

I look forward to Spacemarine players crying over the hordes of Chaos troops that pour out of Storm Eagles into their lines,

Remember Chaos unit choices tend to have more dudes then loyalist choices ;P

[Draconis]

And how is that? They tend to have better weapons and/or special weapons.

[Sildani]

And so what? Have a thought for those of us who have NOTHING like a Storm Eagle available. As an Eldar player, I'd kill to have a Wave Serpent with two effective weapon systems with an option for two more, a 20 man capacity, the ability to fire one more gun than usual, the ability to assault after moving, and all in the under-used Fast Attack slot! WE, Eldar should have something like this, if we're the technologically advanced, fast-moving, shooty, every-life-is-precious race GW say we are.

Don't mean to rant (much), but complaining about something so good is a bit... tough to read.

[Shas'O'Stormblade]

People will cry until their codex auto-wins against everyone. The reason we have codex creep is because one codex is used in skilled hands and wins all the time and everyone cries until a newer more powerful codex comes out. The day all units and codices are balanced is the day hell freezes over. GW and FW have too many codices to support and until they start releasing more than 2 1/2 a year for 40k we will have whiners who think everyone else is overpowered.

I personally can't wait until Eldar get a Storm eagle equivalent. They will be much more fun to play when it finally happens.

[Petay1985]

The storm eagle rules state that it comes with no under wing weapons and thus the Hellstrike Missiles or Twin-Linked Lascannons are upgrades, all appears well. If one decided to build it with out the wing mounted weapons will the kit come with blanking plates to or alternative wing undersides to effectly model this? i suspect it doesnt and we will be forced to convert it should we wish to not have either th missiles or the lascannons.

[Galfinnan]

Looks like a really nice model and I can see this being part of my army in the near future. I was planning on running a dual raider Deathwing list (yes I know) but swapping the raiders out for one or even two of these would be really nice.

[KeyOfTwilight]

I do so wish I didn't have to wait till the 27th for this thing to ship out. I wanna start painting mah birdy!

[Spacker]

FW just posted up revised rules for the Decimator on their site, link was posted on their Facebook account. Get the new rules here: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Download...imator_mk2.pdf

Quick summary: base cost gone up 10pts, side armour increased by 1, and includes rules for the Heavy Conversion Beamer; needs some editing too, as it includes the same rules twice ...

[Caitsidhe]

Experimental rules have a LONG way to go. There isn't a chance in hell I'd put this thing on the table based on its stats. It looks good but that isn't enough for me to field it.

[Marshal]

One would think that somewhere, the Storm Eagle would be armed with Storm Eagle Rockets from the Guard Codex...

[Dr Morbius]

Really? This is what they come up with after the initial reaction to the rules?

Increasing the SIDE amour and making it 10 Points MORE expensive...

Sorry but this need a front of 13 and dreadnought close combat weapons without a further increase in points.

I really want to like this Model and include it in my army. But with these rules, i just don't see any point...

[Caitsidhe]

My problem with it is the size combined with no real gain. The ability to rise after being wrecked sounds good and all, but the cold hard truth is that it is unlikely to ever be a factor in your game. Consider the following:

1. The ready availability of AP-1 weapons means it is very likely to be blown up in the first place which means it isn't coming back.
2. Even if it is just wrecked (with the potential of return) the odds are highly against it. Most games go 5-6 Turns. Statistically it isn't coming back.
3. It is much larger than a regular Dread and thus much harder to gain cover for it.
4. Despite the large size it is actually weaker in output. STR-8 cannot do better than glance a Land Raider. A normal Dread can destroy one.
5. It is ridiculously expensive by comparison to a Dread or a Defiler, particularly if you try to go with the weaponry upgrades.
6. It is inferior to a Dread in both WS and BS, being no better than a damn Defiler.
7. The Weaponry upgrades look good in theory but won't deliver in a reliable way.
8. I expect something that much bigger and more expensive to be more survivable. As other have suggested, the ARM should be much higher.

In short, I feel they have dramatically over-valued the model, the ability to return to the board in particular. It would have to have a much higher probability of returning for me to consider fielding it, have a BS-4 and WS-4, and/or have a much higher ARM. If they want to keep the chance of it returning that low, they need to increase armor of that thing almost up to (or almost to) Land Raider level and make it immune to benefits which provide an extra die of armor pen. They could do these thing or simply reduce the price to make it an alternate Dread choice.

[Scribe of Khorne]

I dont see it as a CC Walker at all, as that role can be better filled by a number of things (normal Dread w/2 DCCW, Bloodslaughterer, Defiler w/Extra CCW's, Contemptor). 205 Points for 8 STR8 shots though at 36+6 inches? Sure, where else can you do that in the chaos book?

[Ozendorph]

I'm fine with the WS/BS, given the daemonic possession. Weapon options are interesting to me...S8 claws with wound/pen re-rolls are rather nice, particularly when a heavy flamer (that roasts embarked troops) is thrown in the deal. I ordered mine with a pair of claws and a transport mangling butcher cannon.

Glad they bumped the side AV, as that was a real problem. Front should probably be 13, just by looks. Marks should be re-costed or modified, as the Khorne rules don't stack up to the rest and Nurgle seems like the obvious choice for most purposes

[Caitsidhe]

I dont see it as a CC Walker at all, as that role can be better filled by a number of things (normal Dread w/2 DCCW, Bloodslaughterer, Defiler w/Extra CCW's, Contemptor). 205 Points for 8 STR8 shots though at 36+6 inches? Sure, where else can you do that in the chaos book?

Let's be certain we understand what you are asking? Is there anything else in the CSM book which provides that exact shooting profile? No. Are there things in the CMS book which provide more economical, hard hitting shooting? Yes. My issue with your statement is that CSM isn't lacking for short, mid, or long range firepower. Do you truly see the value in taking this thing in addition to Obliterators? If so, why? For the same price as this thing tricked out you could buy several "shooting focus" basic CSM Dreads and hit just as hard (harder actually) with greater accuracy. Moreover, using two distinctly different CSM Dreads allows options and survivability for the same cost. No matter how you slice it, this damn thing is a poor choice.

[Konovalev]

Dear Forgeworld
Please go against the(GW's) grain and make space marine vehicles that are less boxy and generic. I like the rules for it, but the storm eagle looks like a shipping container with stubby little wings. Give us something with a sharper more menacing look to it.

The storm eagle looks like it was designed to hold shoes not space marines...

[Scribe of Khorne]

Let's be certain we understand what you are asking? Is there anything else in the CSM book which provides that exact shooting profile? No. Are there things in the CMS book which provide more economical, hard hitting shooting? Yes. My issue with your statement is that CSM isn't lacking for short, mid, or long range firepower. Do you truly see the value in taking this thing in addition to Obliterators? If so, why? For the same price as this thing tricked out you could buy several "shooting focus" basic CSM Dreads and hit just as hard (harder actually) with greater accuracy. Moreover, using two distinctly different CSM Dreads allows options and survivability for the same cost. No matter how you slice it, this damn thing is a poor choice.

8 STR8 Shots for 205 points, at range, with a few handy rules like saves (how often do DE players take flickerfields) on Weapon Destroyed or Immobalized and it flat out ignores stun/shaken? Thats not insignificant really.

Lets assume your already bringing oblits, and your facing those painful all mech armies that nearly every 'modern' book can bring.

If you bring 3 units of 2 oblits, there goes your HS, and you have some solid reliable shooting at range that can either pop tanks, or cook the contents of a popped tank. If you want your Oblits doing the latter, something else needs to reliably pop transports. Sure a shooty dread is good and cheap when it isnt an IDIOT that does something you dont want, but its not even close to the same output as this can bring at pure shooting, until you bring 2, and then its not as good in CC if it does end up there.

What shooting config will hit harder? Dread with MM/ML? Yeah its super cheap but what if it tries to charge off? What if someone puts a speed bump infront of it and you fire frenzy? I love my FW dread, but its burned me several times.

I dont know, I really like this thing. I dont think it needed to go up 10 points, but for what it can fill in a CSM army (especially a Berzerker one) its looking good to me.

[Maxis Lithium]

in addition to going up 10 points, it gained 1 point of armour on the sides, making is 12-12-11. worth the 10 point IMO.

I'm running it with Butcher cannon and nurgel's blessing. a cool 200 for what I think is a nice all arounder.