Is Sportsmanship a Dying Art?

[Shadoer]

Ok as some background I used to play fanatically in 6th Edition, played a bit in 7th Edition, and just really got back in for 8th Edition.

I'm not sure if it's nostalgia or me growing older, but it's like sportsmanship is in the gutter these days. People are more rules layer like, willing to fudge things in their favor, and in some cases are being down right dicks.

Like I was just playing a fantasy game in a Games Workshop store against a Chaos Warrior player. Part way into the game two people (store regulars) come by and start trashing him by going "Hey are you going to loose again?" and "Oooh you're doing pretty bad". Normally I would think this was ribbing between friends, but he clearly was feeling hurt by this.

Anyways the game comes to the end and he won. He played a better game and I was about to shake his hand. Then my victorious opponent starts going "Yeah they all thought I was going to loose but you couldn't kill ONE unit of Chaos Warriors!".

"Ok yeah I'm a bit rusty, but yeah you did a great job."

"You couldn't kill ONE unit man, not one unit."

"Great well good game."

"You just killed my dogs and they are only worth 40 pts each! I got your general and everything."

"Ok..."

Like is this how people play the game these days?

[Hicks]

Wow, well this is one of the reasons why I tend to pretty much only play at home with friends, but that guy was a dick as you said. I mean, we all like to win, but to treat it like it's a huge accomplishment that entitles you to be an ass to the other player is ridiculous. This is a game... of toy soldiers... and it uses freaking dices!

Luckily for me, my friends are just beer and pretzel (well beer and chicken wings to be precise) players and nobody ever disrespects anybody.

[chaospantz]

Next time you play that guy dont feel bad about people trash talking him, it seems from your talk at the end that he deserves it for being a bit of a jerk. And next time you play him I hope you crush his soul and table him. I dont know if it might be the group around their but we have a prety good group of people around here. Everyone gets along and theirs 2-3 of us long time players that try to help out the new people by guiving them advice. We still go for it during tournies but I can only think of 2 people that were jerks and they dont come around anymore, mostly because we stoped playing them.

[Pancakey]

How old was this player? That can be quite telling.

[Sexiest_hero]

That's been gamers since ad&d. You have got to remember, alot of these kids get/got bullied by jocks like myself. The have all this pent up rage, and winning a game of plastic mens, cards, D&D, MMOs are all they have. Couple that with a lack of social skills from, and never learning sportsmanship, from never having done anything with anybody from out side of their group, leads to a powderkeg of a gamer. I call them locus gamers, They descend on a game or forum pump it full of Bile, then go off to ruin the next big thing. When somebody calls somebody else on their sexual choice or race on xbox live, spam a Tier character like Ken and ryu then mock you for picking somebody you like, don't get upset, tell them you pity them, that the fact that winning Games is serious enough to them to sink the level of trolling is sad, that there is so much more to life. Older gamers like me have a responsibility to coach the new teens coming in. When some punk tries that crap I pull them aside and tell them, "All these guys here are like family to me, you can be too, But if you disrespect them you disrespect me, and I don't take to kindly to being disrespected, conduct yourself like the grown man you are (becoming) now come have a drink on me." It's the ole coach/ drill-Sargent speech, and it works every time.

[Shadoer]

Next time you play that guy dont feel bad about people trash talking him, it seems from your talk at the end that he deserves it for being a bit of a jerk. And next time you play him I hope you crush his soul and table him. I dont know if it might be the group around their but we have a prety good group of people around here. Everyone gets along and theirs 2-3 of us long time players that try to help out the new people by guiving them advice. We still go for it during tournies but I can only think of 2 people that were jerks and they dont come around anymore, mostly because we stoped playing them.

I'm hoping they were mocking him because he's a jerk... but it really felt like the group that hangs out at this store is like this. I'm going to give it a chance though.

But yeah, next time I play against this guy I'm not treating it as a friendly game. I'll be going all out.

How old was this player? That can be quite telling.

If I had to guess I'd say he was 21-24 years old and I'm just turning 28. So he's not that young.

[m1acca1551]

Sportsmanship is alive and well, ive played many a game that has ended with a hand shake a joke and we'll game again soon. 90% of games will pass by like this until the 1 game that ends with some one being a dick or in my case throwing his minis across the room, and asking me to step outside. Lucky for him my mate told him i was ex army and he quietly gathered his things and left.

At the end of the day if you look over your games how many have passed with no incident as opposed to the ones like you recently experienced, and this will tell you hopefully lol that sportsmanship is a live and well and that some people are just ******.

[Oogie boogie boss]

That guy sounds like a dick, and I can only hope the reason people were teasing him is because he has a history of being a dbag. Either that or he was being a jerk because he get's bullied and put down by others at the store and crowing over beating you is the only way he can boost his self esteem.
If you do go back and play there, and end up playing him, take the high ground and continue to be a gentleman. If he still acts like a dick, calmly explain to him that you feel sorry that he needs to win a game of what is effectively toy soldiers to feel like a success, and that perhaps he should re-examine his life priorities a little.
Then walk away as he has a nervous breakdown.

Seriously though, these days I only play against friends, as i'm a little older and don't play that often, so like to have relaxed games with people I know. Generally though, I think most gamers are stand up guys, and it's rare that sportsmanship is absent. It's telling that the guy was so old, i'd expect it and maybe understand if he was a geeky kid, but he should be past that by now.
But don't fight fire with fire, next time calmly say that you don't want to play someone with that mentality and walk away. Let's face it, with an attitude like that, even if he wins he loses.

[Wishing]

Social skills and a basic level of respect for your peers are marks of maturity, and sadly a lot of gamers are somewhat deficient in the maturity department. I don't think this is a recent thing, but that it has always been like this. The only remedy I know of is to do your best to find a group of mature gamers that you get along with, and form a group with these people. Then you can play with a group where people are cool, rather than having to play random games against strangers that often are immature jerks.

[calnen]

I never play in games workshop, mostly for this reason. A lot of the people in there are young, and haven't quite grasped the idea of winning (or losing) with grace.

But no, sportsmanship isn't a dying art. In the last year I've played in about 6 tournaments (mostly in Maelstrom, UK), and every game has been against a decent bloke. Win or lose (mostly lose) you should be able to shake hands at the end and look forward to the next game.

[NerZuhl]

Anecdotal Evidence is just that.

Your game doesn't indicate the trends in Fantasy. Furthermore, you only have had one experience to refer to. And you seem to suggest that during the span of 6th and 7th edition this never even once happened to you. Was this your first time playing a pick up game?

You lost.
He was a jerk.
The end.

[Gary wyper]

I play in my local gw all the time and I have to say the majority of people are good sports

obviously during the game people become competative,but personaly I dont mind that

just remember to conduct yoursekf properly,shake youre opponents hand at the end win or lose

be gracious in defeat and victory and soon you will see who gets games and who dosent

[nurgle5]

Strangely enough, I've encountered less unsportsmanlike players since returning to the game. In 6th/7th I played at a few tourneys and at the local GW. Most players were good sports and some were childish WAAC players (At one tourney my opponent deliberately neglected to inform me that the War Altar was Unbreakable. Not being familiar with it's rules, I had actually asked about them at the start of the game and this wasn't mentioned). In contrast, my most recent tourney was full of gents (one even insisted on buying me new dice on account of how poor my rolls were!).

All anecdotal evidence, but being friendly and polite takes you a long way in any aspect of your life.

[GodlessM]

Unfortunately OP you may be right. Sportsmanship still exists but it seems to be dying out alright.

[Snake1311]

Social skills and a basic level of respect for your peers are marks of maturity, and sadly a lot of gamers are somewhat deficient in the maturity department. I don't think this is a recent thing, but that it has always been like this. The only remedy I know of is to do your best to find a group of mature gamers that you get along with, and form a group with these people. Then you can play with a group where people are cool, rather than having to play random games against strangers that often are immature jerks.

I'd imagine someone who is in their early twenties should be mature enough no?

He might have not been a jerk; maybe neither were his friends. It might just be their dynamics, and you were the one who didn't fit in. In my local group of friends, there is an absurd amount of trashtalk, often based on insane optimism; in contrast the dudes I play with in London are more on the reserved, even pessimistic side.

TL;DR trashtalk back and see what happens

[NealRC]

You're touching on something that I am going to have to deal with relatively soon as a parent. I have two young children (the oldest is 6) and I am trying to figure out a way to teach them to lose gracefully.

I am not a fan of the parental philosophy of "it doesn't matter if you win or lose, trying your best and taking part is all that matters". "Everyone gets the same medal just for entering" - real life is just not like that.

So winning is important but no-one can (or should) win all the time.

And your character really comes out when you lose. To lose gracefully, to take the lesson of the loss and to build to the future... this is far more important.

So the next time you play him, don't change your game. Don't go all out. Play your normal game (in which I assume you try to win anyway). If you win, shake his hand and say "thanks for the game". If you lose, do the same thing.

In fact, shaking hands after the game should be mandatory

[Yowzo]

Must be an age thing. Since I returned to the game on the death throes of 7th, I kept playing with mostly the same people I played 4th and 5th with (which means all of us are on the wrong side of 30) and games are mostly smooth and fun.

I've only found dicks on tournaments and GW stores, and they were all significantly younger than me.

[Snake1311]

Tournament player average age is about 30ish, maybe late 20s, so I don't really know how that would have happened.

Shops are almost universally a bad place to play though, full of kiddies

[IcedCrow]

Sportsmanship is not dying. It all depends on who you surround yourself with. Most of the people I've ever met are not bad sports. They are down the middle. They are happy when they win, get annoyed when the dice go south, but will shake your hand after.

There are a couple people that stand out as smiling and good natured despite getting their ribs kicked in. And then there are a handful of people I've had to meet or play against who rage, flip tables, throw dice, throw models, rant, swear, rave, etc... when they lose, and do the mocking jig when they win and strut around like they are napolean reincarnated on a warhammer table.

Its just that we tend to really really remember the bad sports and those that are good or "down the middle" are forgotten even though they typically outnumber the bad.

[Corvus Corone]

I find it's all about finding the right people to play. In any environment you'll find players you will enjoy playing and those you won't. Identify the former.