Transformation of Kadon

[Rasholm]

Hello Warseer members,
so looking at the transformation of Kadon spell it is stated that
"he is now technically a monster" and later that he cannot channel nor cast spells.
Looking further at the definition of a wizard on p. 28 in BrB a wizard is a model that can cast spells.
On p 27 it says that the wizard rolls on the miscast table after the results of the spell.
So the rules as written would seem to indicate that while transformed the model is not a wizard and therefore cannot be affected by miscasts.
Obviously this is not rules as intended but as far as I can see that is a legal interpretation. Let me know your comments.
Thanks

[hamsterwheel]

There is no text in the Transformation of Kadon spell that stipulates that the Wizard is no longer a Wizard. It just tells you that while transformed, the Wizard cannot cast spells or use any of his/her mundane items or magic items. That doesn't mean he's no longer a wizard, it just means he's now a Wizard that can't do those things.

[Rasholm]

but if a wizard is defined as a character that can cast spells then he is no longer a wizard while transformed as he cannot cast spells

[AMWOOD co]

If you want to get technical, look at the next subheading under p28, Wizard Level. It states that every wizard has a wizard level, and it is this that actually defines what a wizard is (especially since any character can pick up a little ring and start throwing fireballs). In fact, reading the FAQ you will see that a wizard who has had his wizard level reduced to 0 is still considered a wizard even though he cannot cast spells. In like manner, if a wizard failed a casting or miscast and can't cast this turn, that doesn't mean he's not a wizard until the turn is over.

As for how this interacts with the transformation, there is nothing in the spell's text that states that he loses any wizard levels, only the ability to cast spells.

[Rasholm]

Thanks for the answer. Yes I had seen that. However that cannot be the defining criteria for wizards, as it just says wizards have a wizard level, not that non-wizards cannot have one. So again the definition is that if a model can cast it is wizard. Oh and also that paragraph says wizards have a level between 1-4 however one of the resulots of the miscast is that the wizard can have a level 0

[Alcibiades]

What are you looking for here? An acknowledgement that GW rules aren't written airtight? The answer to your question is that the wizard can still be affected by miscasts while Transformed. If you want to roll your head back and forth about whether or not the definition of wizard is well described, go right ahead.

[AMWOOD co]

However that cannot be the defining criteria for wizards, as it just says wizards have a wizard level, not that non-wizards cannot have one. So again the definition is that if a model can cast it is wizard.

By that definition, anyone carrying the Ruby Ring of Ruin is a wizard, as are Tyrion, Treemen, Warrior Priests, and anyone else who casts a bound spell. But, and this is important, we already know that's not true (p37, 1st paragraph).

What are you looking for here? An acknowledgement that GW rules aren't written airtight? The answer to your question is that the wizard can still be affected by miscasts while Transformed. If you want to roll your head back and forth about whether or not the definition of wizard is well described, go right ahead.

Thank you. There's a reason that the FAQ's are several dozen pages long.

[Lord Inquisitor]

What bearing does being a monster have? There are plenty of monsters that are wizards (galrauch, greater daemons, daemon princes, etc.)

[Sayber]

More than likely he just wants to avoid rolling the miscast when 6 dicing the spell

[hazmiter]

Transformation of khadon......
Any ideas on how to use it effectively????

[yabbadabba]

Transformation of khadon......
Any ideas on how to use it effectively????

Transform. Eat things. It can be quite interesting casting it when in combat as the sudden sight of a mountain chimera or similar can cause a few sphincter twitches.

This is one of those arguments that isn't an argument because no purpose has been assigned to it. The OP needs to get back and explain what he/she is driving at.

[SanDiegoSurrealist]

Don’t have book in front of me so correct me if I am wrong (just do it gently please)

I know it says something to the effect of "...if there is no room in unit then spell is not cast." in the spell description.

But according to RAW if the Wizard is now a “Monster” he/she cannot join units.
So if the Wizard is in a unit, the Wizard cannot cast the spell until they leave the unit.

Not that I believe this is correct interpretation just making an observation.

[SanDiegoSurrealist]

double post

[Lord Inquisitor]

It says somewhere, I think the FAQ, that you stay in the unit as an exception to the normal rules.

[yabbadabba]

It says in the spell description that in this case, the wizard stays in the unit, its an exception.

Secondly, the wizard cannot cast spells or channel, but can still dispell and suffer from any miscast that might have resulted from casting Transformation. So the wizard counts as a wizard, can dispell as a wizard, but acts and is treated like a monster in all other respects until the spell is ended.

[Desd]

if a lvl2 wizard with 2 wounds transforms into a mountain chimera and takes 2 wounds as a montian chimera does the chimera die automatically or when transformation is dispelled? thank you for your time.

[theunwantedbeing]

Dead when the spell is dispelled.

[Mr_Rose]

if a lvl2 wizard with 2 wounds transforms into a mountain chimera and takes 2 wounds as a montian chimera does the chimera die automatically or when transformation is dispelled? thank you for your time.

When (if) the spell is dispelled. The beast has the number of wounds listed on its profile, not the wizard's.
As long as the wizard stays transformed though, he will still be alive after taking two wounds and can therefore still be healed.

[Moss]

Dead when the spell is dispelled.

I have nothing to back this up, but I don't know if this is true. The way I see it:

The wizard is a mountain chimaera with six wounds (or however many it is).
The wizard takes a wound. Wound #6 is gone.
The wizard takes a wound. Wound #5 is gone.
The spell is dispelled. Wounds #4 and #3 are now also gone.
The wizard still has wounds #2 and #1 left.

In summary, the first wounds to go are the extra wounds from the spell. Once those are gone, then the wizard's own wounds start to be removed.

[theunwantedbeing]

I have nothing to back this up, but I don't know if this is true.

I take it you haven't actually read the spell description properly then.
"Any wounds suffered by the wizard are carried over between transformations"