Horde formation

[The bearded one]

would love to land my helstom on that- or buffed motar

but you haveno way of killing that in combat!


then again you prob get beaten in the painting phase!

pha, killing it would be easy. Take a unit with as many ranks as the slaves, beat them in combat, watch the entire thing explode.

[danny-d-b]

true- just hope they don't reform 1st turn- or have a caracter with the stubbon crown at the back (if skaven still have the lead from the back rule, not sure don't play that much skaven with non-combat caracters)

[boli]

true- just hope they don't reform 1st turn- or have a caracter with the stubbon crown at the back (if skaven still have the lead from the back rule, not sure don't play that much skaven with non-combat caracters)

Skaven can only lead from the back if they've been challenged in combat.

[Awilla the Hun]

I use both for my Red Guardsmen. Both have their uses. Columns are useful, I find, against gunlines, when you have to move quickly through terrain and will probably defeat the enemy in close combat anyway. Forming a wider target for their missile troops to open up at is also a poor idea. When I really have to hold the enemy up (often a role given to my smaller units), then forming column is also useful. On the other hand, when I really have to start inflicting casualties (against small units of Chaos Warriors, for instance, when I MUST get kills or they'll chop up enough peasants to cancel my static res anyway), or face an enemy horde (the sheer weight of attacks often chews through my steadfast), I often form horde myself.

[Odin]

Thats because theres no point running cheap rubbish troops in horde, because they'll lose combat anyway so you want them to be steadfast for as long as possible. Sacrificing ranks for an extra 7-10 mediocre attacks isn't worth it. And as you play small games, you're unlikely to see elite units big enough to warrant hordeing.

Undead might be an exception, since they don't care about steadfast. But as soon as you start talking about grave guard equivalents or white lions, it's clear to see that an extra rank of accurate S5 or 6 attacks is worth it.

The other exception is GW marauders who are easily cheap enough to field several hordes in 2000 points.

[Odin]

I use horde formation on my Marauders of Khorne, and in my new Empire army I use it on my Flagellants, and intend to with my Halberdiers when GW get around to making a decent State Troops kit.

[Deff Mekz]

I know it would be terribly silly and just plain terrible, but I have this burning desire to deploy a Skaven Slave unit 90 wide and four or five deep; a unit that spans from one side of the table to the other.

Imagine how big the "explosion" would be, when they flee, if you deployed them 5 wide!

But this is of course a horde thread. I think I'll be using hordes in my new empire army. Just for looks really, I find hordes always look really impressive on the tabletop.

[The bearded one]

Imagine how big the "explosion" would be, when they flee, if you deployed them 5 wide!

90D3 str3 hits! That's about 180 hits!! That's simply going to wipe units out! xD

[Lord Inquisitor]

With sufficient density of slaves a critical mass is created, resulting in a chain reaction of terrifying power harnessed in ... the RATOM BOMB!

[FashaTheDog]

Hmmm...deploy the RATOM BOMB! of 540 Skavenslaves five wide and 90 deep facing a flank and side step them towards your enemy daring him to charge. This tactic says yes to my insanity!

[Urgat]

Awww man, I had an awesome pun on that, but upon googling Hillary Clinton, South Park and nuke, it turns out it only works in French >< Rats!

Hmmm...deploy the RATOM BOMB! of 540 Skavenslaves five wide and 90 deep facing a flank and side step them towards your enemy daring him to charge. This tactic says yes to my insanity!

And then it collides with my backward walking unit of squig herders?

[Sexiest_hero]

I use it when I'm sure I'm going to win, or know i'll be wiped out Combat reform is your friend.

[Andy p]

How about that slave idea.....but try it on squig herds instead. Although not as easy to destroy.....plus you can do stuff to your own slaves cant you?

[Athlan na Dyr]

1000 slaves in 100x10 with 10 warpfire throwers deployed right behind
Mother of God...

[Djekar]

I have a ...

(•_•) , ( •_•)>⌐■-■ , (⌐■_■)

... burning need to try that now.

[The Low King]

1000 slaves in 100x10 with 10 warpfire throwers deployed right behind
Mother of God...

Hits unit with something that causes panic, unit failes panic check, unit goes off the table, gg

[Mr Ogre]

Plus, you'd need 10 units of Clanrats or some such to bag all those Warpfire throwers. And Sods Law dictates one good shoeing, and the Slaves detonate :P

[FashaTheDog]

I don't think anyone here is advocating for the unit being effective, but rather amusing. A unit of 91 Skavenslaves deep is almost 6' long, making it impossible to actually advance with that rank bonus except by moving sideways and the unit cannot ever charge unless loses all of those ranks and becomes a massive horde. The minimum cost of the unit is also going to be 900 points (provided you run 90 deep instead to make room for the handles on your movement tray), which is a rather substantial joke portion for an army. Yet the sight of it alone would be worth the many looks of utter disbelief. And to see them get charged by an overeager enemy who hits it with most of his army would be nothing short of hysterical when the unit breaks in combat and inflicts a whole bunch of S3 hits on everything nearby. Being a steadfast Ld10 until it suffers no less than 411 casualties would be the only drawback to that hilarity. Still, having a massive wall you can shoot into is kind of cute too, but yeah, it is one of those epic ideas that will really get you nowhere in a game, but would probably be a talking point in any store it shows in for years to come.

[sulla]

A unit points cap is more effective (from a comp POV). Means elite troops can't be taken in horde-size units.

I think a wound cap is probably a better way to go. If most units can only go wounds strong, and even the cheapest, poorest troops can only go 50 strong, you not only reduce the power of hordes and ridiculous sized chaff units, but you also make normal bs based shooting and magic missiles more relevant because every kill they do actually matters. Even knights come back into prominence because units are not so huge that they will tie them up for the rest of the game.

[Mr Ogre]

I don't think anyone here is advocating for the unit being effective, but rather amusing. A unit of 91 Skavenslaves deep is almost 6' long, making it impossible to actually advance with that rank bonus except by moving sideways and the unit cannot ever charge unless loses all of those ranks and becomes a massive horde. The minimum cost of the unit is also going to be 900 points (provided you run 90 deep instead to make room for the handles on your movement tray), which is a rather substantial joke portion for an army. Yet the sight of it alone would be worth the many looks of utter disbelief. And to see them get charged by an overeager enemy who hits it with most of his army would be nothing short of hysterical when the unit breaks in combat and inflicts a whole bunch of S3 hits on everything nearby. Being a steadfast Ld10 until it suffers no less than 411 casualties would be the only drawback to that hilarity. Still, having a massive wall you can shoot into is kind of cute too, but yeah, it is one of those epic ideas that will really get you nowhere in a game, but would probably be a talking point in any store it shows in for years to come.

That, and some git is bound to Gateway it first turn!

On the subject of limiting hordes - Why? What does that achieve, other than limiting people's choice in making their army.

Sure, a horde of heavy infantry is pretty revolting in terms of potential, but it's all a massive points sink, so really, it should be capable of pasting a great number of units. Just because a unit is hard, doesn't mean it's unfair.