General opinion on forgeworld

[TheDoctor]

Hey all, so I took my eldar corsairs to a local tournament yesterday (saturday), and one of my opponents would not shut up about forgeworld being broken. However, he was playing daemons against 8 falcon chassis with holo-fields (3 falcons, 2 night spinners, 3 warp hunters, 2k list). However, at the end of the day, my friend who took regular Eldar took first place, and I placed like 4th or 5th. It was actually my stubborn refusal to give up that turned the final game against grey knights into a draw, allowing my friend to get 1st, and the grey knight guy to only get second.

My question is, do yall think forgeworld is broken/overpowered? My second opponent kept complaining and bitching about it, while my third opponent was like "Well, I'm just not a fan of forgeworld..."?

Edit: The funny thing is, no one started complaining about me using a forgeworld list until I started to win/pull a draw out of my ass. It should have been blatantly obvious to everyone when I told them my army list that I was using forgeworld. But then they used the excuse of "well, I don't know what is in your codex blah blah blah"

[Mr Zoat]

All of the recent Forgeworld stuff I have seen is either about right in terms of powerlevel or bad. I have seen silly powerful things like the origional version of the Lifta-Droppa, but those have been updated.

[Emerett]

I honestly think most of the forgeworld stuff is undercosted.

People who complain about it, will complain about anything.

[Khornies & milk]

This subject has been doing the rounds on Forums for years, and every thread ends the same, FW lovers will always love using the models and rules, and FW haters will have the opposite stance and bitch and moan about them. In the end your opponent can always just say no and walk away from a game, and that holds true for both camps.

Forgot to say what camp I'm in I love FW and have $1000's worth, and luckily get to use it all the time, so the haters have zero impact on my gaming.

[Latro_]

Until FW stuff is a mainstay in tournaments / codex books it'll always be marred with that 'its not balanced' thing.

Way things are going I can see FW stuff being more main streme as GW develops, already starting to see it with finecast.

Either the people you play with are cool with it or they aint, if its a non-competitve situations in my opinion they need to chillout and just enjoy the game... but i'm old and jaded as a wargamer .

[Satan]

My question is, do yall think forgeworld is broken/overpowered? My second opponent kept complaining and bitching about it, while my third opponent was like "Well, I'm just not a fan of forgeworld..."?

Edit: The funny thing is, no one started complaining about me using a forgeworld list until I started to win/pull a draw out of my ass. It should have been blatantly obvious to everyone when I told them my army list that I was using forgeworld. But then they used the excuse of "well, I don't know what is in your codex blah blah blah"

FW is generally considered underpowered. The only thing I've seen that breaks this trend would be the K'daii Destroyer in fantasy.

At current prices, who can be reasonably expected to know what's in another codex? This point is rather moot. I don't think I've ever bothered reading the IG codex for example, and anything I've learned regarding them has been learned from games. What are these people really saying? That they don't like it because they don't have pirated versions of if on their own hard drives?

Until FW stuff is a mainstay in tournaments / codex books it'll always be marred with that 'its not balanced' thing.

Way things are going I can see FW stuff being more main streme as GW develops, already starting to see it with finecast.

Either the people you play with are cool with it or they aint, if its a non-competitve situations in my opinion they need to chillout and just enjoy the game... but i'm old and jaded as a wargamer .

Hehe, not like GW stuff is always that balanced to begin with, and it hardly seems to be a focal point for them so I'm happy with whatever...

[Sami]

It depends on which bit of FW you are using.

The general "approved for use in standard 40,000" stamp thing I don't mind, as they're individual units designed to slot into an existing codex structure. For complete FW army lists, it depends on the list itself. A lot of FW lists are designed to be balanced within the campaign presented in the book and not for general 40K games. Often, the lists on paper are scewed towards a certain faction as the missions are designed for narrative play rather than competitive.

I do like having advance warning that FW stuff can be used so I can plan appropriately, but besides that I personally don't have any issues with it. I fully understand if people get upset about full FW army lists being used in regular 40K games (unless the whole thing has the Approved stamp), but for individual units that have the stamp (such as most of those in IA:A 2nd) then I don't mind.

Also, everything seems broken when you're playing as Daemons.

[koran]

I agree with most of the above. There isnt much that is overpowered from FW and a lot of stuff is a higher points cost than they should be. However, there are some models that go the other way and go too much for their cost, an example of this would be the warp hunter, which in the recent book is too powerful for the points.

Having said that there are enough GW units that suffer the same problem so limiting that annoyance to FW is a bit unfair.

[Emerett]

There's a couple of entire Codex's that suffer from the same issue.

So I don't really think it's a big deal.

[chriscrowing]

Despite owning NO FW stuff at all (yet) my position is that if it is an official GW model with official GW rules, then it's legal. Stop complaining because you're getting beaten you bad loser.

Also, the argument that "I don't know what's in your codex" is so inane it's unbelievable. For one thing, is every gamer to buy, read and memorise the contents of EVERY codex. Get to hell. Also, from an in-universe PoV, I'm pretty sure your average IG general (for example) isn't going to be fully aware of the exact capabilities of an Eldar D-Cannon when he sees on for the first time on the battlefield... so the concept that gamers have encyclopaedic knowledge of their opponents armies is a bit... silly.

Also, it's a war-game featuring little plastic models based on genetically modified humans and aliens fighting with laser guns. Stop taking it so seriously.

Oh, and I love the forge world models and if you're commited enough to the hobby to buy that stuff, I consider it an honour to face you on the tabletop.

[Kijamon]

I love forgeworld, the more variety I can see from game to game the better.

I own a wee bit of stuff and I am looking forward to trying out the storm eagle!

[CaptainGallas]

I think the real issue is the player's attitude, not the FW-stuff.
It's extremely rare to see a winning player complaining over the opponents army.

On the other hand, one of the most common human defense-mechanism's is to blame somebody/something else for the trouble you are in.
I think for say all Grey Knight players has experienced that. "Your army is broken" (and I'm upset because you just tabled me with units I didn't know of)

Small minded players who can't handle beeing beaten in a table top miniature game will always be around, so it doesn't matter if it's a FW-list,
a new codex, the first 6th ed codex, newly released models, a veteran player who just is really good or just a streak of really lucky dice rolls.

IMO, some players will always be complaining when they loose.
Such players I only play once in friendly games, but in a tourney, you just have to accept it and feel sorry for them.

[Shamana]

IA 11 did give eldar a few good things, especially in the much-maligned FA slot. It is my personal belief that the Hornet is second only to the Vendetta in the amount of firepower it can unleash for the price, and it is so much better than the vyper there is simply no contest. The Wasp walker is also quite decent (corsairs get it in the troop slot), and the corsair troops are pretty decent, not too different from the DE kabalites. Generally, IA 11 has some good stuff for eldar, but nothing THAT broken - some units just look a lot better than they are because of some poor units or force org slots in the eldar codex.

Corsairs can do an ok mech list* or a fully jetpack list with a lot of corsair squads with jetpacks and heavy weapons. The second is pretty unique but I wouldn't call it broken - it just uses a unit type not often seen and thus may surprise your opponent. If they optimized against a certain list type, and you bring something different, you have an advantage - not because the units themselves are broken, but because the enemy units aren't good against yours - because your opponent chose to specialize against another enemy. Hey, that's their problem.

Something I noticed about corsairs, btw - they don't handle melee very well. Apart from Harlequins or getting a squad of banshees/scorpions, they have no unit that can take on dedicated melee units with good chances of victory.

*although I wouldn't say corsair mech is better than the regular eldar one. Yes, they can field falcons as dedicated transports, but nearly vehicle they have has a 15-point markup due to their BS 4. Eldar vehicles are expensive already, 130 points for vanilla falcons before you add anything on them is a lot.

[Tethylis]

However, he was playing daemons against 8 falcon chassis with holo-fields (3 falcons, 2 night spinners, 3 warp hunters, 2k list).

I generally dont mind and infact quite like facing up against the odd forgeworld unit, but i do realize some of their units and lists can get abit out of hand. Putting aside the fact that the other guy was playing daemons and was at a tourny, your army there looks like is it effectively running with 8HS slots. So long as you don't mind me bringing something like 8 squads of firedragons in my list to even things out then that would be fine. If you do mind then i would have to ask why should it be ok for you to run so many heavy units without giving your opponent something in return to balance them out?

[HRM]

My only beef with FW is that you've gotta be ballin' like Kanye West to afford any of it.

[Hrw-Amen]

I don't get this whole 'I don't know what is in the the other guys codex' thing. I mean why would you want to always know, it is a war game? OK, if you have the means and the ability or know how to get hold of a copy then so be it, chalk it up to good scouting or what ever, if not it is no different than in any countless battles throughout history where one side or another has come up with some new wonder weapon that turns the tide of a battle until the other comes with a way to counter it. That is how war works, so being a war game that is simply more realistic which surely is a good thing? If you still manage to win the battle and did not know what they were bringing or how it worked then obviously you are a much better general and can give yourself a pat on the back.

[Importman]

I love my forgeworld conversions and I love seeing other people's forgeworld stuff. Thing is if you bother to shell out for forgeworld you are, in my opinion, more likely to model and paint your army to a decent standard.

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[AndMyAxe]

As far as I can see it your opponent was whining about losing; just ignore the mind games in a tournament and if you play for fun, don't play him again. If the tourney allowed your army list it was legal. I personally love FW models; I would love them to make large-scale ships set in Warhammer Fantasy but that's just my dream; I can't imagine them doing it.

[Born Again]

Pretty much agree with the general opinion. I don't think FW is any better or worse balanced than what you would get in any other GW product. People like to cry it's broken because they're unfamiliar with it and don't know the rules, therefore they haven't figured out a guaranteed way of beating it. If they can't beat it, obviously it's broken.

I like FW stuff though and have no problem with it whatsoever so long as people have a copy of the rules on hand - the same thing I'd expect people to do with their GW codex.

[greenmtvince]

My only beef with FW is that you've gotta be ballin' like Kanye West to afford any of it.

When I first started buying Forgeworld models in the earlier part of the last decade, I would have agreed with you. Now with GW price hikes, there's usually not much of a difference.

I generally dont mind and infact quite like facing up against the odd forgeworld unit, but i do realize some of their units and lists can get abit out of hand. Putting aside the fact that the other guy was playing daemons and was at a tourny, your army there looks like is it effectively running with 8HS slots. So long as you don't mind me bringing something like 8 squads of firedragons in my list to even things out then that would be fine. If you do mind then i would have to ask why should it be ok for you to run so many heavy units without giving your opponent something in return to balance them out?

I don't think it's any different than a codex eldar player going full mech with Wave Serpents and Fire Prisms/Falcons. Sure he put two Nightspinners in there which thematically is a cool idea, but most corsair players regard these as the weakest of the FA choices we have. In fact, I'd argue that a Codex Eldar list or one with access to some IA units is actually a more competitive list than what TheDoctor ran. I dunno, I feel like most armies these days should bring more than enough at 2000 points to deal with that much AV12.

Hey all, so I took my eldar corsairs to a local tournament yesterday (saturday), and one of my opponents would not shut up about forgeworld being broken. However, he was playing daemons against 8 falcon chassis with holo-fields (3 falcons, 2 night spinners, 3 warp hunters, 2k list). However, at the end of the day, my friend who took regular Eldar took first place, and I placed like 4th or 5th. It was actually my stubborn refusal to give up that turned the final game against grey knights into a draw, allowing my friend to get 1st, and the grey knight guy to only get second.

Congrats on your high finish with Corsairs! I'm surprised you had enough firepower with that list to deal with the amount of stuff most people can throw down at 2k. I certainly felt undergunned 1850 and handicapped without a proper autarch to buff reserve rolls. No, you definitely earned your placement, well, I mean aside from some guy showing up with Daemons and handing you a win.