Points cost formula/system

[megatrons2nd]

Did anyone ever get a system to work? I have one that is stupid simple and seems to work on most troops choices. Of the troops choices that I have ran, that are off, are only off by 1-3 points. Only 3 are off by more than that, 6 for one(gretchin) and 7 for the other two(Genestealers and Hormogaunts). The Gretchin end up in the negative numbers, and the nids lose all those points in the gun(as they don't have one).

I have not figured "upgrades" to a unit yet, and have not yet done jump infantry or bikes.

I use a Base Cost of 5, and the Stats of an Imperial Guard Platoon member with a lasgun. Every point up(except wounds) raises the cost by 1, and every point down lowers the cost by 1. Weapon range is done on every 6" for a point raised or lowered. You multiply the number of wounds with the base cost to get the final cost(for those few multi wound troops choices). There does not appear to be any effect for special rules in the units cost. Case in point The Dark Eldar Kabalite Warriors and Wyches did not work until I removed the 3 points for the non existent weapon Strength, at which point it worked perfectly. Another note I always use the "best" number on a stat ie the 4+ save for the wyches in place of their base 6+.

Please run this to try and break it. Please note it has only been run on troops at this point, other slots probably use different modifiers due to the more specialized nature/needs of those slots.

[LawL LawL]

5pts for Guardsman stat line seems perfectly reasonable. If each increase, barring wounds, was 1pt, you'd have 9pt Guardsmen with WS5 BS5? I'm not sure this is the most balanced system.

In terms of figuring out ONLY stats to points cost balance, you would likely need a graduated system for points cost, increasing exponentially for wounds increase and stat increases in other sections. For example a model with WS5 should not cost X points less than a model with WS5 S5 T5, if X = the aggregate total of the stat differences between the initial S and T values of the base model. Likewise if a model with S4 would cost X+1 point, X being base stat line value, the 1 point being the increase to S4, a model with S5 should not merely be X+2. This would lead to a very confusing system of cross-checking, I presume, where you would end up with something like, +1 WS = +2pts, if same model also has +1 S, cost of +1 WS = +4pts, if that same model has +1 T as well, total cost of the +1 WS = 6pts. So on and so forth, this would produce a time-consuming and likely still flawed system for stat-line creation.

The only feasible (for lack of a better word) way I can see this kind of template for unit-creation would be fair and balanced were a very complex and all-encompassing set of piecewise linear functions, with separate functions for multiple stat increases.

I think over all though, this is simply impractical. If you *really* want to create your own troops, envision a stat-line, and write it out, then check existing units in the game to find the closest. Work your way from there, and be reasonable with points increase/decrease for stat changes. Ultimately a balanced stat-line, unit entry, or even a whole army-book is never truly balanced until as many people as can be found can unanimously agree on its balance. What one person, namely the writer, thinks is balanced, there will always be those who disagree. The biggest obstacle to this is if the creator's intent was... oh for example "Well lets make an army list where the whole army has force weapons, storm bolters, psychic powers, S7 Assault Cannons, and the option for +1 S on any standard ranged weapon for dirt-cheap points costs. Now lets put this template onto existing Space Marine terminators and make them Troops choices, as I like the idea of an army employing hordes of heavily armoured bad-asses. Oh and we'll throw in psychically inclined vehicles, and magical speed-enhancing halberds into the mix, just for kicks."

Any similarities you spot in my example, I assure you, are solely coincidental...

[megatrons2nd]

You missed a bit of what I said. This system actually gets points for units at what they cost. A marine comes to 16 pts under this system, a Tyranid Warrior comes to 33 of the 30 GW sets them at. Guard 5, Tau Fire Warriors 9, Kroot 8, Ork Boys 6, Dire Avengers 14, Eldar Guardian 8, Kabalite warrior 9, Wyche 10 Necron Warrior 15, Immortal 18. Yes some are off, which may come from GW point fidgeting, but it works on troops. I have not had time to figure movement for fast troops choices yet.

[lanrak]

The reason your PV are about right is because 25 years ago, in RT GW did use a PV calculation.
It was not very good or accurate.
But rather than develop it to achive aceptable levels of accuracy, they just threw a load of special rules into the game to make accurate PV allocation practicaly impossible and gave up on the idea.
(If you look at Armies Of Arcana , you can see the sort of PV allocation calculation they could have ended up with.)

Now they can simply put subjective PV on ANY unit and say its what they think they are worth.And no -one can prove they are wrong....as they no longer have to prove they are right.They want us to just accept they got it good enough.