Hey guys, I am trying to gather some informations about Marienburg. I know that recently it is not part of the empire anymore, would that mean that they can't have access to the college of magic, the empire gunnery, and other knights orders? How about sigmar priest?
If you guys know where I could find lots of details regarding marienburg, let me know.
Ps: I ordered 'a murder in marienburg' and 'a massacre in marienburg'
They would have no direct claim on any Imperial resources. But then again, I'm not sure Imperial nobles have much luck rocking up at the collages and demanding a handful of mages for whatever they have in mind. It doesn't really work like that. The various Imperial institutions are there to support the Imperial army and the Empire at large. However, you can certainly hire any specialist you might want. That would be the case for most wiards, master engineers, etc. you see on a battlefield anyway. They would be employed by the nobleman commanding the army and Marienburg got lots of money, lots and lots of money. They bought their independence and are one of the trade hubs of the Old World so you would certainly be able to find all of those specialists in their mercenary armies. I would also imagine that at least some knightly orders have chapter houses in the city and if not armoured knights are really just a question of having the funds to equip and train them. So the Marienburg ones might not have the same noble pedigree as some of the Imperial Orders, but there will certainly be battle-hardened knights available.
Sigmar priests is a more interesting question. They should be present, although I imagine it's more a case of them being tolerated than them being the political powerhouse they are in the Empire. The merchant princes running the show probably don't want some priest to turn up and think he can dictate their actions, but religion is powerful in Warhammer so there will be priests. And don't forget the other gods either. Handrich being the big one, but Manann and Ranald should also have sizeable congregations and the whole pantheon will be worshipped to some extend.
Last edited by Gorbad Ironclaw; 29-04-2012 at 07:33.
Then Marienburg: Sold Down the River from WFRP 1st ed. is a must have for you, as it is really great in regard to Marienburg background. Maybe also Dying of the Light, which is a WFRP 1st ed. scenario playing partly in Marienburg and the surrounding Wasteland.Originally Posted by Shyvax
As a novel I would highly recommend Mark of Damnation, which plays also partly in Marienburg and even mentions a few things that happened at the end of Dying of the Light. The author of Mark of Damnation, James Wallis, was also co-author of Marienburg: Sold Down the River by the way.
If you can somehow get hold of a copy of issue 9 of the independent WFRP magazine Warpstone, purchse it as well, as it has some nice further in depth information about the city and its inhabitants.
Sigmar is considered a minor cult in Marienburg (the major ones are Manann, Haendryk, Verena, Shallya and Ranald and the minor ones are Sigmar, Solkan, Morr, Olovald, Ulric and Myrmidia) as the emphasis of Imperial unity is unattractive for the independent Wastelanders.
The cult even split after Marienburgs secession into an orthodox part loyal to the Empire and the Grand Theogonist and a reformed part sanctioned and loyal to the Stadsraad. The Grand Theogonist refused to recognize the latter one, declaring the seat of the arch-lector vacant.
Anyway, in spite of their political, theological and doctrinal differences, priests of both sects can cast spells (acording to WFRP 2nd ed.).
Marienburg normally does not have access to the Colleges of Magic in Altdorf, though they have their own College of Navigation and Sea Magicks where non-Imperial spell casters are educated (most probably in the Winds of Azyr and (to a lesser degree) Ulgu).
Marienburg in my mind is heavily influenced by the Netherlands in the 16th century, when it was a major naval and trading power in the world, in much the same position on the map as Marienburg.
One thing that could be very cool, although maybe not the best unit in the game are something based on V.O.C. mercenaries. The VOC (Vereenigde Oost-Indische Compagnie, Dutch East India Co.) was the first world corporation but they had massive merc. armies going out into the world. The soldiers were tied into a contract with them. Each had a gun, a backpack with supplies and a sword or bayonet. I've seen the uniform in museums (blue and white), the guns are extremely heavy looking. Anyways basically a very elite handgunner unit and I think a contracted warrior protecting trade would fit perfectly.
Chaos Daemons 40K 6th Edition: W = 2, L = 3, D = 0.
Marienburg allows for a degree of cultural diversity as well, there is an "elf quarter" where the trading houses of Ulthuan live, so it would be themed to take an elf wizard to represent your battle wizard if you didn't want a human wizard.
Its interesting that you mention the VOC as I based my Marienburg army on the GWIC, the Dutch West India company
Last edited by Spiney Norman; 01-05-2012 at 09:50.
any argument to say that they're thinking of us by turning metal to resin is as convincing as a frenzied Khorne worshipper covered in blood, still chomping on a victim, with a Khorne sigil tattooed to his forhead pleading a case of mistaken identity when questioned about a murder.
I thought it was inspired by the free trade cities within the Hanseatic league given semi autonomy by the Holy Roman emperor. More specifically Hamburg which seems to fit the geography. Could ofcourse be inspired by all the trade cities on the north sea coast.
For Sigmarites in Marienburg, remember that the last grand theogonist (Johann Esmer) fled after Volkmar sent thugs to rough him up. An interesting tack to take would be Esmer's men taking to the field to fight against the heretics that support the false theogonist. Considering that Volkmar was killed and resurrected by daemons, there might even be a hint of truth in such an argument.
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@TheDungen Cool idea but the hanseatic league doens't fit in with the warhammer world in my very own humble opinion. Reason being it was a trade network on the baltic between the northern german cities and the nordic cities and territories. The nordic territories equivalent in warhammer is currently filled with blood thirsty chaos worshipping savages, so the possibility of formalised trade agreements and semi rule from an imperial town is extremely unlikely. There are still tradesmen from the Northmen of course, but these are rare and its is certainly not formalised.
Another reason is that the Hanseatic league made most of its money from selling fish caught in the baltic, which was salted and then sold to various catholic towns in germany and below, since catholics could only have fish on fridays. Whilst they did trade in amber and furs, this was the main driving force. Unless Sigmar specifically has some rules about what to eat and when, then I don't see there being a huge need for fish in the southern imperial states. Sorry for being a know it all, just finished a large serious of lectures on the Hanseatic League, its very interesting.
Lastly, if you read the lovely map someone posted up above (I think its from lexicanum) it shows you the city districts of Marienburg. The names are very very dutch in style even if they are probably made up nonsense like the Imperial names, but dutch nonetheless. Even the character names you can find are Dutch rather than German, with van instead of von. Again I speak Dutch so this seems obvious to me
Chaos Daemons 40K 6th Edition: W = 2, L = 3, D = 0.
Eh the main money maker for the hansiatic league was selling salt from the salt mines in germany in the other countires aroudn the baltic sea.
and sure there's alot of trade with norsca when they arent killing each other. warhammer amries Hordes of chaos has a marienburger trader visiting norsca.
Marienburg is not a dutch sounding name its a german sounding name. in fact there is a marienburg in poland which used to belong to the teutonic order, who were german. I dont remember ever hearing any burg cities in the neatherlands. and you have to remember the Hansiatic states didnt speak german they spoke platt (Plattdüütsch) which is very similiar to dutch (I remember when i was a kid and we went to amsterdam my mom used to speak platt to them and they answered in dutch and while it didnt work perfect it didnt work bad either)
My guess as I said is that Marienburg is all those cities Hamburg, Bremen, Amsterdam, Rotterdam, Brügges and so on.
But the name and the fact that it used to be part of the empire points towards Hamburg. The only holy Roman emperor I know to have ruled the Netherlands were Charlemagne and if that was the intention it'd say that Sigmar gave Marienburg freedom (Cause that he is Charlemagne is pretty obvious).
Last edited by TheDungen; 10-05-2012 at 06:37.
Guess its personal preference then, for me its the Netherlands, for you the Hanseatic League. It has elements of both I guess. The city name is misleading since it is more Germanic sounding (although there is a Heidelberg in the Netherlands) but the city districts are very very dutch. http://whfb.lexicanum.com/wiki/Marienburg just read the names there on that map
Just checked too, one of the areas is called Winkelmarkt, which is Dutchesque for Shop Market.
Chaos Daemons 40K 6th Edition: W = 2, L = 3, D = 0.
Aside from the city's name everything about Marienburg is very Dutch, the names of all the districts, the names of significant characters etc. At the end of the day the warhammer world I'd not the real world, it loosely parallels the real world and as such there are more than a few differences.
any argument to say that they're thinking of us by turning metal to resin is as convincing as a frenzied Khorne worshipper covered in blood, still chomping on a victim, with a Khorne sigil tattooed to his forhead pleading a case of mistaken identity when questioned about a murder.
Yeah last time I was in Holland people didn't ride griffons around =P
Chaos Daemons 40K 6th Edition: W = 2, L = 3, D = 0.
Yeah last time I was in Holland people didn't ride griffons around =P
Chaos Daemons 40K 6th Edition: W = 2, L = 3, D = 0.
Charles V of the Habsburgs family ruled it as well. It then passed to Philip II after Charles divided the inheritance.
I am no expert on Dutch/German history but sounds like Marienburg is an amalgamation. Much like Brettonia is an amalgamation of Britain and France.
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Marienburg looks a lot like the modern harbour of Rotterdam, or the city of Amsterdam with all those canals.
Also check the article in the lexicanum from that book.
The 'Vloedmuur' aka Floodwall, is an obvious comparison with Dutch Dikes and other works (Afsluitdijk, Zeewering).
Also all the names
The whole replacement of the second Imperial Fleet with a merchant one just feel a lot like the old VOC, Vereenigde Oostindische Companie (United Eastindia Company).
Then there are the names of the nobles which are pretty bad Dutch ones.
Last edited by Artinam; 10-05-2012 at 11:39.
Bretonnians ARE NOT a pure Knightly army.
Half the army choices consist out of Peasants and Damsels.
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My guess is that the guy who first wrote in marienburg on the map though Hamburg, the guy who added detail to it thought Amsterdam. and well as said Brettonia is mix of France and Britain, the high elves are a mix of Greeks and Romans, and so on, I still think they've taken what they wanted from the different trade cities in Europe and added it to Marienburg, making it even more cosmopolitan than the cities that inspired it (which is quite the achievement).
Its position on the sides of a river makes it less like Amsterdam and more like Hamburg or Rotterdam, but neither of those cities are on islands in the river like marienburg, which fits better with Amsterdam. so as said a mix.
Last edited by TheDungen; 10-05-2012 at 11:45.
These guys have done a lot of research into Marienburg: http://libermalefic.blogspot.co.uk
In the latest post there are references to a couple of BL stories with info on the place you might want to check out.
Josh Reynolds was signing. I had intended to visit him if only to praise the colourful short story 'Dead Calm' which appeared in Hammer & Bolter. I checked it out for research purposes when someone mentioned it was set in Marienburg. The story was especially evocative because it features a number of the factions featuring in 'Mutiny in Marienburg'. There was a stack of inspiring content in the tale which I'd wanted to thank Josh for delivering.After snatching the exceptional 'Dead Winter' (latest Time of Legends release - buy it!) I picked up a copy of 'Knight of the Blazing Sun' from the Bazaar of Books because it features pirates and Norse savages (my kind of people). This is the novel I'm currently devouing! Low and behold the setting as of chapter three is destined to be Marienburg! With any luck I'm on the trail of the latest intrigue surrounding conspiratorial parties at large in the City of Secret Deals. Another grand fact-finding mission for our tabletop campaign so thank you again Mr Reynolds.
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Marienburg is an amalgam of Dutch cities: I think Anthony Ragan (the author of Sold Down the River) once mentioned both Amsterdam and Rotterdam were used as inspiration, along with Venice.
The short of it regarding Marienburg is that they're wealthy and when you're wealthy you can buy whatever you want. Including pet wizards and artillery.
IMO......I always envisioned MArienburg as the Austrian Netherlands......
As their history closely resembles it......
You know...former imperial province....given up in one shape or the other....
Just take 16th century Netherlands...mix in Venetian republic and bang there you go.....
I also wouldn't be surprised if Marienburg had a stadholden as their ruler....
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