2500 Prison-World Desert Guard

[WarHammerman]

40K Army: Imperial Guard

2500 points

command:
Company Command
Company Command Squad
Vox-Caster
Lord Castellan Creed
Colur Sergeant Kell
Ministorum Priests
2 Ministorum Priests
2 Eviscerators
Techpriest
1 Techpriest Engineseer

troops:
Platoon 1
Company Command Squad
Vox-Caster
Flamer x3
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Flamer
Missile Launcher Team
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Flamer
Missile Launcher Team

Platoon 2
Company Command Squad
Vox-Caster
Sniper Rifle
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Lascannon Team
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Lascannon Team

Platoon 3
Company Command Squad
Vox-Caster
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster

Penal Legion Squads
Penal Legion Squad
Penal Legion Squad

fast attack:
Vendetta Squad 1
1 Vendetta
Sponson Heavy Bolters

Vendetta Squad 2
1 Vendetta
Sponson Heavy Bolters

Hellhound Squad
1 Devil Dog
Heavy Bolter replaced with Heavy Flamer
Hunter Killer Missile
Dozer Blade
Extra Armor
1 Bane Wolf
Heavy Bolter replaced with Heavy Flamer
Hunter Killer Missile
Dozer Blade
Extra Armor

heavy support:
Leman Russ Squadron
Leman Russ Exterminator
Leman Russ Eradicator
Leman Russ Punisher
Sponson Multi-Meltas
Dozer Blade
Extra Armor

Ordinance Battery 1
Basilisk

Ordinance Barrery 2
Medusa
Bastion-Breacher Shells


The idea behind this is to be able to have a lot of mobility, while being able to pick off targets. The air-units are there to pick up and move troops around, and can clear off a landing zone.

The Basilisk and Meduse are there for back field support, to shell things.

Named HQ have a lot of boosts for the troops, and can multiply forces.

The Techpriest is there to help with vehicles.




Sorry for the funky formatting, but this is how I keep things strait.

Anyway - new to IG, and would love some feedback, advice, tactics, anything constructive ya wanna tell me!

Thanks!
- Hammerman

[wartorngetahroun74]

in squadrons drop the extra armour. vehicles in squads dont need it

[Bunnahabhain]

The formatting makes it impossible to read. There is no reason you can't put a unit on a single line, i.e.
This:
Hellhound Squad
1 Devil Dog
Heavy Bolter replaced with Heavy Flamer
Hunter Killer Missile
Dozer Blade
Extra Armor
1 Bane Wolf
Heavy Bolter replaced with Heavy Flamer
Hunter Killer Missile
Dozer Blade
Extra Armor
Becomes
Devil dog + Banewolf, both with heavy flamer, hunter killer, dozer blade and extra armour

Secondly, it is awful. You have far, far, far too many upgrades and nowhere near enough units
My comments in italics

command:
Company Command
Company Command Squad
Vox-Caster
Lord Castellan Creed
Colur Sergeant Kell
Very expensive unit to command very few units. You're wasting about 200pts here

Ministorum Priests
2 Ministorum Priests
2 Eviscerators
Techpriest
1 Techpriest Engineseer
All aweful, and only to be taken for fluff reasons. They don't work at an even semi-competitive level.

troops:
Platoon 1
Company Command Squad
Vox-Caster
Flamer x3
fine
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Flamer
Missile Launcher Team
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Flamer
Missile Launcher Team
Badly mixed load out. Missile launchers not great choices.

Platoon 2
Company Command Squad
Vox-Caster
Sniper Rifle
snipers belong on ratlings or nowhere
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Lascannon Team
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Lascannon Team
Seriously expensive BS3 lascannons. Some low AP special weapons would be useful here

Platoon 3
Company Command Squad
Vox-Caster
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Infantry Squad
Vox-Caster
Naked infantry utterly pointless

Penal Legion Squads
Penal Legion Squad
Penal Legion Squad
OK. Three of them are probably overkill, as they work to support other units, and you don't have enough of them for three to support...

fast attack:
Vendetta Squad 1
1 Vendetta
Sponson Heavy Bolters

Vendetta Squad 2
1 Vendetta
Sponson Heavy Bolters
Fine

Hellhound Squad
1 Devil Dog
Heavy Bolter replaced with Heavy Flamer
Hunter Killer Missile
Dozer Blade
Extra Armor
1 Bane Wolf
Heavy Bolter replaced with Heavy Flamer
Hunter Killer Missile
Dozer Blade
Extra Armor
Aweful. Don't mix the squadron like this, and you don't need ANY of the upgrades. Extra armour does nothing for squadrons.

heavy support:
Leman Russ Squadron
Leman Russ Exterminator
Leman Russ Eradicator
Leman Russ Punisher
Sponson Multi-Meltas
Dozer Blade
Extra Armor
Even worse than above. The squadron is horribly mixed in role, the multi meltas are pricey and don't fit the turret weapons, and the dozer blades /extra armour are pointless

Ordinance Battery 1
Basilisk
OK
Ordinance Barrery 2
Medusa
Bastion-Breacher Shells
OK

A well built 1500-1750 pt list could handle this list. You waste ~1000 pts on useless rubbish. You have no effective transports, nowhere near enough firepower or scoring units, no CC ability and little mobility

Scarp this list, and start again. Come have a look at the Tactica Imperial Guard before you try version two.

In a few lines. The only upgrades worth taking are more units, more transports, and more guns, that make the unit better at doing ONE job. Don't ( as a new to the army) player try and get a unit to do several jobs at once, it is highly unlikly to work. You can normally get two dedicated units, one to do each job well for the price of the one mixed one...

I know this sounds very harsh, but it is true. The expereinced guard players round here will agree with 95%+ of it...

[darklordzoul]

not ideal ill post my thought like this since dont know how to do crazy qoute thing.

HQ
creed fine i normally use straken cause he doubles all combat potentional in 12" but either works. drop priest thats why you switch to straken or have t"for the honor of cadia" dont double spend. tech not a independent character cant join unit so will get picked out personnaly i love mine but been told a sub par unit, but need servitors if going to use them.

Elite
none? no marbo? if kept even one priest would get him ogryns only viable way for both units mounted of course less you want a giant expensive tarpit.

Troops
plt1- change to motor/grenade
plt2- change las to auto/gren
plr3- melta
pls1-3 dont need them all i read the fluff and get it put you might want to start small and try them i used them some never again.

Fast
lose heavy bolters you lose mobility make sure you avoid stupid one shot things or you will have wasted turns with this model
split them use both hell hounds point out how cool they are start of game watch opponant panic plus poion one is not a ranged shot it is a templated turret weapon your gaurd shoot far shoot as much as you can.

Heavy
split them at least seen sponsons work aginst me was team tourney bro ran dual land raiders i ran 4 chimera 2 battle tank so it was the bane of us but match roles on them bolters/plamsa(or heavy forget which one that is)/keep melta if want respectively

so just few changes make it better sure others can do better but will help you over a new list keep trying start small work up find out what works for you but my two sense douces

[WarHammerman]

Okay, so I looked over a lot of advice - and updated this list (A LOT)

Please, let me know what you think.

2499 / 2500
(yes, I /could/ add a Searchlight, but I won't)

Company Command:
Color Sergant Krell
Lord Castellan Creed
x2 Bodyguard
Officer of the Fleet
Techpriest Enginseer
+ 5 Servitors
In a Chimera (w/ Multi-Laser)
(The idea here is that they move to where best issue orders, and if not needed then the Techpriest can use his repair skills where needed. Usually on the Chimera they're in)

Hellhound Squadron:
x2 Devil Dogs w/ Multi-Melta
(to Hunt and Kill tanks)

Leman Russ Squadron:
x2 Leman Russ Punisher w/ Heavy Bolter Sponsons & Heavy Stubber
(Once the Devil Dogs have cracked the tanks open, they can kill the gooey insides with a metric ton of shots)

Ordinance Battery:
Basilisk

Ordinance Battery:
Medusa

x2 Penal Legion Squad
w/ Ministorum Priest w/ Eviscerator
(to be "problem solvers" - a bunch of attacks, lead by a better guy w/ an Evicerator in case a tank decides to be bothersome)

Veteran Squad
(Granted Scout by Creed)
Vox Casters, Shotguns, 1 Flamer, 1 Grenade Launcher, 1 Meltagun, 1 Autocannon
Sergeant Bastonne
+ inside a Vendetta w/ 2 Heavy Bolter Sponsons
(the idea here is these guys go where needed, quickly, and can deal with a variety of problems w/ their gear)

Infantry Platoon
* Command:
Med-Pack, Vox-Caster, HWT w/ Lascannon
Commander Chenkov
* Infantry Squad(s) (Blobbed)
Vox Casters, x2 Grenade Launchers, HWT w/ Missile Launchers
x2 Sergeant w/ Bolt Pistols & CCW
(The idea is that w/ Grenades and Missiles they have some choice in what they can kill well.)

* Conscripts Squad
x30 Conscripts w/ "Send in the Next Wave"

[Bunnahabhain]

OK, it is better, but still far from good.

You command squad is still very expensive, and designed to lead a huge number of men, which you don't have.

The tech priest is awful- you simply get very few results he can fix. You are better off buying another vehicles or squad instead. The only reasons to take them are 1) fluff, or 2) to stand behind a super heavy, as those are worth fixing.

Devil dog squadron is OK. Not cheap, but it works at least.
Same for the ordnance you've picked

The LR punisher is awful, avoid. If you want to try killing with loads of shots, go for the LR exterminator, which is cheaper, has a 12" longer range, and does a decent job against light vehicles too.

The penal legion are set up very oddly. They have scout, and you give them an overpriced useless thing that takes it away? The priest is not worth using, other than for theme. Remember you can't blob them.

The veterans are awful as well. Your weapon load out is hopelessly mixed, so they can't do any job well, they are a mobile unit, so the autocannon is useless, Bastonne is badly overpriced and not needed at all if you have Creed for 24" orders anyway. Why no vox? Finally, giving them scout from Creed as not needed, as they can scout/outflank in the vendetta anyway!

PCS. Poor. Very expensive, mainly thanks to that special character. He provides a stubborn bubble which is very useful if you stuff it with troops, more troops than you have. It's a lso a pricey BS3 lascannon
The blob squad is passable. Weapons choice is OK. Why you have two squads, blobbed, with no commissar, is beyond me. If you know you're bloobing, only one vox needed.

Conscripts with or without SitNW are very poor.
---------------------------------------
All in all, you seem to not understand how the rules interact with each other, and have very high expectations of some units... You have spent ~350 pts on 4 special characters to buff infantry, but have only spent about that much on the infantry themselves! Fore reference, competitive lists tend to use none of these guys, and a typical list by an experienced Guard player wanting to make best use of them, I'd guesstimate from mine and other lists that you'll probably spend ~ 6 times as much on the infantry as you will on the buffs for the infantry. So for Strakern, you'd be on around 550-600 pts of infantry for him to buff. For Al rahmen, you'd be on about 400pts of infantry for him to outflank.

You would be much better off with dumping the special characters to get many more infantry, or dumping the tanks to give the characters enough infantry to make it worth spending that much on buffs.

You have a lot of units ( XXX) that you won't find in tournament Guard armies. I'm not saying don't take unit XXX, I'm saying if you want unit XXX to work:
You'll want to support it with A, B, and C
or
Tweak the set up of it slightly
or
Simply not expect it to do much, so it can easily meet or exceed expectations.

[WarHammerman]

Okay, I did some reading, educated myself more, and then did some re-tooling how does this sound?

Keep in mind, I'm always open to suggestion.

2500/2500

HQ:
Company Command Squad
Carapace Armour, Medi-Pack, Vox-Caster
Kell, Creed, x2 Bodyguards
+ Chimera w/ Camo Netting
(The idea here is to keep this squad alive a bit longer. Pop smoke, and the netting helps even more. Bodyguards and carapace help too - and who doesn't love Feel No Pain?)

Elite:
Marbo
(Fits theme, and is quite handy from time to time)

Troop:
x2 Penal Legion Squad
(march forward and kill what needs killin')

Veteran Squad
Demolitions + Grenadiers Docterines
Vox Caster, 3 Plasma Guns
Sarge w/ Plasma Pistol + Power Weapon
+ Inside the Vendetta
(I gave them a more dedicated focus - now they are "Trouble Shooters" find the biggest threat, and try to take it out. Usually get some support from Marbo.)

Infantry Platoon
*Command:
Medi-Pack, Vox Caster, 2 Melta Gun
Commissar w/ Plasma Pistol, Power Weapon
Commander Chenkov

*Infantry Squads x5
Grenade Launcher
Sarge w/ Bolt Pistol
All 5 the same, save that 1 has a Vox Caster.
Blobbed

*Heavy Weapons Squad w/ x3 Lascannon

*Heavy Weapons Squad w/ x3 Missile Launchers
(I was told I needed more guys for this to work - so I gave myself MANY more guys.)

Fast Attack:
Vendetta Gunship:
w/ Heavy Bolter Sponsons
(for the Veterans to gain Scout or Outflank)

Hellhound Squad
x2 Devil Dogs w/ Multi-Melta
(Tank Hunters. Quick and deadly)

Heavy Support:
Leman Russ Squadron:
x2 Lemon Russ Exterminators w/ Heavy Bolter Sponsons
(Anti-troops, used to kill whatever the Devil Dogs crack out of their shells)

Ordnance Battery
Medusa w/ Bastion-Breacher Shells

Ordnance Battery
Basilisk


Well, there you have it. A few quick, smart units and a very large blob of guys to fire a fusillade of fire onto my enemies.

I hope this has been improved over other drafts- I'd hate to think I went backwards.

As always, appreciate any advice you'd want to give me.

[Bunnahabhain]

Okay, I did some reading, educated myself more, and then did some re-tooling how does this sound?
Keep in mind, I'm always open to suggestion.

Big improvement

HQ:
Company Command Squad
Carapace Armour, Medi-Pack, Vox-Caster
Kell, Creed, x2 Bodyguards
+ Chimera w/ Camo Netting
(The idea here is to keep this squad alive a bit longer. Pop smoke, and the netting helps even more. Bodyguards and carapace help too - and who doesn't love Feel No Pain?)
Keeping the squad alive is a good plan. However, as far as I can tell, the role of this squad is simply to issue orders. Can I suggest an alternative?
CCS, Master of ordnance, Vox, flag, chimera
and
CCS, Master of ordnance, Vox, flag, chimera
and
~100pt left over spare ( we'll save those for later...)
---you'll find two squads are much harder to kill than one with bling

Elite:
Marbo
(Fits theme, and is quite handy from time to time)
He just works.

Troop:
x2 Penal Legion Squad
(march forward and kill what needs killin')
Nice support units. They do want to be used as support units though.

Veteran Squad
Demolitions + Grenadiers Docterines
Vox Caster, 3 Plasma Guns
Sarge w/ Plasma Pistol + Power Weapon
+ Inside the Vendetta
(I gave them a more dedicated focus - now they are "Trouble Shooters" find the biggest threat, and try to take it out. Usually get some support from Marbo.)
Seriously expensive though. That squad is 330 pts with the transport. Again, I'll suggest an alternative.
veterans, 3 plasma guns, plasma pistol-125
Veterans, 3 meltas-100
+ 2 chimeras-110- = 335 in total


Infantry Platoon
*Command:
Medi-Pack, Vox Caster, 2 Melta Gun
Commissar w/ Plasma Pistol, Power Weapon
Commander Chenkov
Seriously expensive unit again. it's 150 pts+. You don't want to put the commisar in this squad, you want them in the blob. With the amount of Ld your CCS provides, you can drop this down to being a cheap special weapon toting unit, and save yourself loads of points. Also, plasma pistols on commisars are a good way for them to kill themselves at the worst possible moment

*Infantry Squads x5
Grenade Launcher
Sarge w/ Bolt Pistol
All 5 the same, save that 1 has a Vox Caster.
Blobbed
The blob is too big- 50 men are really awkward. drop it to 30 ( with the commissar from the PCS moved to here) and have the remaining 20 as two screening squads


*Heavy Weapons Squad w/ x3 Lascannon
*Heavy Weapons Squad w/ x3 Missile Launchers
I'd turn both of these into autocannon units- you have lots of heavy anti tank, but little anti medium armour... It also saves you enough points for a second PCS with cheap special weapons- something like a 4 flamer scoring surprise to go in the vendetta. I'd also throw the ~100pts spare from the CCS into more infantry for the platoon.
(I was told I needed more guys for this to work - so I gave myself MANY more guys.)

You still only have about 100 from your list...

Fast Attack:
Vendetta Gunship:
w/ Heavy Bolter Sponsons
(for the Veterans to gain Scout or Outflank)
Fine choice. I'd not bother with the Sponsons.

Hellhound Squad
x2 Devil Dogs w/ Multi-Melta
(Tank Hunters. Quick and deadly)
'd drop one, to get the vendetta back. Also, if you keep both ( say, by using the ~100pts spare from above) I'd split the squadron into two singles

Heavy Support:
Leman Russ Squadron: x2 Lemon Russ Exterminators w/ Heavy Bolter Sponsons
(Anti-troops, used to kill whatever the Devil Dogs crack out of their shells)
Medusa w/ Bastion-Breacher Shells
Basilisk
All fine

In general, I've made stuff less equipped, and so found much, much, much more of it. You'll notice the less upgraded a unit is, the fewer changes I've suggested!

[WarHammerman]

Okay so - here is the latest draft. Dropped the prisoners - and the prison theme.

I trimmed out a lot of specialty things - and re-focused.

So here is what I got
(2500 / 2500)

CCS:
Carapace, Vox, 2 Plasma Guns
Kell & Kreed
+ Chimera

x3 Scout Sentinels w/ Autoncannon

Vendetta

x2 Devil Dogs w/ Multi-Melta

x2 Leman Russ Battle Tanks

Basilisk

Medusa w/ Bastion-Breacher

Marbo

Veterans
Demolitions, Vox, x3 Melta Gun & Harker

Infantry Platoon #1
PCS: Vox, 3 Plasma Guns + Commander w/ Plasma Pistol
*IS: Vox, Plasma, Sarge w/ Plasma Pistol, Commissar
*IS: Plasma Gun, Sarge w/ Plasma Pistol
*IS: Plasma Gun, Sarge w/ Plasma Pistol
(all Blobbed + Scout from Creed)
SWS: x3 Plasmagun

Infantry Platoon #2
PCS: Vox, x3 Grenade Launcher
*IS: Vox, Grenade Launcher + HWT: ML, Commissar
*IS: Grenade Launcher + HWT: ML
*IS: Grenade Launcher + HWT: ML
(all Blobbed)
HWS: x3 Missile Launcher

I think this is coming together quite well. What do you think?

[WarHammerman]

Okay, took a long hard look at things - and now I've got what I know is a better list then where I started.

Feedback always welcome =D
- And I know that Orders are not to be counted on, but they are very helpful. That's why I'm keeping the Vox-Boxes (so far).


Company Command Squad
Vox Caster, x3 Grenade Launchers
Astropath, Commander
+ Chimera
(Metal Box to keep them safe, and if they get out then they can add to the template death. Place this between the two infantry blobs to give commands. Astropath added cause of all the scouts/deepstrike)

Scout Sentinel Squadron
x2 Scout Sentinels w/ Lascannons & Smoke
(Anti-tank killers from Outflanking.
Smoke there to add a layer of protection getting from point A to point B)

Vendetta Gunship Squad
x2 Vendetta
(Outflank or DeepStrike. The Veterans are in here. Either they can be dropped off along the way to kill tanks, or assist in the assassination of a land-raider or other vehicle, and its passengers.)

Hellhound Squadron
x2 Devil Dogs w/ Multi-melta & Smoke
(beefier anti-tank. Fast and those templates are so nice)

Leman Russ Squad
x2 Leman Russ Battle Tank
(Template Joy. Ordinance. Wont be moving much, but I have an idea...)

Ordnance Battery
Medusa w/ Bastion-Breacher Rounds
(more Template fun. S10 AP1, whats not to love?)

Hydra Flank Battery
x2 Hydra Flank Tanks
(72" range- very fun guns. However, they are fragile - so I'm gunna use the Leman Russ as protection)

Marbo
(who doesn't like Marbo? Plus his 1" infiltrate will be spectacular.)

x2 Veteran Squad
x3 Meltagun (Ea)
(Carried in the Vends. Melta's are fun- tank murder, or even heavy armor melting.)

x2 Infantry Platoon
PCS: Vox, x3 Grenade Launcher
+ Chimera
(Keep the leaders in a metal box too.)
*IS: Vox, Grenade Launcher + HWT: ML, Commissar
*IS: Grenade Launcher + HWT: ML
*IS: Grenade Launcher + HWT: ML
(all Blobbed)
HWS: x3 Mortar
(Mortars keep the cost down, and still have the delicious templates.)

[agurus1]

Dunno if you still want to go with the penal thing but I thought this might work: only 1750 so you have room to fit in things you might like.

HQ:
CCS: Straken, 2x melta, medic, carapace (warden with body guard and medical officer)

Lord Commissar: fist, carapace (head overseer, in charge of keeping the penal units moving and inspiring the men)

Elites:
Marbo (the worst of the worst, probably a serial killer lol)

Troops:
4x penal legion (represent a horde of the least disciplined inmates, keep close to straken to benefit from his FC and CA bubble)

Infantry Platoon: (the most recent additions to the penal legion, still retaining some of their training and organization).
PCS: 3x meltas, vox
IS: commissar, grenade launcher, autocannon, vox
2x IS: grenade launcher, autocannon

2x Vet Squad: shotguns, 3x plasma in chimeras (represent fast moving overseer squads with access to higher end weapons)

Fast Attack:

2x hellhounds with extra armour (made sense for both "controlling" large numbers of inmates, and being pressed into service)

Sentinels: 3x sentinels with autocannon (worker sentinels hastily fitted with weapons)

[WarHammerman]

Okay, as usual I took this to the workbench and tried to suss things out.

As I worked on this, the more I liked the idea of the mobility of outflanking and the usefulness. So I've now gone hole-hog for it.

I've got my tactics listed below.

HQ: (1/2)
Company Command Squad
x4 Grenade Launchers
Company Commander, Astropath
+ Chimera

Fast Attack: (3/3)
Scout Sentinel Squadron
x2 Scout Sentinels w/ Autocannons

Vendetta Gunship Squadron
x2 Vendetta

Hellhound Squadron
x2 Devil Dogs w/ Multi-Melta

Heavy Support: (3/3)
Leman Russ Squadron
x2 Leman Russ Battle Tanks w/ Lascannon

Hydra Flak Rank Battery
x2 Hydra Flak Tanks

Ordnance Battery
Medusa w/ Bastion Breacher Shells

Elite: (1/3)
Guardsman Marbo

Troops: (5/6)
x2 Veteran Squads
(each) x3 Melta Guns

x2 Infantry Platoon (identical)
* Platoon Command Squads
x4 Grenade Launchers
Platoon Commander
+ Chimera
* x3 Infantry Squads (Combat Squad)
(each) Grenade Launcher
x1 Commissar

Infantry Platoon
Platoon Command Squad
x4 Laspistol/CCW
Captain Al'Rahem

x2 Infantry Squad
w/ Grenade Launcher & Missile Launcher


Okay so here is the tactics:


Outflank with the Vendettas (which are holding the Veterans), Scout Sententials, and the platoon that must. Also Marbo- less not forget Marbo.

Get the two blobbed platoons flanking the three command chimeras. The tanks can protect the order-giving astropathing cargo within - and still offer up some more grenade shots.
Get the artillery pieces to safe places on the board so they can do their things - and use the Devil Dogs and Leman Russ as they are meant to do.

So- the platoons move up slow and steady, and shoot down anything in their way. The chimeras helping in that regard too.

Now, I know I should avoid close-combat, but with Rashid he seems at least somewhat competent at it - so I geared his command squad to be CC as well (dual weapons, FNP).

His infantry are not blobbed, and they would be the target of his "Like the Wind" - allowing the heavy weapons to be fired, and still they can move. So this keeps mobility up to par with the blobs.


Okay, there it is.
As always, comments and questions welcome.

Thank you.
- Hammerman